Fine for driving through confusing London Low Traffic Neighborhood

[SlothBearSocks]

We were seeing friends in Waltham Forest in London, and just received a £160 fine (£80 if paid in 14 days) thought the post.

They live in a low traffic neighborhood. At the ends of lots of roads there are two planters on either curb with "Road Closed" signs on them. But there is space to drive through the middle, presumably for emergency vehicles.

I like the idea of LTNs and agree with reducing traffic, but the way this was designed was very confusing. We had driven round a circuatous system avoiding the closed roads, following Google maps. We turned down the final road to get out of the estate and onto the main road and there were no signs I could see when we turned into the road. We got to the end of this estate road, with the main road in sight and I came upon these two planters with "road closed" on them.

I expect to see a road closed sign at the entrance to a road, not once I reach the end. So despite knowing I need to be on my toes because of the LTN, my brain saw the busy main road literally just beyond the "road closed" planters and it thought "this road can't possibly be closed, I can see the main road and I can just drive through!" And only at the moment when it was too late and I had pulled out of the estate road beyond the planters and onto the main road, did I think "shit that was the LTN!"

It's annoying because I was trying to abide by the rules, but having a road closed sign right at the end of a completely normal and passable road was slightly confusing. If it had just had a bit more information on the sign such as "Low Traffic Neighborhood", or "passing this sign will mean a fine" my brain might have engaged.

I'm presuming I don't have a leg to stand on in terms of arguing with the council that it is a confusing layout, do I? Especially if you are not from the area.

The simple fact is when you see a sign that says nothing but "road closed", yet your eyes tell you that it clearly is not closed and very much passable, it is likely to cause confusion! "No entry" would have been better, or any sort of reference to the LTN.

I'm left feeling they are taking advantage of unsuspecting motorists who are not local.

Has anyone ever challenged one of these fines?

They make the signs unclear because they want your money.
We have these LTNs in our area. There is one particular point where the unwary were getting caught, and so some neighbours put up a sign clarifying that cars should not drive through... the council had those signs ripped down several times.. they just want the income.
They do not care that the traffic locally is now much worse, and so the pollution is worse, they just see us as cash cows.
You may as well pay up the smaller amount as you are unlikely to succeed in a challenge unless you can show it wasn't visibly signposted.

Yep, they are deliberately designed to be quite vague and confusing/poorly angled and displayed.

There is one on a crossing of four roads near a local pub, we often sit in the afternoon looking out the window and count up the easily dozen or so £80 fines during our two drinks.

Thanks both, I thought as much. Better get on to paying that fine!

Yes OH appealed one for Greenwich the signs didnt exist on entry to the road and the picture 'proving' OH entered past the signs were showing him exiting the road, not entering the zone. We maintain there were no signs on entry, he wouldnt have gone down the road

They couldnt and wouldnt show pictures of him passing signs alerting him to the zone on entry and rejected the appeal.

Fleecers.

I’ve had similar. A regular road is closed only 8-10am (for school drop offs) on school mornings. There is one tiny sign telling you this, no info on fines, no barriers or planters. And a £160 fine for getting it wrong.

You should try living in one! We are hemmed in on 3 sides and now have to sit on a very busy A road for what seems like decades in order to get to a road we could once access in 2 minutes.
Then the fuckers in the next street close it on a Sunday every 2 months so 'the kiddies can play in the street like we used to'. Grrrr (no kid has ever voluntarily played in the street at this time; they are dragged kicking and screaming into the road by their parents!)

'Play streets', that's the name of the new money swindling racket. Strange, because my mum always told us to never play in the road, and that's when hardly anyone even had a car !

I live on one and cars drive through all the time. £160 a pop. Some accidentally, some on purpose (they get out, cover their number plates and drive through). Motorbikes drive on the pavement instead.

Google maps doesn't recognise it still tells me to drive that way.

Council are making a fortune, assuming the fines.all get paid. I doubt an appeal would work.

They are 100% a cash cow for the local councils.

Like all "environmental" rules, they are simply a ruse for the LA to raise money.

You're just another victim of state robbery.

Waltham Forest is a nightmare for drivers now. I refuse to drive anywhere in it now if I can avoid. The result, I take my business elsewhere not to the local shops.
Recently ended up driving in such an area by accident and ended up going round in circles unable to get back onto the main road, it was a total nightmare.