Funeral etiquette

[StarlingTheConqueror]

I’m helping dh cousin to organise a funeral for her father (not dh uncle). And I’m a bit baffled by it all. Now I’m not British. I’ve been to a few funerals in the U.K. but still….
Can I ask what you’d see as ‘normal’ for a funeral?

1- you’d expect direct family members to come with their +1 (not the new bf/gf but significant other/partner/married)
2- people asking who is going to do the eulogy because ‘Theyre looking forward to learn more about <insert name of the deceased>’. These are direct family members.
3- people being open'y critical that there is no church service and only the very close family (that will be the cousin and his 2 dds. Atm he doesn’t want anyone else there) will be at the crematorium.

Im trying to field a lot of the questions/comments for him and I’m baffled as to what to answer…..

If the service is at the crem, then you could say "close family only" or some other other form of words.

But most crems have more than one room, depending on the expected turnout, I thought?

I've been to both religious and humanist services and they follow similar formats but you can have anything you want, within reason. I think the main thing is being VERY CLEAR with relatives and friends, who will have expectations and also want to show their respects.

We had a family funeral last year at a crematorium and specified it was for close family only - so not a public event at all. Everyone respected our wishes.

OP re no2, you often do learn new things about the deceased even if you were close - someone who knew them in childhood for example, or worked with them, will know different things than one of their children

Funeral directors sometimes have a small chapel to have them at. Round here some humanist services are held in the community centre as it’s a lovely wee old building.

People may be confused as a non religious funeral with cremation normally has everyone attend the crematorium.

If he’s looking to have a funeral - ie with the coffin and prior to the cremation - then he needs to speak with his funeral director and work out where he’ll have it.

If he’s not planning having the coffin there then it’s more a memorial service he’s having and that may be what’s causing the confusion.

Non religious funerals are very common - but they’re usually done at the crematorium or at the undertakers before burial.

You don’t invite people, you just give out the details and whoever turns up turns up, you just kind of guess at numbers.

I think the wording you’d be looking for is more along the lines of

Private funeral, memorial service at X on Y date etc.

Then people know they’re not going to the first unless invited and to go to the second bit.

We had a non-religious funeral at a Crem and the room held 100 people. Do you know for sure that the room can only accommodate small numbers?

all ours have been non religious at the crematorium.

ie everyome makes their way to the crem. the coffin and immediately family arrive in big black cars. people get shown in. the coffin gets carried in and everyome stands. they sit down and someone speaks about them. sometimes others get up to also do so. the curtains close over the coffin or it vanishes into the back or down ie it’s gone. carefully chosen plays and there’s a few minutes silence. everyone is invited to the purvey/wake/whatever you call it in your part of the country. In scotland it’s generally a nearby venue where you have a sandwich buffet or if just close family and friends (as the person didjt have many) a hot meal (you need to know numbers in advance for this catering not just rough numbers like a buffet so it’s rarer).

nobody tends to say much at this after event. just a few toasts. ive never been to a memorial service so i dont know about those.

I agree with the posters that people are confused by the mixed messaging. You need to say there is a direct/closed cremation without a service. (In fact immediate family do sometimes attend but the date and time aren't announced more widely.) Then a separate memorial service/celebration of life to which everyone is invited. You need to make clear that these were the express wishes of the deceased.

It's common for there to be a eulogy of sorts at the main service. I have often been surprised by what I learned about people I thought I knew well already. That is probably what they mean. I've also been to a couple of funerals where there was no single eulogy but everyone was invited to share a memory if they wanted to and that was really lovely as there were lots of interesting, moving or funny little stories shared.

Yes it's normal to include plus ones in the invitation to the main service but also common for plus ones to not come due to fairly short notice/annual leave/childcare.

My FIL had a non religious funeral. Had a celebrant to conduct the running order and eulogy.
It was in one of the larger crematorium rooms.
It was still a public event. Anyone who wanted to pay respects were able to.

Non religious funerals are of course a thing. 🤷🏻‍♀️ I went to one on Friday, at the crematorium. The readings were poetry and the music was sea shanties and rock music!

