Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Chat

Join the discussion and chat with other Mumsnetters about everyday life, relationships and parenting.

Do we underestimate what's coming?

230 replies

Dappy777 · 03/06/2025 16:33

I have become quite interested in AI lately and have been watching loads of Youtube lectures. Some of it is really mind-blowing. What struck me most was a talk given by Stephen Fry in which he said humans are like children playing on a beach and squabbling over the sand and pebbles. Meanwhile, just over the horizon, waves are gathering to form one giant tsunami that is going to knock us flying. His point was that it isn't just AI. Numerous waves of technology – nanotechnology, gene editing, virtual reality, genetic engineering, quantum computing, etc – are uniting. Any one of them on its own could transform the world. But they are going to combine, and in some cases speed each other along (AI could speed up nanotech, for example).

One AI expert thinks we could see all illness and disease brought under medical control within ten years. Even Jeffrey Hinton, who won the nobel prize, thinks AI will wipe out all illness and disease within 20 years. Human ageing may be halted and even reversed!! Another expert thinks that, thanks to regenerative medicine, by the late 2030s 50-somethings will look like 20-somethings. Stephen Fry himself thinks the first person to live beyond 200 has already been born.

Yet we carry on as if the future will be more or less like the present. Is it sensible for a 25-year-old to marry and have a child when we're on the brink of regenerative medicine that could extend her life for centuries (assuming climate change and nuclear weapons and bio-terrorists and hackers and so on don't wreck everything)? My friend's daughter is due to start secondary school in September. They are already wondering what GCSEs she'll enjoy, what A-Levels she might take and what career she'll choose. They are carrying on as if her life will be just like theirs was. But if she goes to university, that will be 2032. By the time she completes her degree it will be 2035. By 2035 AI, nanotechnology, gene editing, VR, quantum computing and god knows what else (not to mention climate change) will have made the world a very different place. There might not be any jobs. Should we be educating children in a completely different way? Do they need to study traditional subjects at all!?? Should we overhaul education and focus on things like empathy, relationships, life skills, meaning and purpose?

The problem, I think, is that ordinary divs like me have zero understanding. For all I know these experts could be exaggerating. Because I'm so bad at science, they could tell me the moon is made of cheese and I'd believe them. The one thing they all agree on, however, is that the pace of change is accelerating. One of them said we'll live through 100 years of scientific progress in the next ten years. Shouldn't we be constantly talking about all this?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
7
InsomniacSloth · 06/06/2025 11:09

sparrowflewdown · 05/06/2025 14:09

Do you have a better link don't want to open that one?

A better link?

I’m not sure what you mean. It’s a link to a Ted Talk by Ray Kurzweil. 🤷🏻‍♀️

User14March · 06/06/2025 11:38

Namechangeagain8464 · 06/06/2025 09:04

Another analogy is us being ants to AI's humans, ie we can't even comprehend the concept of how it will think/act.

Haven't RTFT so don't know if anyone has mentioned it and it's about 10 years old, but Wait but Why has an incredibly in-depth and quite scary blog post on what might happen when AI reaches super-intelligence.

waitbutwhy.com/2015/01/artificial-intelligence-revolution-1.html

Thanks for this. Balanced, amusing & interesting. The ‘Turry’ narrative - ‘only’ an innocuous handwriting AI - is alarming & plausible. Those that think AGI implausible on timeline presented said that before GPT-4 plus came out.

What if what we understand as our? God’ is/was an advanced AI from another civilisation? This chat also reminds me of Asimov’s ‘The Question’ - think Asimov (?) need to check - I read it many years ago but it almost offered explanation to teenage me of maybe how life began ‘Let there be light’.

It’s hard to see how this can end well for us but I don’t want to be pessimistic. How can the necessary checks & balances go in when we’ve got no collaborative safeguarding/enough prep happening now? When it’s many magnitudes smarter than us & we’re effectively ants in comparison what then?

User14March · 06/06/2025 11:44

sparrowflewdown · 06/06/2025 10:21

Yes I have read that article. Like ants unaware of the human world, we may one day live in a world shaped by advanced AI, oblivious to the complexity and sophistication of the systems around us. We’ll go about our lives, unaware of the tech that’s driving everything forward.

What is interesting is the article about 1561 phenomenon posted by User14March could be a brilliant example of that very analogy.

That’s an interesting thought. We’d surely see other similar phenomena if so?

2dogsandabudgie · 06/06/2025 11:50

Bjorkdidit · 03/06/2025 18:10

If it's going to take everyone's jobs and stop people getting ill so they live to over 200 them let's hope it's also going to build enough homes for everyone to live in and generate and more importantly share out (rather than it being hoarded by a handful of billionaires) enough money for people to live on because otherwise the world is going to become an even nastier place to live very quickly indeed.

I think us humans need to realise that we're not the only species living on this planet. The thought of more houses and less green space is what frightens me. Maybe it's because I'm older but when I see new roads being built or houses going up my first thought now is for the wildlife.

