I have an interview (admin NHS), but lack qualifications proof

[user1471867483]

I've been shortlisted for a band 4 NHS job, but I don't meet the essential GCSE Maths and English criteria since I'm from the O level and CSE days. I wrote on the application form that I have O level grade C in both subjects from 1987, but I can't prove it because I don’t have the certificates anymore (I'm 54), plus my secondary school closed down over 10 years ago. My only strong point is my 30 years of NHS experience, plus a bit in private healthcare. The interview is remote, and I have to show my qualifications (which I can't verify) into the camera and my photo ID, which I do have. What should I do?

I worked in HR for a NHS trust processing new recruits and this was always a nightmare. If the job description doesn’t state “or equivalent experience” or something alongside the qualification, then we absolutely had to see the qualification certificate and couldn’t approve someone’s pre-appointment checks until we had. Might depend on the trust though!

See this makes it even worse. So dependant on which hiring manager writes the recruitment advert, you can say “or equivalent experience” and hire the same candidate who you would reject if the hiring manager hadn’t put that in the recruitment literature.

I don’t know how the nhs get away with this unfair recruitment. Although, tbf they are regularly in tribunal so maybe they just plough on regardless

Due to the area I work in, I can confirm again in education, NHS and local government they regularly ask for proof of certificates, if you don't have them and can't get them you may be asked to sit and obtain functional skills Math and English level 2 which is equivalent. Once someone has looked at these (mainly maths) they go all out to get copies of certificates as they are not easy for many, but do not cover as much as GCSEs. I am not saying this is right or wrong, it is my experience of interactions with these establishments. I have also known ppl who have worked for years in the same job going for promotion having to prove or do the functional skills. Times are changing, and have been told this is often govt led. In previous post when I said ask on FB, I meant eg Anyone went to"school of hard knocks"" 76 to 81? Do you know what exam board we did for Maths and English ?

Agreed, we used to have tons asking for a specific old fashioned typing qualification (RSA level 2) and managed to get some managers to amend job descriptions to “or equivalent experience” before it went to advert. They often just recycled old job descriptions without much thought. In HR we had to copy and sign to check all qualifications listed on job descriptions and record on file, which were then randomly audited so if we missed anything we were dragged into an office for a telling off.

WOW!!

Yes the ones who had worked there for many many years and going for promotions etc and then got stopped at pre-employment checks as they didn’t have the GCSE certs came up regularly too!

When was that? Because I’ve never, ever been asked for my degree certificate, let alone anything else.

I’m the O level generation
I’ve got my certificates and if I was applying for a job that needed GCSE’s / O levels I would expect to be able to evidence the qualifications I am saying I have

that’s not age discrimination- it’s about governance

the NHS needs to be able to assure that people are who they say they are and have the qualifications and experience they say they have

admin roles have access to patient medical records, are responsible for clinical documents etc etc

if someone has qualifications from another country that they can’t produce is it discriminatory to not accept their word that they have them without evidence ?

it is a basic expectation that if u are applying for roles that require qualifications that you ca evidence it

the posters saying they have worked in NHS for decades and they haven’t show their qualifications have probably forgotten that when they were first employed by NHS they were ID checked and copies of their qualifications taken which are then kept on their HR file

My health board required my GCSE certificates and my degree - which in itself required maths and English.

Have you got any other qualifications that would be the equivalent or higher? For example a full NVQ level 3 for business Admin that I did at my local college (was over 25 yrs ago mind) included numeracy and English and if you passed was the equivalent as grade C in GSCE. This might be easier to obtain a copy of

In the OP’s case common sense says doing the job for thirty years trumps a bit of paper from the 1980’s indicating what she knew as a 16 year old! Showing a degree certificate, which requires certain qualifications to seat the course, similarly should be enough as, again, by definition the applicant must have had those qualifications to obtain the degree. WRT foreign qualifications how would the average recruiter know if a particular result was equivalent to GCSE? Wouldn’t work experience count for more?

