No phones on ski trip

[AreTheyMad]

DD is going on a ski trip with school next week. We've just been informed they won't be allowed to use their phones during the day, only for an hour in the evening.
Would you be happy with your DC not being allowed to take their phones on the slopes?

I think it's mad, and I'm trying to formulate a mail which doesn't sound over protective pub! It means they can't call if they get separated from the group, check the map, if they injure themselves. What if the visibility is bad? Am I overreacting here?

Only a basic call & text one which she doesn’t use unless away from me. She’s obviously not allowed it at school which is fine and tbh she keeps it switched off day to day.
I got her it as I’m a lone parent and as she’s 11, I’ve started experimenting with leaving her home alone for 10/15 mins and we don’t have a landline so it’s an emergency-preparedness thing really. I 100% agree with no smartphones until much older.

OP I would also be concerned by this.

Phones are sensible skiing for the purposes of: ringing for an ambulance in an emergency, calling for help if lost, taking photos etc. Ultimately you'll barely use them anyway.

My family have skied for many years and we had one situation where a small child got lost after skiing on the side fun bits. It was before the days of phones and it ended up being a huge journey to get them back. Another time two teens got lost skiing off piste and had to call emergency services after losing skis/poles trying to get back.

I don't think either of those would happen on a school ski trip.

I would suggest having an apple tracker in her ski gear in case if you are worried. Also maybe asking the school if she can have an old phone in the pocket. Or could she have a smart watch - not sure if they work without a phone nearby as I don't have one.

How will they take photos?

If they were allowed phones last year and not this year it’s very obvious the phones caused a problem last year.

If you’ve trusted the teachers previously then you should do so again, or not send her.

But you kind of ARE tracking her.....

I would be concerned about this. Having their phone on the slopes could be life saving.

Your references are from c.2011

It is 2026 now.

I am sure the school did an updated risk assessment in the past 10-15 years.

If you do not trust the staff to manage risk then bow out of the ski trip.

This level of anxiety and scaremongering is really toxic.

@AreTheyMad @BlackRowan

The risks when a children steps out of the house whether it's to go to school or on a ski slope are all risks that parents have no control over. When they go to school and when they go on a trip with the school, the risks are handled by someone else. The simple fact is that parents don't want to hand that risk over any more and are creating streams of anxiety. In reality the school and the instructors are the best judges of risk and parents need to let them do that.

Are you from the UK?

No British school would allow any children to be on a ski slope of any kind without supervision - and that almost certainly means supervision by a qualified instructor. The school groups that I have worked with don't even allow kids to ski on the baby slopes over lunchtime without an instructor being present.

Even if a school teacher happens to be a qualified instructor, he or she is unlikely to be insured to teach on the slopes unless they are employed to instruct and if the school's liability insurance actually covers this. In many European countries, even if the teacher is a qualified instructor, they may still not be legally allowed to lead groups on the piste without meeting local laws regarding qualifications for teaching and guiding.

If your child is going off-piste with a teacher (even if he or she is qualified) then unless this person has extensive local knowledge about the terrain, the snow conditions, weather patterns and the local avalanche danger points then the absence of a phone is the least of your worries.

Do you know the safeguards that have been put in, in response to these incidents too?

I'm familiar with the Lyme Bay incident as DH is a kayak instructor. That incident resulted in major changes to the way instructors have to operate. The changes make a rare disaster really really unlikely to reoccur. The BCU have very strict training now. Its like night and day to compare conditions pre Lyme Bay with today.

Its an ongoing thing, but the failings of previous incidents are taken very seriously.

British schools have a high threshold of responsibility and ensuring safety that they all have to risk assess for as a result.

I am amused at the idea of unsupervised kids on a school trip going off piste.

