Wwyd? Pregnant employee. Don’t want to be sued but, ah!

[HavanaOhna]

I’m manager for a small company, there are about 8 employees so very small. We had a lovely young woman started in the new year who found out she was pregnant shortly after. Absolutely fine.

we’ve been very supportive as her pregnancy has been complicated, loads of additional scans, scares, admissions. We’ve always told her to take the time she needs for these, paid and to take extra time after them as they can be taxing. Sometimes she takes the whole day for one scan and that’s ok.

The issue is she’s now 7 months, seems incredibly poorly but won’t go on sick due to finances (has exhausted sick pay, this would be unpaid now). She’s WFH, at her request and our blessing, and is doing I’d say the bare minimum. Just scraping by work wise. Every time I see her on teams she looks gaunt, and exhausted, and has admitted that she’s tearful, not sleeping, and has had further pregnancy issues. These are all supported by documentation.

Then a few days ago she came into the office. First time in months. She could barely sit at her desk, she wasn’t doing much all day, up and down to the loo, extended lunch break. I really feel for her. We had a wellbeing meeting and she’s insisting she’s fine. I organised an occupational health session and she reiterated to them she’s fine, but you can see she’s on her knees.

I don’t really know what to do. She’s vital at work and although things are being done she’s working at I’d say 50% capacity. If this is mentioned, she promises she will sort it out so ends up working into the evening (which again we don’t want). A colleague became so frustrated the other day she pointedly asked her why she doesn’t go on maternity early and this wasn’t met well. Others are having to pick up the slack heavily, and some colleagues have started to avoid her completely work wise.

HR (no in house, outsourced) said not much we can do as she cannot be forced to take maternity leave early and if she says she’s not sick she’s not sick but I don’t know how we can do another 8 weeks going forward. I feel team morale is low, she is obviously unwell.

So as a small business owner, how on earth can I afford to do this? NI, NMW are all on the increase and my wage bill grows more and more each year. I've had to let 2 support staff on minimum wage go to allow for the higher wages for skilled staff in the last 12 months. There's a ceiling to the prices I can charge my customers, so do I make even less profit and not take a wage myself so my staff can have more employment benefits?! I don't think that's what I went into this for, oddly enough. I still have bills to pay and am not running a charity.

There is a huge difference between how much a small business can be expected to offer and absorb and still remain viable compared to a large Corporation with huge profits and, then again, its another level altogether if its the Public Sector (AKA the tax payer)

It's a small company so it should be very easy to contact the owner and have an open and frank conversation if they are a decent person.

Bottom line is how profitable is the company? If they can afford to provide full sick pay or even let her work part time but pay a full wage then I personally think that they should be doing this. There seems to be no debate over the fact she is unwell.

Speak to the person I charge of H. My partner works for a small company. One of the directors will have the statutory duty of being in charge of employee welfare and HR. She can start maternity leave early, I had to do this due to sickness. Don’t put anything on your head explain the facts to the person in charge of HR and let them decide the course of action and then live with whatever they decide.

She IS a pisstaker. "Pregnant women can also be pisstakers" shocker

How vile of you.

If you are going to quote the law, it helps if you post factually because its not backdated or retrospective.

https://www.gov.uk/dismiss-staff/eligibility-to-claim-unfair-dismissal

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6a049a3d22977ebc82cb3f1a/unfair-dismissal-factsheet.pdf

"When will these changes come into force?

• The Government intends to commence the package of changes relating to unfair dismissal on 1 January 2027.
• The Government’s intention is to adopt a commencement approach which would, from that date, extend protection against ‘ordinary’ unfair dismissal immediately to employees who already have six months’ service or more. Other employees will gain this protection once they reach six months’ service."

The key words - "from that date", or 1st Jan 2027.

Therefore the 6mth element does not and will not apply to the employee here.

Get someone in now who will be covering her maternity leave. It’s 8 weeks additional pay costs - but the benefits to the team will be enormous the pregnant lady can do handovers.

She can't afford unpaid leave!!!!!

Pregnancy is such a difficult area. I am sure she wants to be doing a much better job, and financially it will likely be very difficult for her on maternity as she isn't getting maternity leave.

As her presence doesn't seem to be helping anyone, her health or you and her colleagues, could you just speak to the CEO about putting her on paid leave until her maternity kicks in? Or at least reduced hours on full pay as others have mentioned. The others in her team don't need to know the details. If possible, you could speak to her about coming in for a day or two's/couple of half days training for her maternity cover, if she has otherwise been able to rest more hopefully she would find that easier than she is now. Assuming you are able to recruit someone before she delivers!

Also, by treating her well now, you are more likely to get extra loyalty from her in the future. Not guaranteed obviously, but if the company can afford the outlay it will likely mean a huge amount to her.

Has a risk assessment been done to cover her carrying out all her duties whilst suffering complications of a pregnancy? It might be a good idea to to do a risk assessment because you might pick up on some fundamental issues that you can use as leverage to insist she goes on sick or early maternity leave.

