Kemi B and Rachel R - theatrics for the House of Commons or genuine dislike?

[headtohead]

I was talking to DH earlier about Kemi wiping the floor during her speech with Rachel Reeves after the budget yesterday and he said it was simply theatrics and all staged. He said that they were likely fine with one another and most likely they’ll have had a drink together in the bar afterwards!

Surely not? Does anyone close to parliament know if opposing parties are actually friendly and outside of the debating chamber they all get on just fine?

Not sure on that but I agree with you on other point, Kemi came across so well. She clearly knows herself and what she believes (rightly or wrongly). A complete contrast to the dithering, in/out approach and lacking of character Rachel

I do not believe they chat over a drink in the commons.

Although I’m sure they’re perfectly capable of being polite and not yelling insults at each other if they pass in the corridor.

I’d say it’s theatrics on the part of the Tories - they saw an opening and took it - but I wouldn’t go so far as to say they are bosom buddies who might share a drink at the pub. I don’t believe they’re sworn enemies either.

This is so interesting, I thought she came across as unprofessional and downright petty with the personal attacks and talking in the silly baby voice to mock the chancellor. I’m not a fan of either of them, but I thought Kemi just came across as plain nasty. It’s really why I don’t watch the commons much these days - I’m all for them attacking policies, but the personal attacks are really off putting.

The government in charge and the opposition have more cross party talks than we know about. I heewrd this once during a political debate and it surprised me. They probably don’t all agree, but it does make sense.

I agree the personal attacks and childish mocking undermined Kemi's otherwise sensible speech. I'm not a fan of either party though, yet I agree that this budget was a complete mess.

it's Kemis job to go on the attack. She will be prob be fighting her own party soon enough so she has to take the opportunity to attack the opposition. But they do work in the same job.

KB was on Political Thinking & explained that RR had a long go at Tories as her preamble to announcing the Budget. KB decided to pull no punches after that.

Well I don’t believe that really. I would assume she had a lot of that scripted and written down in advance so she could listen to what was being said and add in any specific comments.

The old cliche in politics is that the people sitting opposite you are your opponents. Your enemies are those sitting behind you.

Reeves usually gets on fine with her opposite numbers, I remember she & Rishi Sunak obviously liked & respected each other when they were opponents. George Osborne & Ed Balls are now buddies who do a podcast together. David Cameron’s relationship with Tony Blair can only be described as fan-boy hero-worship.

I get the impression that Badenoch is different. She obviously doesn’t care about being liked & isn’t shy about playing the woman (or man) not the ball. Her default tone is condescension and by all accounts she is often gratuitously rude to people. The problem with that approach in politics is that eventually you run out of allies.

It's her job to attack the policies, not the person. She comes across as a hard-nosed b1tch. Deeply unpleasant.

That said, I do think RR needs to stop wearing her heart on her sleeve. I'm prepared to give her (and Keir S) a chance, but I don't want to listen to her playing the victim card.

I felt RR was shrieking her budget from the despatch box. This is not commanding respect. Nothing stopping her doing it in controlled, steady, measured tone. We were all listening.
and Kemi just whinges full rant about all that’s wrong -why not tell us what she is going to do to fix things -if she doesn’t improve she’ll be got rid of and serves her right.

And Keir sounds like a nervous headmaster

She was absolutely livid that the thing had already been leaked. No wonder it wasn't as measured as she'd liked it to have been.

Would you criticise a male politician for 'shrieking' or 'whinges', or just the female ones?

I agree with this ^
I felt that Kemi just pushed her narrative. She commented how owners of EVs in rural areas would be affected by new tax and how Labour didn’t care about rural areas. I don’t believe that private ownership of EVs are so popular in rural areas. And that tax actually got positive response from economists.

I agree, it is interesting. If you watch PMQ highlights, you’ll see that she takes a lot of condescension and insults from Starmer. I suppose its the culture of the commons and its adversarial nature. I am glad to see her dish it out and not just take it.

I only watched the chancellor onwards and didn’t see Starmer’s speech - I wish they would all just pack it in. There’s enough nastiness around between people with differing political opinions, they could set a better example.

That really is what you saw? God that proves how different people can interpret the same thing so differently.

I've been waiting to see Kemi come alive. She was absolutely brilliant for the way she attacked Rachel from Accounts. Unfortunately for us Reeves lied on her CV. She lied about being a Chess Champion when she only came 26th in a Chess contest. She lied about the Black Hole. She has upset all the farmers, driving some to suicide. Made hundreds of old people die of cold. She blames men for "mansplaining" but she truly is incompetent.

Funny how people can see things differently. I think Kemi is beyond incompetent and doing a really poor job. Her PMQs are embarrassingly bad. Don't disagree that all govts need to be held to account but she isn't doing a good job of this.

Would this thread have been started if Badenbach was male saying those words about a male chancellor?

I would accuse males of shrieking if they did but on the whole they don’t need to as they have louder voices -KB raises her voice but she has quite a deep voice and shouts.
There is an issue with women’s voices not being loud and not sounding serious enough if they are high pitched. It’s unfortunate but listening to TRIP I think it was , MPs are offered classes in speech making and meeting management but don’t take them.
There was a reason Mrs T had voice coaching to lower her voice and it worked well for her.
The world was watching RR - she could have been much more statesmanlike and less angry teacher.

She is good enough for now but she is only holding the place. A better candidate comes along or the Conservatives are defeated in the next election and she will be gone

Yes, I think the chance of Starmer and Badenoch being the leaders of their respective parties come the next general election is pretty small.

Yes Starmer has been extremely vile towards KB previously, incredibly misogynistic. But then Labour have always had a problem with women, especially women of colour.