Discipline for kids breaking things...

[HairsprayBabe]

DS5 has been repeatedly, for months, possibly even years, told not to climb on his and his sisters bunk bed in a specific way as I was concerned he or DD would get hurt or the bed would be broken.

This morning I go in and the bed is broken DS has been climbing on it again - DH is going to attempt to repair it tonight.

I am normally one for natural or related consequences - e.g. if you break a toy that's the end of it and you aren't getting another, if you throw a ball indoors the ball is taken away etc...

I obviously can't remove bed - that is insane. So how do I discipline this and keep it relatable for a 5yo.

He is a clever little thing no SEN to consider. In addition he also tried to blame the break on DD but immediately crumbled and burst into tears admitting it was him so I don't think he has a life of deceit ahead of him.

Oh dear. I remember breaking my bed by jumping on it when I was little and feeling so guilty!
He's only five, so I'd probably go with the "helping" to make repairs and to remake the bed and tidy up. If you break something, you have to take responsibility for the work that goes into repairs. Obviously he won't be helpful at his age, but it's a lesson.

@Vikolb that's the most frustrating part is that it had been said SO many times. Part of me wonders if the bed breading itself will teach him that mummy doesn't just say things for fun.

It was a really stressful morning they were both crying DH was furious* (not surprising considering he is the muggins that is going to have to try and fix it!) and I was just trying to get us all out the door I'm so frazzled!

I just think WHY can't you bloody listen I am SO desperate for that impulse control to develop! Not sure DH will appreciate a helper - but that's parenting!

*not shouty or aggressive to be clear

🤔 This is such a weird post on so many levels.

OP just make it really clear that he is never to do anything like that again, maybe no screens or treats for a couple of days. They absolutely can link that back to behaviour at this age. He seems upset that he broke it which means he knows he did wrong.

Unfortunately he’s not mature enough for this. Bunk beds (top or bottom) are only recommended from the age of 6 because this is a foreseeable high risk.

@PflumPfeffer the kids are screen free anyway,

@FuzzyWolf I am aware of the risks and happy with the bed - not to mention it isn't relevant and I didn't' ask - It is a 1/2 height with a toddler floor bed the height is not dangerous.

What was he actually doing and how did they break? I’d more concerned that either the beds have some sort of manufacturing defect or he’s not mature enough for bunk beds (they are supposed to be for over 6s) and that there’s a safety risk by keeping them. But whatever it is, he’s been repeatedly told no and has ignored you, whatever you’d normally do for that e.g. loss of TV time is an appropriate consequence. I wouldn’t get him involved with fixing as PP suggests because actually that sounds like a fun reward but also if you are keeping them DH needs to concentrate to make sure they’re safe not be distracted by a 5YO who has form for not following instructions…

@Bitzee It's hard to describe - but the bed is specifically designed for young children it is a 1/2 height and a toddler floor bed - nothing wrong with it structurally, as long as it is used correctly - which is I would expect from any piece of furniture. It has a shelf section on the end - not for climbing, shelves were climbed rather than the ladder used.

We have no other space for other sleeping arrangements to it is pointless to suggest anything else.

I do agree that "helping" sounds like a treat not a consequence, the children are already screen free, not listening usually results in cancelling specific plans but we don't have anything coming up at the moment.

For me, a natural consequence in that situation would be, "well now we have to spend money fixing the bed which means we don't have money to do XYZ this weekend, or buy XYZ that you wanted."

XYZ could be anything they like doing, going to the cinema, buying a treat for pudding etc.

Why are you so set against your son 'helping' the repair? It will be boring. He will be able to see that DH is having to work to fix the thing he broke. He will see the consequence. No bunk bed is meant for an under 6 year old and the shelving would be just too tempting to climb. You have set him up to fail and now seem to be making excuses for every constructive advise suggested.

Can you remove the shelf section from the end of the bed? It does seem like a design flaw if it’s a product sold as ok for toddlers with a floor bed bit. Obviously your 5YO should have known better but a 2YO wouldn’t necessarily and I don’t think that sounds safe...
Natural consequence could be that you and DH don’t have time to play with him tonight because you’re too busy fixing the damage. He’s clearly sorry and knows he did something wrong so I don’t think you need to do too much by way of punishment.

We put a mattress on the floor.

can’t fall off it, can’t break it.

@OneFairEagle
No I haven't I bought a bed designed for my children's age group, that adheres to all current safety standards.
I don't think my son will find the repair boring, I do think he will distract and annoy my husband.
I am happy to remove something from him, but my children don't have screens as previous posters have suggested, playtime is probably a better option.
I am not shooting anything down, I am discussing things with other posters in this discussion forum - you don't seem to have anything helpful to add to the discussion, just an uncalled for attitude.

@Bitzee I think that's what DH plan is. The ladder part is more like steps, and the rail is not a flat panel not climbable, the top bed is no higher than a mid sleeper. I do agree the shelves are poorly thought out but oddly they weren't an issue when he was a toddler the climbing the "wrong way" started when he was around 4.

