How do we handle FIL's new partner comparing everything to herself?

[JibbersYouveGotANerve]

I've been ruminating on this for a week now after a nightmare weekend away and could do with some advice, please!

FIL was widowed four years ago and met someone new a few months ago. He has never been the sparkiest of conversationalists but things are even worse now as he just sits in a chair while this lady also fails utterly to converse. In her case, she ignores what you say unless she can think of something in her own life related to the topic and then she will tell you about that thing. Every attempt at a conversation ends up as just a series of statements where she tells you about people you've never met (but who are, of course, better than you in every way).

We were sort of rolling our eyes and getting through it but now she has latched onto my severely disabled, medically complex DD. Everything DD does or is results in a comparison to her niece, who was a late developer but now has a (very nice) family and a good job. Manifestly, this is not something that will happen for DD.

So, mentioning DD's mobility equipment or special school gets "Oh, x couldn't walk til she was three" or "X found school very difficult until A levels but then she did really well". A three-week hospital stay was greeted with some rigmarole about tonsil removal. It's not the same, it's insultingly not the same, and when we try to point out the differences politely we get ignored.

FIL just sits there and doesn't react to any of it. He asks an occasional question about our lives but his response to what we say is something like "Oh yes", or "Oh well" and conversation never develops, then this lady just brings it back to herself AGAIN. We try and ask questions and get silence from him and an inappropriate monologue from her.

DH is just as frustrated as I am. He can't get his dad on his own to discuss as FIL won't do anything any more without this woman (even phone conversations are all on speakerphone with her chipping in).

So, aside from limiting visits (and exposure to my child), and potentially coming up with tall tales to see what way this lady can top them, what do I do??

And if the latter option, do feel free to give me some tall tales to try out on her...

Its not that unusual, people can be like this
They have their world view based on personal experience

Sociologists call it conversational narcissism.
and when it’s excessive I’m not surprised you feel unheard.

It can stem from loneliness, neurodivergence, or a need for validation rather than malice.
It sounds like she needs a little more to her life and it sounds like your FIL is being dominated and controlled

Perhaps your dh should arrange father son meet ups for a chat about how he’s getting on

Thank you for the terminology, @ForkHandlesNotFourCandles - I didn't know that the behaviour has a name and she certainly ticks off everything I have just read about it.

When this all started, DH gently told FIL that he found the new lady didn't listen very well. FIL seemed surprised by this and nothing more was said. However, other family members have had the same experience with her as we have and had the same response from him to their concerns. He was very lonely so he has grabbed onto this lady with both hands and I can't see him changing the situation.

I can just feel myself boiling up and getting more and more angry about the way DD is discussed and I'm worried I'm just going to snap one day, which will put me in the wrong. I'm terrible at confrontation and will just get tongue-tied and teary.

Well they won’t change… so just talk to each other and ignore them.

But this to say… it’s ok to get tongue tied, to get teary, and to snap at someone who is being an arsehole to you. It’s the consequences of her behaviour.

Without wanting to sound like I'm all in favour of what this lady's doing, I think it's likely that it's a form of social dysfunction, i.e. she's really anxious and/or socially awkward as a person and in general life, doesn't know how to manage light social chit chat with strangers at the best of times, never mind in an acutely awkward situation getting to know the adult children and grandchildren of a new partner, who himself is taciturn and a but difficult and doesn't smooth things over / ease the way for her.

I'd probably try and (a) limit visits and do little and often rather than whole weekends at a time, distance/other commitments allowing, it's too much for many families to be cooped up together for whole weekends at a time never mind with added awkwardness from a new dynamic/new weird partner you don't get on with (b) manage social occasions such that's some other focus aside from conversation, can you meet outside the house maybe so at least you're going somewhere and/or have ordering food/drinks or the ambiance of a cafe or pub or restaurant to mask the lack of normal conversation, or if at home have some kind of activity to focus on rather than just sitting talking (or listening as the case may be!), whether that's cooking a meal or watching something on Tv or a game even? (b) Relentlessly and firmly change the topic every single time away from comparisons, if you say for instance 'DD's had a chest infection this week', she says 'oh yes I know all about that, Doris down the road has a nasty cough', I know the instinct is to snap back 'it's not the same' but instead why not let the topic now be Doris for a bit, ask some questions about who is Doris and has she known her a long time and is she a good neighbour bla bla. Just blank the comparison to your DD out entirely, don't give it any airtime at all - even negative energy like arguing that her comparison is wrong and hurtful sometimes just feeds it as a feature of all conversation whereas distraction can work much better.

