How would you feel about your 18 year old doing Camp America at the moment?

[HouseontheLeft]

Normally I'd be delighted for any young adult to do Camp America; my sister and my DH each did it when they were teens and had fantastic experiences. It's a great opportunity to go abroad, earn some money, meet people from all over the world, and develop skills.

But with the US in the current political state it is, would you be happy sending your 18 year old over there for summer 2027? It's nine weeks plus potential travel time around the country afterwards, and my concerns range from an error with a visa seeing my teen put in jail (whereas any other country they'd, at worst, just be turned away and sent home), the presence of guns (depending on the camp location, I suppose), wildfires and floods, all the way through to major civil unrest.

Part of me thinks, 'Don't be ridiculous, people travel to the US and other places all the time and just have a great visit,' but the other part of me thinks that I wouldn't have sent a young adult to tour Germany in 1939. History suggests the US is going to be a very tricky place, trickier than it already is, in the next few years.

Can anyone talk any sense into me either way? Thanks in advance.

Mine got paid $5000 for the summer free accommodation and had a ball

Similar and had a day off per week where they were shuttled bussed into town if they wanted to. Saved some, spent some on going to new York afterwards.

Can you explain to me more about 2027 and why it’ll be turbulent ?

18-year-olds travel through countries far more unpredictable than America on gap years all the time. Trump is a cunt but your kid isn’t going to be shot or jailed while spending summer at a camp for suburban kids toasting marshmallows and playing softball.

Also they’re an adult so they can and will travel anywhere they want, regardless of how worried you are.

I've in the States. My niece came over this summer and worked at Camp Arrowhead ( through girl scouts not CA). She had a fantastic time. Not problems at the border. Not everywhere here is crazy, just normal folks going about their business and very welcoming to visitors.

Yes also a day off a week and lots of her friends had cars so went out in their free time. They also did lots of camping hiking and sailing on days off

I'm cautiously making sure I've got some extra cans in, first aid kit replenished, batteries, candles etc etc and I'm concerned about everything going on at the moment. However, I'm still of the opinion that we carry on living our lives and planning. No one wants to waste money or the disappointment of cancelling things, but that's doable any time in the meantime.

There was a camp america thread last year that I taxed when talking to friend about it, might have been in HE, I can't recall, but could be worth searching for. Loads of helpful posters on it.

FGS get a grip OP

to be honest I would be very uncomfortable even putting money into their economy. Look at other options. My dd is dual national and is giving up her American citizenship on principle

1. We know there will be global famines. Why? Well a lot of crops were not planted due to the cost of fertiliser and diesel being so high. On top of this neither Ukraine nor Russia have been able to export as much wheat as normal. They are the two biggest wheat exporter's in the world. They are particularly crucial to the middle east and north Africa where many survive on bread. Prices are already forecast to be very high. This has been accompanied by the worst harvests in Europe for years due to the weather. France has a massive issue with drought still and there being a lack of moisture in the soil. For the UK we should still have food but some shortages are likely. That's as long as things don't go very bad. Which it could.
2. There's export bans on sulphur by China and Russia which are crucial to making fertiliser products. In addition to the middle east not being able to get fertiliser out. So this problem is going to go into next year.
3. Many Western farmers are facing bankruptcy because they are struggling to absorb rising costs. So crops and animals may not be grown. Causing lower production and higher prices all round. Yesterday there was a report saying rises of at least 6% were already expected in the UK next year. (This may increase).
4. The Middle East is about to go BOOM. There's already been concerns that insufficient levels of oil and gas have been shipped to meet global demand. We are not self sufficient for oil and diesel in particular is a big issue because it is the fuel that runs farming and shipping. ATM Europe has not got a plan that accounts for a long term shut down of middle east capacity and with the Emir of Qatar saying yesterday "war is imminent, prepare for the worst" and the Egyptian President saying similar today, you should be sitting up. The Philippines has already had rationing of diesel, Bali has massive shortages. Pakistan and India are experiencing notable significant electricity black outside due to shortages of gas. India is reporting low stocks of coal because they've used it instead of gas. This has massive impacts on industrial output. Noting in particular the significance of the pharmaceutical production industry of India for the UK. We import a LOT of drugs/drug components from India and China. The cost of drugs going up in having a big impact on the NHS which is struggling to keep to budget allowances already.
5. That's BEFORE we talk about Yemen and shipping through the Suez Canal and potential increases in costs if it's either closed completely or insurance companies decide they have to hike rates massively. The canal was closed for 6 days in 2021 and it caused no end of problems. The fact Egypt is making the noises above and talking about coming to Saudi Arabias aid as they have a defense pact should be a warning sign.
6. These impacts are no longer short term ones. The infrastructure damage is enormous. It's going to take considerable time to fix.
7. The issue with aviation fuel is highly likely to put some airlines out of business. Ryanair CEO warned about this months ago but it's not played out yet. This is unlikely to stay like this because the winter is where it gets tough for airlines and the infrastructure issues are going to kick in. The aviation industry is one of the most vulnerable to economic downturns. Costs are going to spiral. Lots of people who want to go on holiday are going to find they are priced out.
8. French Fridges are costly. (Insurance and implications for maintenance of anything connected to the internet).
9. The French are due a credit review from Moody's next week. This is unlikely to be good for a country which is 'having some problems atm'.
10. Spiralling costs / shortages = civil unrest. This could be in many places near and far. We rely on the Channel Tunnel for goods. France isn't a happy place right now.
11. The energy price cap is going to have to go up about 20% in January. Already in the works as an inevitability.
12. I've not even mentioned the weaknesses of the UK power system, Trump flipping and allying with Russia, Trump and the MidTerms, Russia generally or the predicted effects of El Nino for this winter both here and abroad. Nor AI. Nor the issues with levels of government debt and borrowing and the fragility of the global economic markets. I could take the time to explain all these but 1 - 10 alone should be scaring the shit out of you and if it isn't, you really really need to be waking up at this point.