My degree certificate from Cambridge doesn’t say the grade - we didn’t get a transcript. People have to take my word for it that I got a 2:1!! (Although I’m sure I could ask for proof if required, but I never have been).

No one is saying that O levels are not acceptable. I’ve never had an issue (and if I did, that would be age discrimination).

So why is it age discrimination to ask for certificates? What are the barriers to producing paper evidence? And why do these barriers not apply to people in their 40s?

I have my certificates as does a PP. The ability to keep important documents is not age-dependent.

Same. And that’s if anyone had even asked it which they never have.

I do think there is an argument (as I said earlier) for a test to be sat by applicants to show their ability in maths and English – and of course that might have more value than a decades-old certificate.

A friend of mine was applying for a job (in the NHS!) and it said degree (which they do not have at all, not just not got the cert) but crucially also said "or relevant experience". Maybe more roles should use that form of words.

Surely you understand that organisations such as NHS -
cannot rely on ‘common sense’, the applicants say so and even apparent work experience !!!
NHS admin staff are responsible for handling clinical documentation, booking appts, responsible for highly confidential information etc etc

OP is applying for a band 4 role which would be overseeing junior admin staff -
surely you don’t want NHS staff employed without evidence of their CV being authentic

If having a degree was a requirement of the job (and didn’t say “or equivalent experience”) I’m surprised in the NHS. But like I say, it might be trust dependent!
Whilst I worked there a woman in admin got caught out (she was crap at her job) and when HR investigated she had faked a qualification certificate!

The NHS get externally audited on staff having the qualifications they claim they have, and there can be serious repercussions if somebody has actually lied (not saying you have, but you can see why they have to be thorough). www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-62591282

But a 50 year old presumably haven’t put “cse English” on their CV (do the nhs even accept cvs I thought they made you do convoluted application forms) rather the job they’ve applied for says they must have GCSE English and maths.

Which they don’t, because they didn’t exist then, so they have to prove they have the school leaver equivalent of the time. Common sense dictates that many 50 year olds would not have kept the slips their results came on for 35 years?!

I had to show my O level Maths and English for my last job aged 58.if it does fall through then get yourself on functional skills course asap and get newer qualifications.

Last comment on this .
someone from the o level generation will be aware that jobs requesting GCSE’s will be the same as O levels / CSE’s

you may have Scottish highers, international baccalaureate, qualifications from overseas

whatever …

if u are applying for a job in a statutory organisation like NHS you will be required to evidence your qualifications if they are essential criteria on the person spec -

it’s as simple as that

OK so as I say, I have O levels and they have been accepted in a number of places where GCSE was requested – including the NHS and post-grad teacher training. Just as now jobs and training places will ask for a grade 4 in maths and Eng – obvs a pre-2017 C is also acceptable.

And honestly I agree with @PolyVagalNerve – it’s about governance. I have an envelope with my certificates in it. Not results slips actually. A4 pieces of card that I was given in the 1980s. I have moved house many times and managed to hang on to them. People keep their birth certs, marriage certs, passports, driving licences. It’s a good idea to do so actually. As is clear from this thread.

I should’ve provided mine and explained due to 3 house moves in the space of just two years, I’d misplaced my record of achievement and didn’t have the proof. 5 years later I’m still in position!

Most of the old boards have amalgamated with one another.

The current main ones are:

OCR, www.ocr.org.uk, contact [email protected]

AQA, www.aqa.org.uk, contact 0800 1977172

and Pearson/Edexcel, www.qualifications.pearson.com, contact [email protected]

If you know which board you sat let me know, if not try all three of those contacts.

Students still get paper copies of their certificates and are warned that they need to retain them for ever!
no age discrimination going on as there is nothing digital about the process.

I recently moved from one public sector after 30 years to another and fully expected to have to evidence the qualifications that I had included in my job application.