@Octavia64 I have two children sharing - I can't fit two beds in the room unless they bunk

I think the natural consequences are:

• there is no time for something nice because DH has got to fix the bed.

• there is no money for something nice because you have to buy a new bed/pay for materials to fix the bed.

• he loses some independent privileges because you can't trust him to listen and follow instructions.

I think the natural consequence is Mummy and Daddy being cross and disappointed and feeling regret over not listening to them. It is ok to be cross sometimes - obviously screaming and shouting is not ok - but I think it's ok to teach kids that upsetting someone is a consequence in itself. We encourage kids to express what they're feeling, why shouldn't parents?

@MotherofPufflings that's a really good point thank you, I do want him to know we are cross/upset about it.
5 is a tricky age they aren't babies/toddlers anymore but they haven't quite grasped the big kid impulse control and empathy yet!

I think the reduced time for play/reading etc this evening due to the bed being broken is also going to be part of it too. @NuffSaidSam

You can have SEN and still be clever

@jokkkshfjjf I said "he is a clever little thing no SEN to consider"

I gave two facts about him.

I did not say that you can't be clever with SEN.

From someone with SEN who would class herself as clever - Married to someone with SEN who is also clever.

Don't hear what I didn't say.

Whether you intended it or not you can surely see how someone could interpret it that way! You can just laugh…or apologise, rather than get defensive. I was drawn to the thread because what you describe is very ADHD behaviour (repeated asking, climbing) but I wasn’t going to say anything because I know it’s annoying when someone says “what about!” But then you said he was clever so….

And FYI the emoji helps you detect the fact I wasn’t being overly serious.

A piece of children’s bedroom furniture designed in such a way, that for months you have known was fragile and relatively easily broken by a five year old, is an expensive purchase mistake.
5 yr olds climb.
Don’t buy poorly designed/fabricated furniture.

Yes exactly. It’s a bed so the kids are inevitably going to be left unsupervised with it and sounds like it’s being sold as safe for little kids if it features a toddler floor bed. It’s really not fit for purpose by the sounds of it because it should be able to stand up to all the silly stuff small children do. Like climb shelves. Ikea wouldn’t sell a bookshelf with a wall anchor kit because they know kids climb! Honestly OP I’d be quietly relieved that it was him and not the younger sibling and that no serious injury occurred. Also credit where credit is due- he fessed up and took responsibility. I wouldn’t be too hard on him. You were cross this morning and there were tears. He’ll have to miss out on play/story time with you this evening because of the time needed to fix the bed. I honestly think that’s enough. But whatever you do don’t put the shelf bit back on when you fix the bed.

Honestly I wouldn't get hung up on all consequences needing to be related or natural etc. TBH I find most of the time when people are trying to do this they are still thinking along the lines of it "needing" to be something that will bother the child so that they either understand the impact of their behaviour or are dissuaded from doing the thing again. And TBH you can achieve both things with a generic consequence if you think it needs one. It's more predictable, less mental effort for the parent and that means it's likely to be fair - apparently if you're trying to come up with a new consequence for everything you're much more likely to be doing it in the moment and thinking up a consequence in the moment tends to make them harsher because you're feeling more emotional.

I see the appeal in natural/related consequences because it feels more logical (or maybe less harsh?) in a way but there isn't actually any evidence supporting it, I think it's an online fad that just creates more work for parents (usually mums). Sometimes it can be really obvious and simple e.g. come off game console nicely or lose game time tomorrow - in which case fine, but if you're tying yourself in knots trying to find something that can possibly be related, don't. Give a generic consequence (lost privilege, time out, etc) or don't artificially add on a consequence at all.

Your reaction in the moment tends to communicate that you're annoyed/disappointed/upset etc - 5 is old enough to take this in and I don't think it's terrible if an adult expresses frustration in a non ideal way (as long as we're not talking abuse obviously!) And you can also talk more calmly through it later (esp if you later feel you overreacted or everyone was too heightened for them to really learn anything).

In terms of future prevention - I have a bit of a rough mental flow chart - is this actually an adult issue i.e. was the bed actually fit for purpose if a 5yo can break it? It sounds like it was more the shelves on the side which are a poorly thought out design rather than the bed itself being unsafe, but I think people are fair to question this. It probably makes sense to remove the shelf if it can't be reinforced enough to climb on safely - your toddler will only go and do the same thing later.

Then - is this something that's a repeated issue ie do we need to work on the positive opposite expectation/skill? That is usually more effective than a negative consequence, especially if you're giving repeated consequences for the same thing and it's not going in - this is a big green light that you want to work on the actual behaviour expectation, rather than trying to squash the unwanted behaviour. (e.g. in this case it might be about reinforcing care and attention around items which may break.)

Agree it can be helpful to show them the impact of something if they don't initially get it e.g. show them how the item is broken and why it can't be easily fixed, and if there's a way for them to make amends by putting it right that can be helpful esp if they clearly feel bad about it.

Totally agree with this.