Namechangeagain8464 · 06/06/2025 12:04

sparrowflewdown · 06/06/2025 10:21

Yes I have read that article. Like ants unaware of the human world, we may one day live in a world shaped by advanced AI, oblivious to the complexity and sophistication of the systems around us. We’ll go about our lives, unaware of the tech that’s driving everything forward.

What is interesting is the article about 1561 phenomenon posted by User14March could be a brilliant example of that very analogy.

Yes, and as with the paperclip problem, if (when?) we get wiped out by AI, it won't be because of malicious intent as per sci-fi, but because we're inconsequential. Like if we accidentally sat on an ants' nest.

The article about the 1561 phenomenon just took me down many rabbit holes!

GasperyJacquesRoberts · 06/06/2025 12:08

User14March · 05/06/2025 20:14

The evidence supports a health revolution in 2030s with medical nanorobots which can effectively extend the immune system & destroy pathogens & metabolic disease. I am no expert but longer lifespans & more importantly healthspans - who wants to live to 120 as an incapacitated wreck? - def on horizon.

What evidence supports the idea of medical nanobots by the 2030s? And Greg Bear's Blood Music doesn't count.

Namechangeagain8464 · 06/06/2025 12:48

User14March · 06/06/2025 11:38

Thanks for this. Balanced, amusing & interesting. The ‘Turry’ narrative - ‘only’ an innocuous handwriting AI - is alarming & plausible. Those that think AGI implausible on timeline presented said that before GPT-4 plus came out.

What if what we understand as our? God’ is/was an advanced AI from another civilisation? This chat also reminds me of Asimov’s ‘The Question’ - think Asimov (?) need to check - I read it many years ago but it almost offered explanation to teenage me of maybe how life began ‘Let there be light’.

It’s hard to see how this can end well for us but I don’t want to be pessimistic. How can the necessary checks & balances go in when we’ve got no collaborative safeguarding/enough prep happening now? When it’s many magnitudes smarter than us & we’re effectively ants in comparison what then?

He's also done an interesting post on the Fermi paradox - I think other PPs have mentioned that the Great Filter could be AI.

https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/05/fermi-paradox.html

And also when it's an international competitive issue with no collective desire/ability to agree on the checks and balances.

The Fermi Paradox - Wait But Why

The Fermi Paradox: There should be 100,000 intelligent alien civilizations in our galaxy — so why haven't we found any of them?

https://waitbutwhy.com/2014/05/fermi-paradox.html

Namechangeagain8464 · 06/06/2025 12:51

User14March · 06/06/2025 12:43

The Singularity Is Nearer by Ray Kurzweil review — the coming AI revolution

https://www.thetimes.com/article/e0cc7f31-720c-429e-82cc-c413c304ecf0?shareToken=c4592f5aad42b4b9f7a0bfcc3d6ccc4a

I haven't (yet) read this, but it's interesting how differently different futurists view the issue... He apparently takes on a much more positive stance. Someone who reviewed the book suggested also reading The Coming Wave by the Microsoft AI CEO.

Badbadbunny · 06/06/2025 12:51

@Worldgonecrazy

Meanwhile we will keep thinking it is more important for our kids to know quadratic equations than actual useful life skills ……

I agree. If anything, we need to overhaul our education system to put far more emphasis/importance on real life skills, manual/technical skills, etc.

AI can take over the "academic" stuff at a stroke of a keyboard. We really don't need to be spending so much time forcing kids to rote learn stuff, solve quadratic equations, etc., as all that is already available at the touch of a smart phone.

What is missing, and what AI/Computers can't yet take over are manual skills, like car mechanics, building trades, hobby relating making, crafts, and other "manual" skills like hairdressing, beauty, personal care, and "front line" medical matters like injections, taking bloods, etc. Yes, I'm sure all that will come in decades to come as robotics etc get better, but are all pretty safe for the next few decades at least.

Our education system is already poor at "manual" and other similar skills as it's been dominated by academic stuff ever since sec-mods were scrapped in the 1970s. It's why we have a massive shortage of tradesmen, why it can take a month or two to book a car in for a service, etc., why driving instructors are booked up several months in advance.

User14March · 06/06/2025 12:53

Namechangeagain8464 · 06/06/2025 12:04

Yes, and as with the paperclip problem, if (when?) we get wiped out by AI, it won't be because of malicious intent as per sci-fi, but because we're inconsequential. Like if we accidentally sat on an ants' nest.

The article about the 1561 phenomenon just took me down many rabbit holes!

Interested in your thoughts on 1561. The drawing/carving of time & original description could depict a space battle before anyone had vocab to describe. If anything ‘alien’ it surely would have been global & evidence seems to suggest only local (?) The long, thick grey/metallic arrow with shaft & point particularly interesting I think.

Sketching only from the description interesting too but ofc we’ll have biases.

