28 years for shipping Es? Bit much isn't it?

[Wareart]

I've just been watching that Channel 4 Encrochat programme about the old boys getting busted trying to smuggle ecstasy to Australia and the sentences they got were insane. They weren't violent, plotting to install their rivals in a torture chamber (!) or ordering their opponents' family members get shot/burned with acid in the eyes (!) like the rest of the sociopaths featured in this series.

They were just shipping party drugs to meet demand and by the looks of them it was one last blast and retire to the Costa del sol or somewhere with their millions, not negatively impacting me or anyone else with their shenanigans, no threat to anything. So wtf is the story with the sentencing?

“Club accessories”?

”produced in a lab in the uk”

you have heard of county lines? Children exploited by drug gangs to transport the product around the country.

kiddies in the UK are being killed in turf wars/forced into production.

do you think mdma is produced in nice clean labs meeting production standards, with post doc chemists and everyone paid a fair wage?

I don’t know the details but if the sentencing was not in the uk then it’s not comparable to sentences her for other crimes. Some countries take drug smuggling very seriously and the sentences are well publicised. FAFO. Take drugs into a country with zero tolerance and then be surprised at getting a life sentence or even the death penalty? They knew the consequences.

Supposedly 'milder' illegal drugs are a very common gateway to harder and harder ones.

I doubt there are many heroin addicts out there who went straight to heroin and never gradually 'worked their way up' through other drugs about which people repeatedly said "It's not like it's heroin or anything".

As for those who deal and traffick them, who really thinks that all of these same 'virtuous' people will self-restrict to only dealing the supposedly 'safe' ones?

Same with porn: do people genuinely think that the producers who peddle the 'softcore' photos aren't also the same ones who make the most nasty abusive videos too, for which there is also obviously a huge market?

Just like seaside postcard shops also happily sell fridge magnets, fudge, surf boards and buckets and spades, when there is a clear demand for them, I really fail to see why any 'soft' drug dealer wouldn't be very strongly tempted to diversify in the pursuit of where the money is coming from.

It's got sod all to do with proportionality. Its a lesson. Don't carry drugs.

You don't like it tough shit.

I never understand why people frame punishment for worse things that could happen as automatic justification of ostensibly 'less bad' things being barely punished at all.

Can I walk through the street and randomly punch somebody in the face - and then escape any punishment on the grounds that murdering them would have been far worse?

And why does it always seem to only work the one way? Why do people seek to reduce the punishment for the 'less bad' thing rather than wanting the worse thing to be punished more?

Even ketamine is relatively safe.
You have more chance of dying from eating a peanut than from mdma.

Saying that, I don't take either, and the comedowns from E take so long for me, it is rarely worth it.
There are other things to worry about than dying, but it definitely seems like a disproportionate sentence for a drug that should really be reclassified down

Death isn’t the only negative effects of drugs though. They can affect your MH and physical health and your ability to live your life.

cannabis may not kill you short term, but regular use can have serious effects on MH, even to the point of inducing psychosis.

i had a friend who was a very promising doctor. Had got into a very tough specialty and was excelling. Used to take ketamine at weekends, “relatively safe” as you say. Except he kept falling down k holes, waking up on Monday morning god knows where having done god knows what- absolutely no memory.

last I heard he’d lost his medical license, his fiancée, and was spiralling into depression. But hey, ketamine doesn’t kill you so it’s “safe” and we should be worried about it as a recreational drug.

OP, this is organised crime - “This case involved a colossal quantity of MDMA, with an estimated street value of £44 million, which posed a huge risk to the health and well-being of the Australian public.”. We’re not talking about couple of spliffs here - this was hidden inside the arm of a crane, for heaven’s sake, and it certainly wasn’t their first gig. Do tell me what sort of sentence you think would be appropriate for smuggling “colossal” amounts of drugs. The drug trade negatively impacts everyone - I’m very glad they got caught.

It was a tv show….you won’t know the details

you Have no clue

Leah Betts died from drinking too much water, not MDMA

People smuggling drugs are part of a whole really big problem.

Happy for them to be removed from our streets.

The issue isn’t - imo - that their sentence was too heavy. But that other sentences are too light.

The supply chain, grooming, criminal and sexual exploitation of children, cuckooing, organised crime - all kill people

I’m another happy for them to get that.

Different countries have different sentences for different crimes to England and Wales.

If they didn't want to risk a 20 year + prison sentence they shouldn't have smuggled illegal drugs in 'colossal' quantities.

I've recently taken controlled drugs on holiday with me. I was very careful to check they weren't banned in the country I went to, and had my prescription on me, and -importantly- was open about them when I went through security.

They took a huge gamble and got caught. Tough shit. I hope it serves as an example for others.

I’d bet dollars to donuts that the pearl clutchers about the dangers of MDMA are downing wine most nights of the week and think they’re morally superior because their drug of choice is available in the shops. Alcohol is a known carcinogenic and kills over 10,000 people in the UK every year, while the most deaths ever recorded in a single year from MDMA was 92.

Sorry but the law is never enforced based on what you think the law is - it is based on what the law actually is. If Australia or the previous destination come down hard on this behaviour, it doesn’t matter, criminals are still sentenced based on the law in place at that location at the time of the crime.

I am all for harsher sentencing for drug trafficking, but I don't understand why there are such big discrepancies. You hear of people smuggling loads of heroin getting say, six years, but then guys like these getting so much longer. Both in Australia.

What???

Edit: If she didn't take the drug, then she probably be alive. So...

you’re missing the point and I’m not sure how.

The law in Australia doesn’t use any of this as mitigation:

• club accessories,
• produced in a lab in the UK,
• no kiddies in Colombia or Afghanistan killed in turf wars/forced into production,
• clearly destined for a willing non addicted and
• fully cognisant market?

It’s not the gotcha you think it is.

Oh well, that's ok then ... Poor old fellas, eh?

Clueless.

It was £45m worth of MDMA - they deserve the sentences

We need to enforce our drug laws more severely here. Too many people see drug taking as cool or trendy, and ignore all the county lines abuse in between.

At least it wasn’t one of those countries where it’s automatically the death penalty.
TBH I have zero sympathy for anyone smuggling drugs. They know the risks, so if they’re stupid or complacent enough to take them…

Ecstasy is a class A drug. So the fact that you allegedly have a nice clean lab rather than a sketchy meth lab is not really a mitigating factor. Can’t do the time, don’t do the crime.

The idea that they are just nice business men who spotted a gap in the market is also incredibly naive.

Absolutely this. Nobody should be able to convince themselves that their recreational cocaine use "isn't hurting anyone".

I've not looked at the details of the case mentioned in the OP however in the EU and the UK the sentancing is based on the amount so if it was a lot it'll make it seem disporortional to other crimes.

That being said, the sentancing being based on the number of pills is what is driving the increased strength in pills these days. So instead of 120-150mg, producers are making them 300mg so they can charge twice as much but without regulation or education the message to users is not gettting through to only take half a pill for a usual dose.