The NHS - semi lighthearted debate with friend

[Ozgirl76]

A friend and I were having a debate today about the problems with the NHS and the best ways to fix them. I remember Wes Streeting had said that his preference was that because obesity causes so many issues, it would be best to fix the problems before they’re medical - by basically controlling what people eat.

So we were trying to decide - would it be better for the government to have much more control of our diets, ban smoking entirely, and continue to provide free health care. Or would it be better to continue to have free choice BUT if you met certain thresholds you were made to have health insurance which would cover you if you developed a smoking or weight related disease. We decided that to be fair, if you start the health insurance before the age of (say) 25 and never made a claim for any weight or smoking related disease up until age 70, you would get a lump sum payment back.

What do you think?

Define processed food. How are you going to mitigate for those of us who rely on it because we can’t prepare food for ourselves?

Smoking also managed to go from being widely accepted to quite socially unacceptable. I’m not quite sure how, but if there was a way to do this with junk food and drunkenness as well, that would help.

I don’t know - it would have to be based on % of sugar, fat etc included in it I suppose. If it were taxed highly enough then companies would respond to this by changing what was in foods.
For example, when I was pregnant I had gestational diabetes and I found that most pasta sauces were very high in sugar, so I had to make my own, or hunt out diabetes friendly versions. If the govt decided that tax on sauces with X% of sugar were to be taxed at 50%, I’m sure Heinz would respond by making healthier choices.

So you’re going to further disadvantage the disabled. Are you going to increase pip to account for the increase?

how are you going to make a private insurance company take me on? I’ve a friend in Ireland and they can’t get private health coverage via their work due to a pre-existing surgery that they’ve had. How are you going to solve that?

Tax alcohol more? I remember a time where spirits were excluded from annual tax rises because the Chancellor of the day was a spirits drinker also excluded cigars but heavily taxed beer wine and cigarettes

Equally maybe there could be classes to teach people how to make healthy versions of their favourite processed foods. So processed burgers were charged at 50% and plain mince at 0. At the moment I think it’s almost the other way round.

You could work out how much alcohol related injuries and illnesses cost the NHS and base the tax on that. It wouldn’t be desperately difficult. No one needs alcohol.

I don’t need taught. That’s patronising. I can’t make food for myself a lot of days. It’s one of the things I get pip for.

Taxing suger just makes companies use sweetener which is bad for your health

Look suger in moderate amounts is not bad for you nor is salt and certain fats the idea that we should demonise a food group is what's got us here we need to start on preventing disease not curing the consequences

The disabled could probably get a PIP increase to cover the cost of their processed food. I don’t know about this - what disability means you can only eat processed food?

You've not mentioned drugs I don't think. Literally billions gets spent every year looking after dc whose parents have become psychotic from weed or addicted to cocaine, crack, heroin, ketamine. They're not in care because their parents are obese. One dc can cost £1m per year for specialist care, right up to 18 years of age. Not to mention the adults' admissions to hospital and continual social problems.

Vaping. Very common and highly likely to cause a huge amount of respiratory problems and potentially vascular issues later down the line.

How are you going to police everybody? I know people who are a standard body weight but they don't exercise at all. They work long hours in sedentary jobs and are at real risk of heart disease.

I would like to see much better quality of food for sale in the shops for sure. Some of it is just toxic. You don't see so much of it in other European countries.

They wouldn’t be allowed to use sweetener - the point is that the govt would control what’s in the food in order to keep the NHS free.

Well this is kind of what the govt needs to do to keep the NHS free. It seems that the British people can’t make sensible decisions for themselves, or are incapable of doing so. So the choice is either let the govt choose what to feed you, how much alcohol you’re allowed or charge you for your NHS use.

Afrid

Plus your forgetting people who are disabled are more likely to rely on ping meals because they cannot stand prep cook and clean up after home cooked meals ever heard of Wiltshire farm foods? They do a roaring trade in meals ready to eat they come into your home pop it all in the freezer for you even take the empty trays away lovely people its always processed/frozen though they arnt making it fresh for you

Many people with autism have “safe” foods that are processed and “beige” because they’re always the same.

I don’t despite having autism but I have a restricted diet due to texture issues.

I can’t prep food myself - I struggle to hold a knife for example - I can’t do so safely as per OT - and I struggle to sit at a perching stool safely to prepare food. I also struggle to remember that it is time to eat, I often don’t feel like eating either due to adhd and autism and drugs and my partner can’t help so we rely on ready meals and pre-prepared food.

Oh and I fully agree - stricter on drugs, ban vapes entirely apart from on prescription.
Heart disease is only a problem if it costs a lot to treat (from the govt’s perspective). It’s actually good for the govt if you drop dead at 67. Much cheaper!

Thank you.

I can’t clean - I use my pip partly for a cleaner.

We aren’t eligible for carers as we have been deemed able to cope between the two of us. I help him and he helps me and somehow between us we just about keep it together.

This daft idea would destroy our coping mechanisms.

I dont trust the government to decide what's best for me they dont have medical degrees they dont live in the real world they are clueless remember when they kept asking MPs about the cost of a loaf of bread? They didn't know

So people like me and my partner get all agency taken away and we are told what we are allowed to eat, and we will be charged for our nhs use because we are both fat and no insurance company would touch us. And we use the nhs a lot more than average because we are disabled.

wonderful idea this.

So people don’t seem to like the idea of the govt having too much say - so what if everyone starts a health insurance plan on day 1 of their life. They pay into this and the govt contributes as well (it’s provided by the govt). Every year you have a medical and based on a number of metrics, your premium for the following year is set. This is based on blood pressure, weight, smoking status, liver function test, bone scan, I don’t know, a few other things that I’m sure sensible people could come up with.

Then, like with your car or home, if you make no claim, you get a rebate. The govt is mandated to cover everyone, even seriously disabled people (the premiums of the healthier would cover the disabled who need a lot of care).

Rules could be set so cover has to be provided for everyone and premiums can only increase by X amount each year, however sick you’ve been that year.

Tell me you have no idea about being disabled without telling me you have no idea about being disabled.

I genuinely don’t. But the insurance would make sure that everyone got access as there would be an incentive for people to stay healthy.

Oh and maybe the premium could only go up if you’ve actually got worse - not stayed the same. It’s not based on disability, it’s based on health. So I assume someone who is (eg) autistic, isn’t just getting unhealthier and unhealthier every year - their needs remain broadly constant?

I mean their NHS needs.

I suppose the thing is, we’re talking about - how do you keep the people who have a choice over their health, healthy?

I genuinely don’t know the answer to that. It would seem simple ( but clearly not) - no smoking, no alcohol and a diet with unprocessed, nutritious food, but it’s clearly not.

I have no words for how offensive you’re being so I’m going to step away now.

Better people than me can try to tell you how offensive you’re being. Because I don’t have the words.