User14March · 06/06/2025 12:57

Namechangeagain8464 · 06/06/2025 12:51

I haven't (yet) read this, but it's interesting how differently different futurists view the issue... He apparently takes on a much more positive stance. Someone who reviewed the book suggested also reading The Coming Wave by the Microsoft AI CEO.

Holiday reading sorted. :) Thank you. Ray Kurzweil is a very optimistic person I think, so many highly successful people seem to be.

GasperyJacquesRoberts · 06/06/2025 13:10

User14March · 06/06/2025 12:43

The Singularity Is Nearer by Ray Kurzweil review — the coming AI revolution

https://www.thetimes.com/article/e0cc7f31-720c-429e-82cc-c413c304ecf0?shareToken=c4592f5aad42b4b9f7a0bfcc3d6ccc4a

You seem to be confused by the difference between "evidence" and "wild-assed claims". That article is full of wild-assed claims but desperately short of any evidence to back them up.

User14March · 06/06/2025 13:34

GasperyJacquesRoberts · 06/06/2025 13:10

You seem to be confused by the difference between "evidence" and "wild-assed claims". That article is full of wild-assed claims but desperately short of any evidence to back them up.

Edited

He’s really talking about what’s feasible in near future in his books & giving evidence to support.

DuesToTheDirt · 06/06/2025 14:12

2dogsandabudgie · 06/06/2025 11:50

I think us humans need to realise that we're not the only species living on this planet. The thought of more houses and less green space is what frightens me. Maybe it's because I'm older but when I see new roads being built or houses going up my first thought now is for the wildlife.

I also think of people's mental health.

We have a colleague in Singapore, and one time on a zoom call someone asked her to show us the view out of the window. Dear god, if I lived in such a place long-term I'd have a breakdown.

forensicdetective · 06/06/2025 14:27

One AI expert thinks we could see all illness and disease brought under medical control within ten years.

The vast majority of modern disease is lifestyle-related. AI will be great for detecting diseases, cancer, etc - but it can't make humans unhuman, and most people are really averse to changing their diet and lifestyle, even as they sink further into advanced disease and require limbs being cut off as a result.

GasperyJacquesRoberts · 06/06/2025 14:56

User14March · 06/06/2025 13:34

He’s really talking about what’s feasible in near future in his books & giving evidence to support.

"There definitely is evidence to back up my crazy conjecture but it's... somewhere else"

Good work, champ 🏆

User14March · 06/06/2025 15:05

GasperyJacquesRoberts · 06/06/2025 14:56

"There definitely is evidence to back up my crazy conjecture but it's... somewhere else"

Good work, champ 🏆

Well you’ll find his isn’t a lone voice that we’re almost certainly in for some rapid change & advancement. Mustafa Suleyman etc too.

Luddite26 · 06/06/2025 16:44

DuesToTheDirt · 06/06/2025 14:12

I also think of people's mental health.

We have a colleague in Singapore, and one time on a zoom call someone asked her to show us the view out of the window. Dear god, if I lived in such a place long-term I'd have a breakdown.

That's only like living in the centre of London there are some great green spaces in Singapore.

GasperyJacquesRoberts · 06/06/2025 17:34

User14March · 06/06/2025 15:05

Well you’ll find his isn’t a lone voice that we’re almost certainly in for some rapid change & advancement. Mustafa Suleyman etc too.

Still waiting for the evidence champ

cinnamongirl123 · 06/06/2025 17:47

I agree OP. The vast majority of people are oblivious. Listen to Eliezer Yudkowsky (has a book coming out soon), and Geoffery Hinton, the godfather of AI who now realises what a colossal disaster it is. Ah well, we had a good innings as they say!

User14March · 06/06/2025 18:05

cinnamongirl123 · 06/06/2025 17:47

I agree OP. The vast majority of people are oblivious. Listen to Eliezer Yudkowsky (has a book coming out soon), and Geoffery Hinton, the godfather of AI who now realises what a colossal disaster it is. Ah well, we had a good innings as they say!

’If Anyone Builds It, Everybody Dies’ book sounds very interesting, if depressing, thanks for the head’s up.

colta · 06/06/2025 18:34

It does feel like we might be on the cusp of something, AGI is now predicted to arrive by 2027 by some experts and after that ASI could arrive fairly quickly after that meaning all bets are off. Essentially once ASI is here life will change massively. Many jobs will just disappear and their will be potentially huge strides in other tech and science. There are also many potential downsides, what happens to humans who don't have to think or struggle? How will be live if their are not enough jobs? Will their be UBI? Will AI wipe us out because we are useless resource sucks? Will Roko's Basilisk become a reality? The possibilities and questions are endless. Its also true that many are saying AI is currently being way overhyped to sweeten the amount of power, resources and infrastructure it needs. An AI company just went bust because it was revealed that it was not in fact using AI to build apps but remote workers in India.

cheesycheesy · 06/06/2025 19:01

The uk is already on its knees with the benefits system, a UBI is laughable. The only people further AI development is going to benefit is greedy billionaires.