It is something of a perfect storm.

A lot of it is already baked in, because things have happened and the consequences simply have not played out yet. These are not things that MAY not happen, they ALREADY have happened. If you think 2027 will be a seamless continuation of the world you know, you might be in for a shock.

We are being slowly and gently prodded to get ready for some of the fall out. The level of this is unprecedented. Its a level of turmoil we have not had in decades. We have not really clocked the warning signs because we are comfortable and because we have got so used to that, that we take stability for granted. There is a massive incoming problem.

Honestly we are on the edge of a pretty rough time ahead when people are already saying there is a cost of living crisis. It is 100% going to get worse because we already know certain factors which are so significant.

Have you not seen how backpackers etc have been locked up instead of just being sent home asap when they’ve had the wrong visas?

It is a valid concern

I wouldn't be going to the USA at the moment.

I'd likely as not be perfectly safe. BUT, if the colour of my skin was different, I wouldn't be. So fuck that for a laugh.

Can’t say I have no, but don’t get the wrong visa. If they’re to be trusted to go to a foreign country for 2 months then it’s reasonable to assume they’re capable of getting the right visa for their needs.

Wrong visa?

You should always have valid visas for anywhere you travel. You can't just go where you like with no permission or consequences.

Like the British one who was on an Esta and then mentioned she was volunteering.

The German girls because they didn’t have hotels booked for the entire stay. But did have an Esta and visa.

Several Canadians have been detained too and other British people falling foul of ICE

There's also English camp companies running in Austria, Italy and I believe Malta. Costs a fraction of the America ones as you only pay for fights and you can gain a tefl qualification for free also

I’ve just come back from a holiday in the US. It was fine. I didn’t get deported or jailed because I have a valid ESTA and passport and was able to give them my first night address and full booking if they asked; they didn’t, you’re only required to provide first night address which should be checked at your departure airport.

You're not supposed to be working paid or unpaid.

You need to give your address when you buy your ticket.

I honestly don't think the rules are hard to follow, are they?

I just think a lot of people think they're above the rules. Nobody is.

I'm in the US a couple of months a year in total. It's always been fine for me, although my favourite mall in Chicago had a shooting the other week. Armed robbery in the carpark.

It's not going to stop me living my life. I will still go back.

I would be anxious about the unpredictability of immigration enforcement, and the risk of getting locked up for a long time if you somehow end up on the wrong side of them. I see a PP has suggested going through US immigration at Dublin airport. I think that would be a good idea if possible if your daughter does decide to go.

Apart from the uk 😁

Haha. Yes. It’s a free for all here!

We live an hour or so from the US border. On principle we no longer cross the border and no way on earth would DT’s be doing a Camp America.

Not a hope in hells chance. Look at Camp Canada instead.