How to cope with people who are never satisfied

[PurpleSky300]

My relationship with my Dad is very strained and one of the main reasons that he is just so consistently, endlessly ill-mannered! When we meet up or go out to eat, he complains about everything. An endless litany of:

"Is it empty because it's crap?" / "I bet they serve frozen muck" / "I bet it's Happy Shopper Cola" / "I don't want to be near other people listening to my conversations" / "I hope I'm not near screaming kids" / "I'd rather have gone (anywhere else)". And this is usually after he has chosen a specific place. He will say, "I want a burger" or "I want steak" and I'll find somewhere that does that and it's just never right. He'll taste something and then make a face or spit it out like a kid, wipe his nose on his sleeve instead of in a tissue, etc.

He also seems to have endless interpersonal problems. Everyone at his GP practice is an 'idiot', everyone at work is "sucking up to management", his poor Mum is "deaf as a post", etc. He has not got a good word for anybody.

I'm sure it sounds condescending but it is comical to me that this guy, who has lived on booze and doner kebabs all his adult life, now acts as though a Nandos or a Toby Carvery is beneath his station. He once refused to go into an Italian chain restaurant because he did not know what "sautéed mushrooms" were.

Part of me feels angry, part of me feels sorry, part of me thinks that his life is crap enough without me causing arguments. But the more it goes on, the more I just think, "Why are you like this, why did you never learn better than this." He has lived such a small life that a word in a different language on a menu is something baffling to him.

This is so relatable OP!

Incredibly draining to be around.

How would it be to actually say "I've noticed you complain for the majority of our time together and I'm finding it really hard to hear"??

I have a friend who is a bit like this, although nowhere near as rude and relentless as your dad. She's very negative, complains a lot, glass half empty etc. Its very draining so I have lots of sympathy for you. I remind myself that she has a lot of hurt, anger and sadness inside and this is how it leaks out.

I see her about once a month which feels like enough. I listen to the complaining and sympathise up to a point, but generally try to stick to topics that we both find enjoyable. I certainly don't expect anyone to be a ray of sunshine at all times, but endless negativity is very draining indeed

This sounds like my MIL and FIL - the both had a problematic relationship with alcohol - I experienced them as permanently hung over and miserable.

I believe the long term use caused permanent irreversible neurological changes.

You have to recognise now that you are not having a relationship with him now - you are just ‘managing’ him.

I would observe that the how and how often you interact and meet right now isn’t working for either of you. He sounds antisocial, highly and easily agitated - so I would leave him in the environment he is most comfortable in. Don’t waste your time, energy, emotions or headspace taking him out. Don’t bother with food whether even if you visit him in his home.

Consider if he actually was a good father to you and that if you are only motivated by FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) to maintain this relationship - then consider that’s an unhealthy dynamic. Do you have young children - if so I wouldn’t expose them to this. I would be putting in the distance and living a life unburdened by him - as I am not sure how well he supported you as he certainly doesn’t sound like he does now. Relationships should be mutual, respectful and reciprocal.

Does he struggle with depression?

58 isn't that old. If there's no underlying medical issues (cognitive issues dementia etc), he's probably just not that empathetic and is self centred. Take a step back if you can or just manage it in the way that others have suggested.

Thank you, I appreciate this. He was not a present father, he was pretty checked out - I wasn't a planned child and the drink caused a lot of problems. He never did birthdays or Christmas or anything, even when was still at home, but my Mum did. I think I am motivated by obligation and also a hope that things might just get better one day.

He does have days when he is not as bad as this but they are rare. I think "agitated" is such a good word to describe it. It's like agitation is his normal state, his baseline. He doesn't like, trust or want to deal with other people if it can be avoided. He is recently sober, which I imagine is not helping his mood.

I used to visit him at home but I stopped due to the drinking and his various, ongoing aggro with his neighbours. He thinks they are the devil incarnate for various nonsensical, paranoid reasons. They are just old folk as far as I can see.

Not medicated for it but I would say so, to some degree.

You are officially the ‘adult child of an alcoholic’ - his behaviour in your upbringing will have left you with lots of emotional deficits - your job is to pivot your attention inwards and focus on re-parenting yourself so that you don’t bring the entrenched legacy of his behaviours on your emotional wellbeing.

Spend some time online or in person with Al Anon and also Adult Children of Alcoholics - they have so many resources - this laundry list will help you understand how this upbringing has impacted you and compromised your development.

https://adultchildren.org/laundry-lists/

Please focus on your own repair and self rebuilding rather than the impulse to save / fix / soothe / satisfy the adult who was not there for you.

We are training to be compulsively Co-dependent…..Al Anon teach ‘Detach with love’ - he needs to find his own way with professional help - he has caused a huge amount of distress to many people already and seems to be continuing to do so in his ‘dry drunk’ mentality. He will chew you up and spit you out - don’t waste your finite youth, emotional energy and time on this project - it’s futile. Conserve that energy to boost your own life which is already compromised by him. Save your effort for a few years down the road when he will likely be plagued with health issues / unemployment etc - then still keep yourself out of draining and punching distance - just do a few admin health tasks if you feel the need

I think I've started doing this (unhappy marriage, bad divorce, new home a money pit - see what I'm doing there?? 😂) and I really like your suggestion of doing one positive comment first. Thank you!

I think people do get in a habit and you do need to call them out on it. Say "stop being negative or I won't take you out anymore as it's making me miserable and I want to enjoy our time together". Leave him time to reflect then see how he is next time and warn him at the start. "No negative comments today or we're going home". Treat him like a child.

How are you doing @PurpleSky300this week?

This!

I'm ok, thanks. Haven't been in touch with my Dad so far. I just feel a bit flat and tired. I think my Dad thinks I look down on him due to his choices, and maybe I'm not good at hiding it. Maybe I do resent him a bit for those choices, when I see the life he lives. I struggle with how I feel and what I should do and it just goes round and round in my head.

That sounds exhausting and is the direct result of being the child of an alcoholic - being over responsible, over concerned and therefore still consumed with it even when you aren’t with him. It’s continuing to take its toll on you.

Please know the 3 Cs from Al Anon:

you didn’t cause it,
you can’t control it,
you can’t cure it,

This applies as much to his current dry/drunk ‘sober’ state as to when he was in active addiction. It’s about acceptance of what he is and chooses to be and then intentionally turning and prioritising your own recovery and growth to make up for the inadequate and deficient emotional environment he created.

It's a substantial part of why I can rarely face picking up the phone to DM.

When I do talk to her, I play a mental bingo card. Last time I'd recently got back from a lovely holiday and as soon as I mentioned the island she moaned about her holiday there 20 years ago. Fortunately you can't see eyes rolling on a landline. She then followed up with some recycled bitching about other family members that I've heard before.

In her case it is aggravated by old age (80s) and her world shrinking with little fresh input, but it is an intensification of traits that were always there.

58 is young to be that way (alcohol highly likely to be the trigger and has probably impacted his physical and cognitive health) and it doesn't bode well for the long term future of your relationship. Definitely put your own metaphorical oxygen mask first and don't give him more of your emotional capacity than you can spare.