If you've emigrated, have you considered that it's not always easy to return?

[Wiresring]

Either permanently or for a visit?

Money, of course will protect you in many circumstances and mean that funds are available if you needed to return because of e.g. divorce or family illness, but we've seen circumstances in recent years which mean it's not necessarily as easy as it seems.

A friend emigrated to Australia and is genuinely living the dream, but I don't think she'll ever fully recover from not being able to return when her Dad was dying or from missing her funeral during Covid.

Another friend, a single man, took a temporary job in Amsterham just before Covid hit and was stuck for months, working from home, in his room in a City that was basically closed, but unable to return because of travel restrictions.

And an extreme, a friend living in the ME with her H, finally got everything in place to leave, but now doesn't know when she might be able to get a flight.

I'm not a risk taker, so probably not in the market to emigrate anyway, but especially the Holland "it's only an hour away" one makes me shudder.

I've emigrated twice - both times to work fixed term contracts - I was 8,000 miles away from the UK and in a very remote place, it was not easy to get home - only two flights a week and those would get cancelled regularly due to weather conditions. People shouldn't do these things lightly - my parents and I made a list of 'things I would/would not come home for'. I feel very lucky that they both remained healthy while I was away - but at the ages they are now I wouldn't emigrate again while they are both living. There is nothing wrong with broadening your horizons, but you need to be very clear on what it means in the event of a disaster - personal or otherwise.

IME there is also the long term effect on relationships.

My parents emigrated just as my DH left me, devastated, with two DC’s under the age of three.
DM also left an elderly parent.

I didn’t moan, or say I needed help. Their lives, their choices.

They didn’t return for any family events. It was always too far (Spain!) or too costly (school holiday flights).

They are back in the UK now, deciding not to buy a house near me. My DF has since died. DM is so isolated. No friends as she didn’t keep in touch with those here or build new ones. No community.

I continue to work full time. I speak to her each week on the telephone, and visit maybe once a month. I should do more, but our relationship is distant and she wasn’t there when I needed her.
She wasn’t there when her DM needed her either, leaving care, funeral arrangements, house clearance to her siblings.

On the positive, I don’t feel guilty. I see her if I can. I go on holiday without her, I am planning a longer spell abroad too.

My life, my choice.

It depends. I moved to the UK and have been living here for 20 years +.
Yes, there are some restrictions. But it comes under choices. I'm happy where I am, I have a good life, lovely husband and DC. We live im a beautiful part of the country so apart from the increasingly wet winters the UK has been a good choice for me.
My family are still im my home country which is about 2 hours flight from here... or an 12 hour drive.

I had a few situations like OP describes, but again it comes under choices one makes. Overall, I still feel I am better off for meeting DH at uni, staying in this country and marriage.... DC ...

We emigrated last year, fully aware that things might happen that can restrict travel in the future. The same applies to leaving your home country for any reason - for work or a holiday, for example. However, we’re not the types to let ‘what if’s’ hold us back from a good adventure!

Expat just means you’ve moved somewhere for work. It is distinct from immigrant which is where someone moves to settle in another country. Expat = temporary, moved for work. Same with international students, they’re not considered immigrants. I’m an expat because I moved with my company and my type of visa is literally called a ‘non-immigrant’ visa. In my interview at the embassy I had to convince them I had no intentions to settle longterm in the country.

Friends of my family moved to a beautiful place in France. But, became older, developed health problems and when moving back could only afford a flat in an okay area due to how much house prices had risen in the UK. Their life in France was idyllic but they didn’t factor in needing to be close to facilities, that they would need family support etc.

I think it’s less of an issue for younger people but older people who retire abroad probably need to consider everything fully.

We came to UK from a EU country. Travel is around 8-14 hours door to door depending on which airport. Never been an issue.
Covid sucked but didn't it for all?

Yes, that was my point. They think they are 'just expats' when in reality, they are immigrants who actually live somewhere else now and can't just 'pop back' for NHS treatment or whatever.

Not the usual sense of “expat”.

My parents lived in a largely retired British expat community abroad. They had not left Britain temporarily for work. ( before Brexit).

It often makes me question the criticism in the UK of migrant communities who “stick together”, (eat their own food and shop in their own shops etc) . That is exactly what many British migrants do in other countries. The idea of “joining an expat community” is widely accepted when it is British people doing it elsewhere.

Jim Ratcliffe talks about parts of the UK being “colonised by immigrants”, yet he lives in Monaco, where the main issue is the pressure created by a wealthy and often transient international population. That pressure has produced a deep divide between them and the native community, which relies on state protection simply to maintain its presence in its own country.