I think perhaps if she becomes a long term feature in your lives she will loosen up and be a bit less monologuey, or at least you'll get used to it!

Sharing a parallel connection is a common and accepted method of neurodivergent communication. Especially if a person is quiet and has trouble breaking into the conversation, this is more likely the situation than the person being selfish.

Coming up with tall tales sounds hilarious- "I went hillwalking" "I went indoor climbing" "oh really? I scaled mount Everest a few years ago" "amazing! Do you know, I got frostbite doing that in my twenties... Three of my toes are artificial"...

I do feel like I might be doing this sooner and later! I find it so hurtful that there is no interest at all in our lives, none, and especially it makes me sad for DD that this is the grandparent (and grandparent-adjacent) experience that she gets. Ugh.

It could be her way of trying to bond with you. I do this as a neurodivergent it’s really common.

@NoctuaAthene I love this, thank you! Some fantastic ideas and you've clarified some of the things I was feeling but hadn't managed to articulate.

Things are definitely slightly easier if we are away from the house, so we will try that more. It just gets tricky with the wheelchair access. At least the weather is good right now so we can be outside.

It does upset me that DH and I have to go to so much effort to try and manage her, distract her etc and it isn't reciprocated. I feel limiting contact is best, as does DH, but then it makes us feel guilty. Why can't these things be easy to manage!

YES.

Her next gambit would be "Only three toes?"

She must be going home sometimes so your DH could discuss the issues with FIL properly alone.

The thing is, your father in law , as you say, isn’t much of a conversationalist, so he’s relieved to have found somebody like this. She fills the space for him. She doesn’t require reciprocity, so he’s relieved to can relax.
do you have to spend much time with her? I have a friend like this, I’ve known her since school, it’s super boring being with her but it’s also just “time off” kind of like having the radio on.

She has pretty much moved in with him (it is a few hours' drive between their homes) and the speakerphone thing is a real issue. FIL genuinely seems not to want to do anything without her being present. However, I think DH will just have to drop behind next time we are all out for a walk or something, have a word about the speakerphone and then he can hopefully go from there.

They're probably both ND. Maybe just accept her for who she is, recognising that she won't meet any of your needs, and hope family will also accept your DC and/or you or DH if you were ever to become disabled and unable to converse in a way they'd like to.

It sounds like neurodivergence.

I doubt if anything will change, no matter what your DH manages to say to his father, OP. Even if you say something to his partner, you will probably get blamed for 'upsetting' her. If I were you, I would stop visiting so often. Let DH go and see them alone sometimes. In my experience, people don't change very much.

Does your DD actually get anything out of these visits? If he just sits in his chair and doesn't talk what is the point of even going?

Do you stay over with him/them?

I have a family member just like this . I've evolved a way to deal with it, if it's upsetting me I make an excuse and walk away. I go and get a glass of water, or go to the loo, or suddenly rememver an important phone call I need to make. When I return, she's usually moved on and is holding forth about something else. An alternative method is to be very blunt and say, "this conversation is upsetting me, don't let's discuss it any more" My family member is never offended, as far as I can see

Is she actually trying to “one up” everything, or is she just a really clumsy conversationalist and trying to relate to what you’re saying / thinks she’s empathising by recounting a similar experience?

Both are annoying but one is less intentional.

MIL used to always to the speakerphone thing when she had friends over… DH used to just say I can hear you’re busy, I’ll call you another time and then hang up.

It must be hard for your DH to not have a relationship with his dad anymore without an audience. It doesn’t sound like FIL will be hugely receptive to any feedback though.

The speaker phone thing is strange, my mother does it, effectively meaning my dad hears every word I say. I’ve told her to stop it but she pretends she isn’t doing it. Aargh. Infuriating. I wonder why FIL has also started this, control or feeling like he can’t have a private conversation?

I think I may be a bit guilty of this. I'm in my 50s and have only just become aware that it isn't a 'normal' way to converse and people find it upsetting. I genuinely thought that was how people relate to one another. I am currently trying to do it less and ask people follow up questions, etc., rather than just replying with a similar experience. I was in a situation today (new volunteer role) where i was with two new people trying to chitchat for a couple of hours. I don't think it went very well as my attempts to ask follow up questions seemed to come off more like interrogation. I strongly suspect i am neurodivergent, but have no diagnosis (hence the username). This lady sounds similar. It's really difficult when your social skills are lacking. Do you think that might be the problem, or do you think she is trying to be unpleasant?

That's more worrying than communication style

I think this is a really good response and I agree with this advice entirely.