I think the bit your cousin is getting wrong is trying to make the bit that is culturally public and open to everyone, private. People don’t understand that there is something else in addition to the crematorium service. And normally it’s all the crematorium where you tell people where to go for the next bit. Also normally the service (religious or not) where the eulogy is read has the body there. Are you planning to take it away from the crematorium and then bring it back?

I think it’s just trying to do something a bit strange and people aren’t understanding.

Not at all, they just aren’t often called funerals but likes of a Celebration of Life or memorial service and can be non religious and held anywhere, with a celebrant to oversee it (religious or non religious), might be same day as the cremation or sometime later. A wake is the drinks and nibbles often laid on for those who have gathered,

Service where the deceased is present- funeral.
Will be religious in a church, either or in a crem.
Church is open to the public, crem isn’t- but either way people will only know when/where it is if you tell them.

In England, the wake is the bit where people gather for a drink and something light to eat after the service. Some people will have travelled a long way. There might be a brief speech of welcome, or thank you for coming. The estates covers the costs, though if there’s a bar people buy their own.

Memorial service is an event at some point that’s not directly connected to the disposal of the body. There may be slide shows, people may speak about the person being remembered. Sometimes, the urn of remains will be there.

The funeral director should be good at explaining and guiding you through this.

I can’t recall the last religious funeral I went to. They’ve all been non religious. It’s what I also want when the time comes but I am having a direct cremation. I don’t want friends and family sat in a crematorium costing thousands listening to someone talk about me who doesn’t actually know me. DH, if he’s still here can have something at the house for me and then scatter me in the woods.

It sounds like the bereaved is trying to organise a funeral without the people who usually organise it. If you have a religious funeral then it’s the minister or priest. If it’s a non religious funeral it’s a celebrant. We have done hundreds of them and know how it works. I’m finding more and more people trying to organise a funeral/memorial service/celebration of life and getting very stressed because they have never done it before.

I wonder if you are actually planning a wake, which is essentially a party, and this is where the mixed messages are happening.

The usual order is funeral at a crematorium or church and then a wake at a pub, hotel or back at the house. The same people go to both.

Another way of doing this is a private funeral on one day and a memorial service at a later date. The public event is the second one. There is usually food after both, but obviously on a different scale.

The critical question is what is this? A party or a service. If it is a service then the celebrant will do a lot of the organising for you or will at least be the person to ask the questions.

Have unfortunately had a lot of experience this year so far.
Mum had a direct cremation. No one there, she said her friends were all dead or infirm, and family spread around the globe. We all had our own drink in the pub wherever we were , with facetime...
MIL had a funeral at the crem. With a celebrant who came to the house to get all the info needed for the eulogy. Family were widespread, friends dead or infirm, had 15 people there, mostly family, went to the pub for a drink after.
Stepmum had a funeral at the crem, large family, loads of friends from carehome, etc (she had been active in the community and in good health) About 160 people there, eulogy by celebrant with input from some parts of the family, so one or 2 parts of it were missing or "sketchy". Didn't matter, don't really understand relying on a funeral to get to know about a dead person's life.
The last 2 were funerals so anyone could come. Both arranged by the co-op, so ran smoothly, they've done a few... was nice to just put it in their hands.

As others have said it os not clear what you are asking people to attend.

There is a private Crematorium service.

So where and when is the service with a Eulogy. Before or after?

It doesn’t really matter what everyone sees as normal , you’ve explained why this poor chap wants what he does. In fact, I was at a memorial/ life celebration only this week where there had been a direct cremation- that meant no one at all at the cremation, which happened a few days before the memorial.
In that case, there was a large gathering at a community centre, and invitations were sent by text to almost everyone the deceased had known , who the family thought might want to come. Within the invite was a request that anyone who would like to give a eulogy ( mini speech) should let the organiser know. A family member acted as MC on the day, introducing the speakers, but there wasn’t an official celebrant. This was the third funeral that I have been to arranged in this way. There was some catering in terms of sandwiches/ cakes etc, some alcohol provided, in one case there there was an on-site bar. It was less formal and more relaxed than a traditional funeral.
Your poor cousin has been through a terrible time, if he wants a private cremation that’s his choice. You can tell everyone querying it that. Nobody else needs to know when the cremation is if he doesn’t want people there. People may comment and have their own feelings about it, it might be seen by some as shutting them out. They can have those feelings. Nobody is right or wrong here, but it’s the closest family ( in this case, the son) who make these decisions.