Don't know what you should do, but you seem like a decent human being.

I dont disagree there is difference. Yet so so many default to minimum/ statutory when they could afford and choose to offer more.

But pregnant women aren’t valued, as demonstrated by this thread. Pushed out with no income at the single time she is most vulnerable in her entire life.

this stereotype of pregnant women taking the piss barely exists. And remind ourselves it’s a stereotype created by men, continued by women - who believe they are better than anyone else.

Adding a shout out to https://pregnantthenscrewed.com/ for any women reading this who are concerned about their employment during pregnancy.

Her financial position is a shame for her but pregnant or not no one can expect to sit at work and do nothing and get paid for it. I feel sorry for her but she’s taking the piss.

Options are you either suck it up til she goes on mat leave or you get occupational health and get their guidance on her fitness for work, any adjustments that can be made. If they say she’s unfit then it puts you in a stronger position to tell her she’ll need to get signed off.

You need to also tell the colleagues to keep their trap shut because that way sleepwalking into a harassment claim lies.

Why is she a piss taker? From what we know, she is

1. suffering from significant complications during pregnancy, impacting both her health and a risk to her child hence additional scans
2. trying to mitigate financial issues she will face due to only receiving base maternity pay when baby is born
3. doing her best to remain in work, following all company procedures
4. and, entitled to adjustments as a result of her pregnancy complications. Based on protective employment law
5. her employer has not yet recruited maternity cover, has not formally reduced her workload, has not offered any adjustments within their control other than WFH despite knowing she is finding it difficult and the reasons behind her reluctance to be on zero pay.
6. her employer is not proactively manage the situation to protect the health and safety including wellbeing of all its emoloyees

whos ‘taking the piss’ exactly?

Isn't maternity leave triggered if you go off sick towards the end of a pregnancy?

No one said it was her fault did they? I don’t remember writing that. I must be going senile. It doesn’t change the fact that her being off is affecting other members of staff. There are no management on site at my husbands job. They are all WFH. So they don’t get affected so no amount of complaining by the two remaining staff would help. It’s bad management yes. But it still affects other people that’s the point. The company think they are being lovely (and avoiding being sued) by giving the pregnant woman all the fully paid off time off she wants. But because the department is now on 2 only officially neither my husband or his colleague can have any time off at all until they replace her as rules state 2 of the 3 must be in the department at all times. So no medical appointments etc themselves.

As per the OP:

"She’s vital at work and although things are being done she’s working at I’d say 50% capacity."

Anyone working at 50pc capacity is a piss take, is it not?

She is not going off sick, as perhaps she should - so if she is at work and not giving 100pc, the OP has stated its affecting team morale too. That is a piss take.

I don't think anyone would like to be in a team where a person is slacking.

Not the main point but in the future if someone has a medical appt in pregnancy don't give them the whole day off if a half day is doable. Then you have people covering her workload more than necessary. It can put people off hiring pregnant workers. If she wasn't well enough to attend that would be different.

I mean at the minute they dont have any cover for her, so if she goes off sick 100% of her vital work will have to be covered by the other employees. Id rather someone be working 50% capacity than 0% tbh

She's not slacking, she's clearly unwell, and can't afford time off.

Oh I dont disagree that shes unwell - but equally, when she goes on mat leave, the team will have to pick up the 100pc anyway.

The issue is that shes not giving 100pc while still being at work - I totally get that her health may well affect that, but its affecting more than just her - its affecting the team.

Hence my initial post on this thread suggested performance managing her out.

OP, how far away from her due date is she ? A pregnant employee can determine when they start maternity leave any time from the 11th week before due date - is there a reason that she’s not open to this given how sick she is ? Alternatively, if she’s exhausted company sick pay would she still qualify for SSP If not, I don’t think there’s much you can do. If she goes off sick during her last four weeks before due date, her maternity leave automatically triggers the day after first day of sickness. But keep in mind that that only applies if the sickness is pregnancy related. There’s a link to ACAS website below and that gives a few tips on things you could try, but beyond that I think it’s up to her.

https://www.acas.org.uk/pregnancy-at-work/sickness-and-difficult-pregnancies

as pregnancy is a protected characteristic, and she is having pregnancy related complications, her capability appears has been impacted to a reduction of 50%. There is no mention that the work she is doing is poor, purely that she cannot manage her workload as she previously did.

Same as if she had broken her arm, and could only do 50% of her role for 6 weeks. Or if she had a temporary sickness and reasonable adjustments needed to be made until recovery.

she isn’t not doing the work because she can’t be arsed, as per the OP. She is dong her absolute best to cope.

The employer (CEO and Manager) should be managing this proactively, to make reasonable adjustments and manage the workload, which they aren’t. They have managed it so poorly that other staff are now disgruntled.

This is how they treat a pregnant employee who is apparently vital.

That is their failure as management. Not her failure for having a complicated pregnancy.