Is it any wonder women are sexually objectified when so many celebrities volunteer to be?

[Notsosure1]

I’ve posted about this topic before , but after seeing two pop up shortly after scrolling, I am staggered by the number of articles that pop up on yahoo news that have headlines ‘celebrating’ (objectifying) female celebrities, young and old - here’s the first two of many -

‘Sabrina Carpenter is completely naked in new magazine cover, posing in nothing but thigh high socks’ (Cosmopolitan)

‘Stacey Solomon is the ultimate Bond girl in slinky swimsuit as she holidays without Joe Swash’
(Hello)

We’re trying to teach the younger generation of girls not to accept being viewed simply as sexual objects but there’s an abundance of mainstream female celebrities doing just that and are being cheered on for doing it. Talk about mixed messages. Yeah to body confidence and positivity, of course you can be viewed as sexy as well as intelligent, kind, independent etc. but I can’t believe there are still so many of these out there with such sleazy titles. There are a few focussing on men (I presume) but way down in number by comparison.

Am I over-reacting?

This is my last post on the subject. You used some vile words and came across very unpleasant.

I will not defend myself any further as I do not want to derail this thread.

Remember the backlash Billie Eilish (an actually talented musician) faced when she said early porn exposure had negatively impacted her? Women aren’t even allowed to talk about it without being told to shut up and support sex work.

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2021/dec/15/billie-eilish-says-watching-porn-gave-her-nightmares-and-destroyed-my-brain

You were quite happy to derail the previous thread and have already attempted it by starting your campaign on me on here.

What you mean by "vile" is an opinion that doesn't support FWB for the exact reasons I've detailed on here. In fact, mine and many other posts in this thread are very similar to my posts on the FWB thread. I haven't seen anyone call anyone "vile" yet.

If you don't want to derail, I suggest you stop hunting posters down. Your behaviour on the last thread was an attempt at shaming and humiliation with threatening undertones. I'd step away from the "advanced search" tool and clocking people's user names and accept differences of opinion, even if they're not "right think/popular" . Good day to you. Over and out.

Interesting point. That's another brainwashing "new speak" "sex work" : so we accept it's valid "work" for us now.....

It's not just youngsters nor is it recent. Look at wedding photos 30 years ago and compare the amount of flesh men and women are displaying.

Ever since it became modesty became unfashionable - for better or worse - women have been leaning into their sexual capital. But again, as I said, it's biological not societal.

Yes very true about modesty. Sadly, modesty is now seen as "old fashioned" and women being "controlled" but as we can now see, the opposite appears to be the truth.

I also think a lot of this is "boundary pushing" ; the minute we've successfully pushed one boundary, we're hunting down the next one , then the next. Where does it all end ? Until the boundaries of women are in one big hot smushed pile of vomit on the floor !?

NRTWT but hat does looking ‘sexy’ even mean ? Up for a shag ? Wanting men to shag you ? How aspiring..

This is a whole nother thread topic and one I’ve considered starting before now! 👍🏻

Do we dress for ourselves or for men? If we dress for ourselves - what is the point of looking sexy? What purpose does it serve?

God I’m derailing my own thread now 🫣

🤣 'derailing my own thread' love it !

This is where the boundaries are very very blurry. As you say, if you're dressing "sexily" I can only conclude it is for male observation. ...?

All I know is I’d be very upset if my daughter (I don’t have one) went down the over sexualised route if she were a singer. Imagine going to see her in concert 🫣

There’s nothing wrong with looking attractive for men, we are human after all. But there’s a difference between dressing attractively and having your boobs and arse hanging out, writhing seductively on the floor at Sainsbury's in the hope you might get your shopping for free. Which at it’s very basic is what performative, overtly sexualised singers are doing. Sometimes it seems to smack of those paid for peep shows.

