Benefit scroungers - an alternative view

[SerendipityJane]

And this is a literal drop in the ocean. If this lot paid 1/10 of that unpaid tax, we could all have a free goat.

https://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/every-midlands-tax-dodgers-shamed-31422808

Thats £11,559,328.39 for people who don't want to add it up.

We need to stop punching down.

Notice the tumbleweed in this topic.. Clear proof that the vast majority of the UK don't care about tax dodgers and obsess over benefits instead ...

At least I don't have to explain why I have little faith in the masses. Half of them are below average intelligence.

You think OP is punching down here?

OP you are not wrong.

1. You are comparing two completely different things - the fact that some people go in for tax evasion doesn’t make it OK to scam the benefits system. 2). Tax avoidance is legal - so the diagram above is rubbish, conflating tax avoidance and tax evasion.

This hits the nail on the head - absolutely correct

I fully agree with OP's view. However I don't think OP has been clear and I think a careless read of this implies it is benefits scroungers who are costing this sum, not the tax dodgers

So to be clear to other visitors to the thread, the point OP is making is that tax dodging costs the UK government many many many times more than benefit fraud. So let's chase the tax dodgers rather than demonise those who claim benefits fraudulently.

I must admit I don't have the first idea why people would rather report their dishonest benefit claiming cousin than the tax dodging small business that offers them a cheap bathroom for cash, or rather than avoid Amazon

But there we are

Yep OP. Why don’t people care more about this?! Unpaid taxes = reduced money for running the country.

Yet the DWP billed me for overpaid Maternity allowance when my daughter was 23! Threatened with court action etc etc. it terrifies me and I laid the £97 immediately. Had never heard anything about it before!

I’m surprised it’s as little as £11 million, albeit only for one region. And I think also includes amounts owed by businesses that have gone bust, some due to government policies no doubt! Still, when the governments own numbers put fraudulent benefit claims at £10 billion, £11 million is a drop in the ocean

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/publishing-details-of-deliberate-tax-defaulters-pddd/current-list-of-deliberate-tax-defaulters

You can look at the full list

Completely agree - and to put the misleading nature of that graph into context, it shows that tax avoided (legal), evaded) illegal) and uncollected (an HMRC failing) as combined £120 billion.

But the use of personal pension contribution is tax avoidance, is perfectly legal and ‘costs’ HMRC around £60 billion a year. Is that included in the £120 billion number or excluded? ISAa ‘cost’ the government £7 or £8 billion? In the number or not? The list goes on…

edited for typos. More remain I’m sure 🤣

Absolutely with you OP.

The diagram is complete bollocks though.

as others have pointed out tax avoidance and tax evasion are completely different things.

thats why you pay an accountant, it’s their job to legally let you pay as little as possible.

This. Tax avoidance and tax evasion are two completely different things. Every single person who pays money into a pension avoids tax, as does anyone who uses the government tax free childcare scheme.

I'd be far more interested in the numbers with 'tax avoidance' stripped out as this isn't in any way illegal. It's just being financially prudent.

Yep OP. Why don’t people care more about this?! Unpaid taxes = reduced money for running the country.

Look ! Someone on benefits !!!!

Sorry, you were saying ?

Oh and to use tax avoidance measures you actually need to have some tax to pay in the first place, generally people using them are nonetheless paying taxes even if they have used legal measures to reduce how much they need to pay.

At least they are contributing.

Somebody has to, after all