@Ilovecheeseyah 🤣 Not sure that would be feasible!

But, I completely agree that for most people, moving away from their home town for at least a few years is generally educational and broadens our horizons.

My DD(20) chose a university a three hour flight away. For selfish reasons, we’d prefer her to be closer, but the experience has been so good for her, she’s becomes so independent and mature and openly says that meeting people from completely different backgrounds/other areas has broadened her horizons.

Although we’d like to see her more often, one bonus is that she says that she appreciates us more as parents and that we do try hard…even if we’re also “trying” at times. 🤣

I’m an immigrant, my Mum lived and worked abroad for years, and DH’s family were immigrants a few generations back. It’s hard at times, but modern travel and technology makes it much easier to stay connected with family and friends.

Oh, I agree that in practice it is no different from being an immigrant if you moved from a safe country (ie you didn’t immigrate to flee conflict etc.). My adopted country feels like home now, not just somewhere I work for a few years before returning to the UK. I am looking to get PR and hopefully citizenship at some point.

We were in the US. Dh was there 30 years (moved as a young teen) I was there 20 years. We moved back to look after elderly relatives. No regrets on being there. We always had an emergency fund that had enough for flights home for the whole family. The kids moved back too (one was still school age then) so we are no longer tied to the US.

Interesting idea - What about other young people that didn’t go to college or uni? Would they go?

Or could people forego college/uni because they don’t want to be forced to go somewhere they don’t want to?

Just wondered how far you have gone with these ideas 😆

I immigrated here to the uk and of course I understood how far away it was. We can’t afford to go often and we miss everything. My kids don’t know their extended family at all and there’s no plans to change that as we don’t have the money or the time. Am a bit confused by this post - is this about all the people in the Middle East expecting free rescue flights back right now?

Humankind needs both people to tend the fire and people to find new land.

You’re one, people who emigrate are the other. Typically, the second group assess risk differently to the first.

I couldn’t spend my life living next door to my parents. Nether could they though, lived in 6 countries!

Ive been moving country every 5 to 10 years since I was a baby. I firmly believe "you can never go home", even if you pack up and go everything at home has moved on without you and it will not be the same. And no-one is interested in your life in Oz, France, Dubai or Mars 2 days after you are home.
But people everywhere are poor planners. What happens when your baby turns 21 and can't live on your visa anymore is a current nightmare for one friend.

Well, you stay living in the same street you always did, OP, in case there's a pandemic or a war that strands you somewhere.

Honestly, OP, do you not think the averagely intelligent person who moves to another country thinks it through? I spent from my early 20s until just before I turned 50 living in five different countries outside my home country (am not from the UK, but lived there for part of that time), and then moved back home with DH and DS. I wouldn't say it's been entirely straightforward settling in again to a place I'd not lived in for so long, but five years on, it's been a good move, and I'm delighted DS is growing up in my culture. I probably won't live here for the rest of my life, either, because I like a new challenge, a new culture, a new language, but I'm certainly not planning to stay put in case something happens.

OP your examples don’t make sense.

No one could attend a funeral during covid.

If you are a Brit you are always allowed to ‘return home’ so both your friends could have travelled.

Everyone was trapped inside. Your Brit friend was allowed to return back to country of origin and return to the Netherlands based on Dutch rules at that time:

If people choose to move far (Australia for example) they know it’s hard to come home quickly.

If people choose to move to difficult countries (Lebanon for example) they they also know situations can change and airspace may be. Closed because geographically it’s difficult.

You don’t really make an argument.

Well that's stupid, you can't. The UK contains islands and Northern Ireland, which are not 'walkable' from the mainland

For any big move (within the country, or even going off to university far away) you do need to accept you're necessarily going to lose some things and gain others.

I'm probably going to digital nomad a bit.

I know I have good social skills to try new groups, and enough solo interests so I can keep occupied and content.

I'm at the life stage where I've done and seen enough and feel I have enough credentials. So I'm also genuinely Ok just staying in watching films with a cup of tea.

Plus I'll be prioritising things like money and career progression and retirement plans and aim to "not take my eye off the ball" there.

I'll only begin in big diverse cities which means my core lifestyle won't radically change and there are similar international migrants and good infrastructure.

I think the people who struggle a bit expect to reinvent themselves and make slightly dramatic choices....Move to remote locations to do a low paid job they've never done before, think they're going to fall in love with a swarthy local farmer....

I blame all those random TV programmes in the 90s!