Thank you all. That was all very helpful.

Ive had a chat with cousin since and really the issue isn’t that much confusion from people but some family members wanting things to happen a certain way and being upset at being ‘sidelined’ ie not invited to the crematorium.
Cue for pushing for all sorts of- like I should be able to come with my partner, we won’t be there for the eulogy this is disgraceful. Why aren’t you having a proper funeral etc….

@DelphiniumBlue cousin idea is quite similar to what you’ve described. Still in two minds about having a celebrant there or just letting people saying a few words.
I’m hoping he’ll have a few more people to the cremation. At the very least, so he can have more support at that time.
And I’ve had a chat with dh, we’re going to propose to him to field some of the ‘requests’ for him explain again to people the organisation so he doesn’t feel as much under pressure from everyone and can organise things his way iyswim.

@StarlingTheConqueror I think it’s worth explaining to him that while he is the key mourner, other people will be mourning too. When we don’t follow the usual protocol it impacts more people than just us. We all hold multiple roles- yes Dad, but also Uncle, Friend, Neighbour etc. We are missed more widely than we realise and some of the rituals have purpose we don’t always appreciate.

Of course it rests with him and he can do what he prefers- and I’d fight for his right- but it’s good to know what you are rejecting.

DM was sole organiser of Dad’s funeral. She ignored everyone else’s grief, and organised a total extravaganza of a funeral. We didn’t get to contribute as much as a hymn or reading. We noticed and felt it deeply.

You can have a non religious funeral and burial.
There's an eco burial place we went to, a non religious funeral was held with a celebrant leading proceedings. The burial then took place within it's grounds and by the time everyone headed back the venue had been turned around ready for the wake.
It was the best non traditional and non religious funeral I've ever been to (it was also packed).

@PrizedPickledPopcorn the issue here isn’t that much the cousin imposing what he wants despite tye fact it’s unusual but some other family members very forceful demanding that things to be done THEIR way. Hence the reaction/pushback
Think them demanding a church funeral service when the father had been extremely clear he did NOT want a church service.

Everyone will be able to say their goodbyes. There will be a eulogy. There will be a wake. Just not in a church. And not at the crem either.

I think if the deceased had specified something about the funeral they would like, it should be respected and done if at all possible. My late mother asked for a specific gospel reading and chose some hymns, and having been a church organist for me and my family was important to honour.

Much as it is your cousin's right to have a tiny funeral with only 3 mourners he has to accept it's very unusual and it will be upsetting a lot of people. He needs to be very clear that the funeral will be very small but there will be a memorial service that will include eulogies and other celebration that everyone will be welcome to.

And possibly consider making it easier on himself by not insisting on two separate occasions but having everyone to the actual funeral at the crematorium and having all the elements of a funeral just at the funeral rather than the confusing second occasion.

Well maybe the people who are the most upset could have considered his feelings first? Like by not insisting for a church funeral his father didn’t want?

Much too easy to blame the cousin really when the issue was the family members demanding stuff that weren’t acceptable, all in the grounds that it’s not ‘traditional’.
A funeral is the last place you want to make demands in that way. And telling cousin it’s somehow his fault sounds to close to victim blaming to my liking tbh.

I, on a lersonal pov, hope he’ll have more people at the crem, for his and his dds benefit. But not to appease a few people who should know better.

I'm not blaming anyone. I'm just saying he has set up an unusual situation and that will invite questions if people don't quite understand what is going on.

Nobody should be insisting on anything, I quite agree but I also think if you go that much against the norm, by not inviting people to the actual funeral, you do have to be prepared to answer a few questions from potentially hurt family and friends.