Would you leave UK if Reeves starts taxing wealth

[Movingmarble]

Just that really. Wondering if anyone else considering it. DCs both at Uni in next year. We had thought of living abroad a few months each year anyway but now UK is getting worse and worse for tax. Not super wealthy but millionaires on paper and with various investments. Been to advisor and would have IHT bill of £1 mill + if we stayed which makes me so angry. Worked hard for so many years to provide for our family and feels too harsh.
Spoke to our eldest about this and she even said so many of her friends have parents who have moved abroad in last few years. We are lucky we have options for countries, feels hard but then a flight is actually fast than driving up and down to where DC are at Uni so makes me wonder.....

Feel so fed up the constant threats to those who have saved for future and not got into debt through spending on material things or holidays, tech etc etc....

I absolutely don't blame OP and would be mindful to do the same myself.

OP will have undoubtedly already paid loads of tax already if she has managed to accrue this amount of wealth. Whether it's through income tax, CGT, Stamp Duty etc the state will have already taken a large cut of her family's earnings and I suspect that she is was of a dwindling number of net tax contributors keeping everyone else afloat. Now they are suggesting that the government can randomly take an arbitrary amount of your wealth for no other reason than you have more money than everyone else because they can't control public spending and get a grip with the required welfare returns that are quite obviously necessary.

Imagine the government doing the same to you. Taking a percent of your money because they decide you have too much. Don't you see what a terrible precedent this sets. Nobody would ever really own anything as you know that the threshold and rules could change at anytime and the government can demand a portion of what you own.

Well Trump wouldn't be in power, we wouldn't have the teens with us, we wouldn't be allowed to vote, it's one of the places H could get high paid work via his current company, they speak English, there is plenty of America to explore without travelling too far, it would be in a more "democratic" state, not all US is built the same. Health insurance would be paid, and I'm too old to get pregnant.

And we would have a decent standard of living, we wouldn't be in the cheapest housing type thing.

It wouldn't be a permanent move just one to avoid the UK if, IF, a populist right party got into power. We just wouldn't like the societal implications whilst everyone reacted. We hated the atmosphere after Brexit, it would be that, on steroids!

That is basically why, it would give us breathing space to decide where we would try and retire to (we have dual-EU so have some options).

I’m quite astonished that you’d sooner live a flight away from your children (and possibly grandchildren) than part with money after you’ve died.

If my parents suggested this to me, I’d respect their wishes but tell them quite clearly that quality time with them is far, far more important to me than what I’ll inherit after they’re gone.

Definitely consider moving if it’s an option. Paying taxes is fine but you want to feel as if you’re contributing to make society better. It feels in the UK like society is just getting worse, services are failing and people really do not like those who have managed to accumulate some wealth.

Our grown up DC’s left the Uk as soon as they could, one living in Australia, the other in a European capital, neither mind paying their taxes which incidentally are as high or higher than in the UK but their quality of life is much better.

We have also left the UK and have been living in Europe for the last few years and again the taxes are not that different. We do have a lot of assets still in the UK and their will be extremely high IHT bills for the kids but we are currently dissolving the assets as much as possible, passing the money the kids and hoping we live another 7 years!

It would take a lot to get us to move back there!

I think the 7 year rule doesn't apply if you've issued a deed of variation. The money is treated as if the testator had given it directly to the recipient named in the deed. Essentially, the deed is an alteration to the terms of the Will.

Not wealthy. Would be happy if first they got onto anyone who are into tax avoidance-. rich people and companies.

Lived abroad several times. Can be great. You need to understand tax law across jurisdictions well as it is often far more nuanced and complicated than it looks. Seek advice. Worst case is that you may end up being taxed twice. You have been warned.

Would I move to avoid fulfilling my obligations when passing intergenerational wealth to my children? Nope. Would I move again for the lifestyle and weather benefits? Yes.

Where did she say she was left wing? Or that she wasn't willing to pay more tax? Where is the hypocrisy?

No, I can only dream of having reasons to have that bill.

I know that there is no IHT between spouses. But it comes when 2nd person dies. So advisor is not rubbish as some have said.

Can't remember who said it as busy for next few hours and need to go but wouldn't even consider leaving if things were fairer. Lots of other countries don't tax such huge amounts over the threshold as 40% so might be £1million tax free which yes is amazing but my point is when we have saved for our future and our children's and paid tax on that money why does it have to be taxed again.