I was at a music festival in Spain last weekend and had a lot of conversations with the men and women in my group of friends about the change in the way female singers present themselves. Two of the headliners (Sabrina Carpenter and Charli xcx) left nothing to the imagination. Chappell Roan managed to keep her kit on, perhaps given she is by far the most talented in terms of vocals at least of the three. Even the leads of bands like Wet Leg & Wolf Alice who I’ve seen live a couple of times in recent years, have noticeably changed their look to being knickers, fish nets and vest tops. It’s not particularly new or creative and in some ways seems regressive from an art perspective. It is the difference year on year that’s particularly noticeable.

edited to add as prompted by PP - all the artists mentioned (except CR) also spend an inordinate amount writing around on the floor during their sets.

I don't doubt she's smart. But this "I'm being ironic" thing just doesn't wash with me.
She is choosing to promote a highly sexuallised persona, which perpetuates the idea that women are primarily objects of male gaze. Of course many female artists do...but it's a matter if degree?!

I like Sabrina Carpenter, but I think her new album cover is horrible. She's pretty, talented, and successful. Why do this?

It’s very Terry Richardson 2013.

I think it's a false distinction between dressing for oneself and for others - we are social and sexual beings after all, which is why we want to look and feel attractive. I don't think anyone dresses purely for themselves any more than anyone dresses purely for the male gaze. The point of looking sexy, if you want to, is to feel good about yourself imo.

I really don’t think young girls are massively damaged by people like Sabrina Carpenter. I’ve said up thread she’s doing nothing new and it’s no different to what boy bands did for decades.. Sexy sells.
Madonna was far more provocative, do women who were teen fans in Madonna’s Erotic era feel like she has had an influence on who you become?

That was a strange era.

I was nine when Like A Virgin came out.

Yes she did have an influence. Not in making me grow up too fast as my mum feared but definitely in showing me that being sassy, in control and not being too passive and polite were good things for girls.

Feels too much like coincidence that he’s trying to soft launch himself back this year.

It doesn't really matter if it is about getting attention, it still means you have a right to choose to whom you give your attention and doesn't give men the right to act in a boorish way or regard any particular way of dressing as an open invitation. There's nothing intrinsically wrong with being attractive to others or wanting to be, particularly when you are young free and single and it's an absolutely intrinsic thing for most animals. Even when you aren't interested in a new relationship it's nice to hear another human being compliment your outfit or say that your hair looks nice.

I remember when I was younger that it felt that (attractive) women were never taken seriously and certainly not in the music industry. I still think some people here have that (internalised) misogyny that young and attractive = dumb.

I got it when I was young, pretty and blonde and starting my legal career in the late 1990s. And I was no Elle Woods but recognise a lot of the attitudes shown to her in Legally Blonde.

Thirty years ago maybe but wasn't that just a fashion thing, I see photos of my Mum and her friends in late 60s London, they have as short dresses and skirts on as my teen DD would like to wear, same twig like legs so maybe that is somehow acceptable. Equally, didn't what about Marylin Monroe era, I watched a documentary on her and is quite upsetting how she saw herself with regards to men.

Equally, I think people are hypocrites as people say about clothing sexualising women but then posters deride and belittle women for making shoe choices on Style and Beauty threads that they see as old fashioned or lacking style presumably because female choices need to be sexy, they need to appeal to men!

That’s suddenly made me wonder how much boob Lauren Sanchez will be pushing out of her wedding dress later this month🫣

With ‘social’ in mind, apparently women are more likely to dress for each other, that is, other women - friends, family, colleagues, associates - than for men - which is really interesting and actually makes sense when you think of the various trends concerning eyebrows, hair, makeup and clothing. I’m not talking about really revealing stuff, where many women will not be impressed as it can be seen negatively for all sorts of reasons - but how many men gave a toss how many hours it took to perfect the contouring trend that was massive a few years ago? Same with eyebrows - unless they look bizarre.

Women will always dress to attract someone, whatever sex, as will men, but I thought that was an interesting concept that rarely gets mentioned as it’s usually assumed that it’s always for the benefit of men.

That's true. I don't think I ever wore a dress in the 1990s as short as my mum would wear in the late 1960s. Her mum used to make her matching knickers. They were covering your bottom pants, but still.