I wonder if anyone has asked why the policy has changed

@drspouseMay I give you some advice? Change it to a Tile or similar non-Apple tracker. Reason being, AirTags not only need to be near an iPhone to work, they also inform the nearest Apple device that there’s an AirTag nearby. Meaning if the coat is stolen, the person who steals it (if they have an Apple device) will work out pretty quickly that there’s one in the coat and will remove it and dispose of it. They won’t however, be notified if there’s a Tile or other branded tracker.
And yes, you can still track your own Tile (or similar) using your iPhone/ipad

I imagine they will be on nursery/blue slopes. Even if your DD is an experienced skiier it will be the first for a lot of kids so they will all probably be catering to the 'worst' skiiers initially at least. They will all be in a big group. No one will be taking a wrong turn

Yes, I think it’s great. They should be enjoying life, not stuck on their phones.

When mine went to France in Y6, they weren’t allowed to even bring phones on the trip.

When she went to Germany in Y7, they were allowed to bring phones, but there was no signal at all at the accommodation and no access to WiFi. So they could use phones if out and about, if signal, during the day, but from 5pm ish til about 9/10am the next morning, no signal so phones not usable.

I’d be happier if no phones were allowed at all, but the nervous Nellies who don’t want their dc missing out on posting on TikTok would have an aneurysm.

@RedToothBrush I am amused at the idea of unsupervised kids on a school trip going off piste.

I'm frankly horrified at the thought - particularly as there has been heacy snowfall in much of the Alps over the last week, with more forecast, and the OP's child is presumably going over the next week or so. Avalanche deaths in the Alps this year are already far above normal levels.

This thread shows it's definitely more about parental control than anything else.

As I say, the question you should be asking isn't about phones and complaining about not having them. The question is about the level of instructor, the risk assessments and supervision plans.

As per a previous poster, the phone should be the least of your worries.

@AreTheyMad you could ask why policy has changed rather than demand your DD can take a phone. Can ask about risk assessment with avalanche risk and what alternative activities will be in place if skiing not possible

That was one person, not multiple as you claimed. Also, the Coroner's Report did not assign blame to the school but it did suggest that there should be increased training of sepsis awareness in all schools.

From the Coroner's Report:

Circumstances of the Death

Ana had been unwell before her trip with the school but it was when she was on the trip in New York when she became more unwell. To those around her she had cold/flu symptoms. It was reported that she told the teachers on the trip about not feeling well. She had sepsis, deteriorated and collapsed in her hotel room.

But you, I presume, were on there by yourself. Not on an organised school trip.

If she wants pictures what about a cheap digital camera?

But really she's there to learn to ski, enjoy skiing, enjoying the ,real time, company of her friends.

But you're presumably skiing in a social group where everyone is responsible for their own actions.

A school ski group will be under the leadership of an instructor, who is legally responsible for the safety of the students while they are with him or her, and usually there will also be a teacher skiing at the back of the group as back-up (although the instructor has the legal responsibility during the lesson).

And on the point of "legal responsibility" it is the instructor who gets to decide what is acceptable in the lesson - not the school teachers. Any student who messes around, constantly scrolls on their phone or who is generally disruptive is not going to be allowed to continue the lesson.

@AreTheyMad have you asked your DD if she knows why they have changed policy? Did she know before you? Does she know who she will be skiing with, instructors?

I'd be more concerned at the idea of an unqualified member of staff taking them on black runs and off piste!!

Surely a school ski trip should include some formal lessons - and some restrictions about where to ski? Off piste is a no no in most of the Alps at the moment.....

Totally overreacting. She’s in a group, she won’t be left unaccompanied. If she follows the piste she’ll get to the bottom eventually anyway

Please will you quote people when you post.
There's a Quote button under every post, on the left.
Thank you.

It’s a great idea. Phones ruin school trips. They’re addicted to them, and the time leading up to returning them for an hour in the evening is awful. In the end I told my group that the next student who asked ‘How long till we get our phones back?’ wouldn’t have it at all. Not a peep after that.

My trip was UK based. We had students telling parents ridiculous tales of untrue incidents. Sobbing kids who’d been fine until they heard a parent’s voice. Kids running into each other’s rooms taking photos of them -dressed & undressed. Lots of online bullying.

I work in a totally phone free school now. It’s fantastic for the kids. They run around and chat at lunchtimes, build camps. Their levels of concentration and engagement are high.They’re far more resilient and confident. Not one has ever complained to me that they don’t have their phone during the day.