Shockingly negative data about school kids’ literacy and numeracy levels..

[Absentmindedsmile]

An interim government report has highlighted that

• 40 percent of 16 year olds are not at the required standard in maths and literacy.
• 16 percent of 16 years olds are not even at the required standard expected of 11 year olds.

Firstly, what terrible statistics

Secondly, knowing this information, on what planet is it then a good idea to

• Introduce voting for these 16yr olds?
• Prevent some children who would benefit from a better education in private schools, from having one?

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/curriculum-and-assessment-review-interim-report

This year group didn’t have SATs due to Covid, so we have no way of knowing whether they have or haven’t made progress.
However, I would say that this isn’t vastly different from other years, if it’s a national figure, particularly if the measure is a grade 5 in Maths and English!

Well if voting rights are dependent on academic qualifications then there are plenty of adults who shouldn’t be voting. Self evidently ridiculous.

How many of that 40% do you think would naturally pop up in private schools? Why are you presuming that these are children let down by a state education? I have worked in state schools that receive plenty of ex private school students who haven’t made the grade behaviourally or academically. They have thrived in our state provision.

Currently I work with students with complex learning needs and social and emotional health problems - some will absolutely be in that 16% group and without the power to vanish disabilities and provide a level of social care the heals and nurtures I won’t be able to change that. Of course, if education wasn’t so dependent on passes in subjects not needed for some trade jobs they could have more assured futures.

Your argument makes.no sense.
How many over 18s would meet the required level on a 11 year old? Are you suggesting people should pass a test before being allowed to vote?
I am sure I wouldn't be able to pass the maths SATs paper, I might be able to pass the SPAG but not if I had to use gramatical terms.
I am allowed to vote.
I would dispute that private schools schools.offer a better education than state schools.
Only 6.5% of children go to private school. I doubt that the few that might be deterred from going because of the the VAT changes is going to make the slightest difference in the voting population.

13% of British A level students are privately educated. Or they were at the last analysis.

Obviously private education isn’t always better than grammar education or other state education. Not all state education is equal, very far from it, despite what Labour would have people believe. That doesn’t change the fact that many children benefit from a private education, for several reasons. Not always academic attainment.

Perhaps that’s a good idea you’ve thrown in the ring. Maybe if one needed to ‘pass a test’ before being eligible to vote, we might have an improved political arena.

Democracy might actually work better if it wasn’t quite so er.. democratic..

But to get back to the point of my post, those levels of literacy and numeracy are horrendous. There’s no sugar coating it.

Perhaps the way maths and English are assessed at 16 is the problem - a certain percentage of students will fail as that's built in to the grading.

Allowing 16 year olds to vote is tactical Call me cynical but 16 year olds are very easy to manipulate- they can be fed a false dawn quite easily and sway results. They are all glued to internet & apps so a valuable pool of votes which can be swayed. It is 16 in Scotland & Wales, changed to try & restart the independence vote & stop brexit.

Australia is it compulsory to vote - that would be a better way to go.

You’re probably correct.

• Compulsory,
• Proportional Representation, and
• 18+.

The average reading age of an ADULT in UK is between 9-11 yrs old

7% at secondary age + 18% at A level go to independent schools

All these statistics tell you is that they didn’t meet whichever arbitrary level they thought 16yos should be working at this year. The goalposts change all the time and tell you nothing about the actual cognitive ability of the children, just how good they are at taking tests.

By expected standard, are we talking about GCSEs?

The whole point of the 0-9 scale (unlike SATs which are supposed to be age related) is that it represents different proportions of the population. So 5 is the median average. Lots of people get 4-6, quite a few get 7 and much fewer get 8-9. It allows universities and employers to know if someone is in the top x%. It’s not like a driving test where you have to meet a standard whether that’s 10% of test takers or 90.

If 5 is essentially the mid point then by definition, nearly half will be below this.

I haven’t read the data so perhaps I’ve got this wrong. But this all has a similar feel to it as the mathematically impossible: ‘we want all schools to be above average’

It is easier for Labour to blame independent schools as being the root of all evil in education (and fits their ideological aim) rather than admit state schools (through dire under-resouce for decades) fail children.

Agreed. The tax on those awful rich people and their UNFAIR private education, has certainly achieved the Labour aim of diverting the frothing (a favourite descriptive term used by Labour luvvies on mn) populace away from the real problem. Which is that state education is in a bad way. To put it politely. And that’s in no way a comment on teachers. Teachers are amazing and should be paid a lot more afaic.

You have a class of thirty, 5 need an echp and/ additional help and aren’t getting it. The teacher is so burnt out they want to leave. It’s no surprise that kids are not learning much.

100%

Oh what - you mean we should make the exams easier so nobody can fail?

Er... Labour hasn't been in power all that long, so essentially one might very well blame the Tories for the failures in state education. They were in power for some time and have never given a toss about the plebs who have to go to state school.

Er I said underfunded for decades.....the difference is that Labour blame everything on independent schools as a diversionary tactic. Whilst simultaneously continuing the under funding of education.

So, because a percentage of children fell under the level that was moved specifically so that percentage fell under that level, you shouldn't have to pay VAT on independent school fees?

It's certainly an interesting argument.

You shouldn't have to pay VAT cos no other country in the world taxes education as a point of principle. Nigeria has just reversed the policy so, ideologically we are now behind Nigeria FFS, a country where only 25% of girls get a secondary education

No one is stopping children who’d benefit from going to a private school.

I don’t understand what this means.

Shame on the previous government for these stats.

I think it is distasteful you use these stats not to campaign for greater investment in state education - for the benefit of individual children and the nation as a whole - but instead to push your own narrow political agenda.

Do you think 18yos in the early 1900s were more literate? Many people historically could not read, but were rightly granted the vote.

Perhaps giving more young people the vote will make investing in state education a higher priority for governments.

We should certainly consider whether EXAMS are appropriate for measuring functional skills.

If standards go up, it's ok for pass rates to reflect that.

I thought the same.

When ds was at school I actually thought his numeracy and literacy were very good. And Maths and English are take up an overwhelming part of the curriculum in my view.

The problem isn't with literacy and numeracy, it's with the rest of the curriculum.

You can't force maths and science on kids and expect them to become computer scientists. Much better to have a broad curriculum and allow them to find their strengths.

Not easier but more appropriate.

Does every 16 year old really need to be an expert in circle geometry? Functional numeracy and understanding how an overdraft works would be more useful for life.

Everyone should study a foreign language too. It's embarrassing how bad we are in the UK at languages.