I've lived abroad for 20 years. It's been an experience of contrasts: Totally heartbreaking, but has given me so very much.

I actually didn't really want to go; I followed my husband back to his own country. He was desperate to return, and I thought it seemed like a cool enough adventure. It's worth pointing out that I had NO idea he'd been born abroad and raised there until he was 9 when I first met him, because he'd lived in England for 26 years, all his family were in England, and he had no foreign accent. His mother is English. Anyway, he became very disenchanted with the UK, so we moved.

It absolutely broke my heart into a million pieces. I am not one of life's travellers. I like being at home and I love England. However, perhaps it's a good thing that me falling in love with my husband made me do it, because I'd never have done it on my own.

I have discovered that I love where I live now, and I have certain failsafes that I couldn't have in Britain, like specialist medical treatment for a rare condition, and certain insurance products that the UK doesn't have. My chosen field of work is also much more accessible here - not stuck with London like at home. I prefer the weather here and I find the people friendlier than in the UK.

But, my parents both went through long cancer journeys, and it was extremely hard. When I made the choice, though, I knew I would live many decades after they had gone (hopefully), and therefore didn't want to miss out because of them. We visited each other quite frequently and stayed for at least two weeks each time. As it turned out, my mother only lived for seven years after I left anyway, dying at the relatively young age of 70. I'd probably feel I'd missed out on a lot more if she was still alive and kicking all these years later. She'd be 82 now.

My marriage did break down, and that was also hard. But I have good friends here and am very close to my sister back home. We message constantly.

I might have moved back if I still had Mum. But I'd have to work in London on a much lower salary than here, as the industry is less well-paid in Britain, I wouldn't get the right medical care for my condition, and I wouldn't have the peace of mind that I get with my various insurances. So it would be a very difficult thing to do. With my specific set of circumstances, I'm safer and better off where I am. But oh, do I miss England and the food and the rain and the sense of humour. So much.

Moving abroad has been the education of my life. (I don't want to say where, as it's too outing.) I absolutely appreciate what we have in the UK in a way I never would have been able to otherwise.

I do think that the most serious danger of moving abroad is that you can get stuck there if you have kids and the marriage breaks down. I had NO idea whatsoever of this terrible trap when I followed my husband. As it happens, I ended up not having kids, so I'm not actually trapped. But I know someone from home who is trapped here, and it's not good. The children will be adults very soon, but they were born here and have their lives here. They are not culturally English. So if my friend wants to be a part of their lives, and her eventual grandchildren's lives, she'll have to stay too. This is how you get trapped: You end up with foreign children who only have a tenuous connection with the UK. I know another British family here who did move back to the UK, but they left their university-aged daughter here.

TLDR: It's a complicated experience of great highs and lows.

Not long term but at one point the famous ash cloud from the Icelandic volcano had the potential to take out flights for weeks and weeks. People who were a long haul flight away had to go through all kinds of high jinks to get back.

A colleague got stuck in Greece for a week after the fires before flying back via Germany as there simply wasn't capacity between chartered and scheduled flights.

I live an hours flight from "home". In a pinch it's a days drive requiring a ferry and I had to do that during Covid to maintain an appropriate level of quarantine. But it was months where travel was actively discouraged and even if you could get on a plane you certainly weren't welcome unless you had somewhere you could quarantine for 2 weeks first. That was an eye opener. Might as well have lived much further afield so to your point proximity does breed complacence of a sort on that point.

Covid, ash clouds and war aside it's fair to say that a few inches of snow for a few days has the same effect though.

I've had NHS treatment in the last few years, even though I've lived abroad for 20 years. It was free, too. 🤭

In my defence, the only reason I needed treatment was because I was spending months living at home with my widowed parent, nursing them through terminal cancer, and one night I had chest pains so went to A&E. They gave me loads of scans and follow-ups. It was at the hospital where I was born, so they knew me. I also needed to go to my GP for medication refills as I was there for much longer than I'd thought, and I did tell them I had emigrated and what the situation was. In those cases, I ended up paying 120 pounds a pop to see a private GP. But the A&E was free. I don't feel too bad because a) I paid into the NHS for years and never used it when I lived there and b) I was saving the NHS and my local council an absolute fortune with all the nursing and cooking and housekeeping skills I provided to my dad. He wouldn't have any nurses or anyone to the house, just me.

I understand. My brother lives there and only visits my elderly mother once every few years. She just can’t handle it, builds herself up, is ecstatic, then literally devastates when he goes. It’s beyond hard but you have to do it.

We had someone at work who got stuck in Australia for nearly a year during the pandemic!