CPR and driving tests

[mumda]

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-theory-test-questions-aim-to-boost-cardiac-arrest-survival-rate

I get a daily bulletin of Govt news. It's always interesting and I do like a read through when I have time.

"From autumn 2025, driving theory tests will include new CPR questions and, for the first time, questions about defibrillators to boost cardiac arrest survival.

The Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency (DVSA) is expanding the theory test question bank to:

include enhanced cardiopulmonary resuscitation (CPR) content
add questions about automated external defibrillators (AEDs) for the first time
The move aims to address the UK’s low cardiac arrest survival rates by making sure more people know how to respond in emergencies.

Drivers are often first on the scene when someone suffers a cardiac arrest. Data from Resuscitation Council UK shows more than 40,000 out-of-hospital cardiac arrests occur in the UK each year, but fewer than 1 in 10 people currently survive.

40,000+
out-of-hospital cardiac arrests occur in the UK each year.

However, when CPR is given and an AED used within 3 to 5 minutes of collapse, survival rates can reach 70%."

--
Is there a definitive list of defib machines? If there's not then it all seems a bit haphazard as you'll spend 5 minutes looking up where one is.

And without wanting to sound like I'm a government shill:
https://www.gov.uk/help/get-emails-about-updates-to-govuk
if you want to sign up so you too can know what they're doing.

I’m sure the 999 call handler tells you where the nearest one is. Although you’d have to leave the patient or hope someone appears to either stay with them or get the device 🤷🏼‍♀️

Yeah, you call 999 if someone is in cardiac arrest, they tell you where the nearest one is.

It sounds like an excellent idea. Google reckons there are 2 million driving tests/year (so probably at least an extra 1 million people/year will now be learning how to use a defib and perform CPR).

I suspect the intention is to simply increase the number of people willing or able to assist should somebody collapse at work/school/pub/town centre?

It will just require an extra 10-15 minutes of learning first aid theory alongside the road signs and braking distances etc.

You need to ring for a code to get the machine to open up too and hope that it works.

The problem is having access to an AED in the first place, if you suffer a cardiac arrest in a remote area etc there is limited access to an AED. If you’re nearby an AED 999 will tell you where the nearest one is.

Since it seems many people have trouble with basics such as traffic lights and speed limits despite their licenses will adding First Aid actually achieve anything?

I think it's a good idea, the call operator gives you the location of the nearest AED and the code for the box when you get there and the AED itself guides you through the process.
And it's a good way of getting the needed knowledge to lots of people in a relatively inexpensive way.
Although sadly my experience of helping someone who has collapsed in public (thankfully not a cardiac arrest but poorly and bleeding) is that so many people just want to film it for SM and stand and gawp rather than do something productive like speak to the 999 operator for instructions and relay them, put pressure on a wound or even just move so someone willing to help can get through to do so. Maybe if more people had an idea of what to do they'd be more able and willing to help.

I’ve done many first aid courses over the years ( working with children you need to do one) but god forbid that I ever have to put something like this into practice, but the CPR machine does talk you through it. Plus if one is a long way away from the accident , surely it’s not a good idea to leave the person to find one or just try manual CPR. At least the training will be informative I suppose , but depends on how confident you are to try it out. Plus many people already have first aid training because of their jobs , I’m always surprised how many people need to do these courses.

Do you all know where your nearest one is?

That might be worthy of a whole new thread (or maybe a mumsnet question topic!)

The nearest one to where I live is the community centre which would maybe take 5 mins round trip in the car and probably 10-15 walking by the time you'd got the code and got into the box and got back, we have one on site at work but there's another two within about a 5-10 minutes walking either way, one on the sea/beach front and one at the library there's about a 20-30 minutes walk between the two but both ideally situated for where they might be needed most.

I’m quite sure there is an app for defibrillators, I can’t remember what it’s called but assume it’s still available. It shows you where your nearest one is.

Even if you do know, you still need to call 999 to get the code to open it - so you don’t actually need to know in advance.

in my first aid training, we were told you send someone else to get the defibrillator whilst you’re performing CPR and staying with the patient. If you are there alone, unless you were literally next to one, you would not leave them to fetch one or they’d be dead.

It’s just more tick boxing isn’t it.
In reality, most people just phone 999 or at least try some kind of basic first aid, but probably too scared to do much more really unless they are a trained medical professional. I know where the CpRs are in my town, but nowhere else. It’s one of these new ideas that sound good on paper, but how many lives it may save is pretty hard to judge in reality and a lot depends on where the accident is too as how you can get to use one. You have to use your own risk assessments too if your on a busy road you can’t really wander off easily on your own to find one ( for one example)
So many variables

Is there a definitive list though?

There are different types (brands?) that might be listed separately on different apps. I did have a look about 6 months ago.

Yep but only because it was put there recently then damaged by teens 🤦🏼‍♀️

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/m002h2sw/breakfast-13082025

1.14 approx in. It was on the news this morning.

The link will work only for a day.

Didn't any of your training tell you that you are supposed to stay with the patient and perform normal CPR whilst somebody else fetches the defib and stay where you are if there is nobody else?

All of mine has.

That was badly written. Sorry
yes, you are told to not leave the patient etc. I just meant going off to find a cpr machine may be tricky

I think it's a great idea.

My son survived a cardiac arrest last year, though it was an in hospital one in his case which still has poor survival rates but better than out of hospital.

Sorry for the delay! To be honest I cannot recall. It was a few years ago now and it was an official app from possibly nhs/emergency services. It was on a programme I watched. Or possibly Red Cross? I’m extremely helpful aren’t I? 😬
It was the first time I’d heard of an app for it but it also must’ve been long enough ago that defibrillators still weren’t in many places. It’s possible it was all part of the same scheme; trying to get more defibs in public places, inside buildings etc, and raising awareness of them.
I’ll need to search now to appease my curiosity! I’d imagine there might even be more apps by now.

ETA: I’m sure you lot are way ahead of me by now and have already looked!

@mumda
so these two look the most legit. I think I’ll dl them both and see if one is better than the other or whether they all run off the same info.
Obviously I mentioned the Red Cross but that Good Sam responder looks familiar too.

I think this is a good idea. But I’d like to see the government step in and fix the shocking abuse of the online test booking system before they change any testing criteria theory or otherwise.

Good lord, forget those two apps (would change the pics but can’t edit now as the photos are under review. So, those turned out to be a lot more about first aid, emergency help etc. Very useful, obviously, however the two I didn’t post are specifically locations of defibs. Had a cursory look in my area on both of them and they look like they’re same locations.
this is what happens when you’ve had no sleep! Utterly braindead.

I watched a programme that if someone needs CPR and you do your best in whatever way you can’t do harm. (Obviously let someone qualified take over if there is anyone).

The person is dead and you are increasing their chances of life even a small amount. You can’t make it worse.

What next, questions on emergency tracheotomy, just in case someone is choking!

What a stupid idea.

Driving tests should be about driving.

🙄