If IHT was lower then less would leave and more tax would be brought in to the govt.
More and more will be brought into the IHT tax bracket especially in the South. You can say we are moaning as much as you like but the fact is other countries do not take such an attitude.

I'm not as rich as you, but once my parents are gone and our dc are through uni and economically mobile, if things here don't improve, we will all consider emigrating - we have discussed it. We will be happy to learn a new language, depending on where.

Like OP, we have all 4 worked our guts out. DH works 7 days per week. That's how he's climbed the career ladder. Both kids regularly study to midnight, have 9x9 each at GCSE. We have worked and worked and worked. And we have paid absolutely shit loads in tax and taken nothing. Rinsing people like us is going to backfire. We won't tolerate it. We are paying enough.

if you own a family home in London then chances are you will be over the threshold never mind what other investments or pensions you both have. I was shocked when the IFA showed us the workings on paper.

Usyam totally agree

I’m thinking of taking very early retirement. I’m done contributing to taxes if they put them up.

A good IFA can help with wealth planning.

If we were younger, we’d leave. I’d encourage anyone young and at the start of their careers to (anyone with good earning potential)

Where will you keep your money? Italian banks?

One problem with IHT is that it’s a lot easier to avoid for the super-rich given all the carve outs and planning options. The effect of this is that the tax falls disproportionately on those just above the threshold who are obviously better off then average but not at the level of wealth where you necessarily consider tax planning or have the ability to make substantial gifts without reducing your own standard of living.

There are good arguments for taking away a lot of the reliefs and bringing PETs into the tax charge but slashing the rate to 10%. You’d get a similar total tax take but it would fall on everyone over the threshold, with much less avoidance.

Quite.

Do you shop at duty free? Buy nice items for cheaper when you’re abroad? Use an ISA? Have you had the conversation with your elderly parents about putting their house in a trust etc? If so, you’re tax avoiding. All perfectly legal but designed to minimise or extinguish the tax you would otherwise pay.

Posters on this website are so pious but I bet they’d save a £££ same as anyone else. Look at Rayner.

My aunt is hard left, she’s in her 60s now but when I was younger I was a bit ‘sixth form politics’ and really admired her. She went on a lot of protests, huge Corbyn fan etc - anyway when the time came she sent her daughter to a private school which absolutely blew me away. She was a bit embarrassed about it but did the old ‘well I can’t let my principles stand in the way of what’s best for her…’ they always find a way to justify it to themselves

No.

@Movingmarblecompletly agree with your viewpoint. OK not every individual has the capacity to be high earning and UK is generally a low wage economy and some people have to do the unskilled poorly paid work. However, there has to be a way to reward those who have taken on the years of study, stress and maybe sacrificed their youth to be comfortable in their mid life.
It is unfair to pay tax things you have paid income tax on already. What UK need to do is to tax the billionaires who don’t earn through PAYE. But they can’t as they will have systems to dodge the tax or leave UK themselves.

Or maybe we get stricter with the welfare system and limit it to people who have no chance of paying for themselves and raise the minimum wage and reduce childcare costs so that people are better able to support themselves?

Same here. Not really me, as I’m not a high tax payer, but my DH is.

He’s never off sick, gets home at 8pm, travels loads for work and has a very stressful job. In his 55 years he’s never claimed 1 benefit and never been out of work. He pays shit loads of tax and our DC have not used a state school and more recently we’ve gone on line for a GP as can’t get an appointment.

But it’s not enough. They’ll screw him over even more. There’s no other choice but to rinse working people who already pay high taxes. There’s no one left to tax but them.

If RR’s takes one more pound from my family I’ll make sure I take it back with the other hand. I’ll spend nothing, I’ll hunker down and I’ll watch every single penny.

Presumably because Uncle Sam doesn't go so hard on earned income as HMRC, and if one should die there, inheritance taxes don't affect estates below about $15m. Financial savings would be considerable. Just choose the state carefully.

Presumably you also want them to tackle the black economy, i.e. tax evasion, benefit fraud, etc within the community, i.e. maybe some of your friends, relatives and neighbours, as the black economy also costs tens of billions every year.

We all know that. It’s to do with dc.

What a strange angle. Yes obviously people breaking the law should be caught and stopped. Same as tax avoidance.

She said right now if one of us dies and leave it all to the other then yes that amount. which was just not true until the other dies. Then the estate is taxed. Then the children inherit the (substantial if the tax is £1m) rest.