Neighbours and DC illness TW suspect child abuse

[SomeSuspicions]

My semi detached neighbours young DC (10 yrs old ) sadly has cancer. We are getting worried about increasing levels of the DC screaming, crying, arguing, shouting with the parents, and the mother in particular shouting end screaming back.
The DC often shouts to be let out of their room. They are very feisty and stand up for themselves.

Last week there was an incident where the DC was screaming to be let out then crying loudly and we heard the DC say "my drip is leaking" with lots of loud sobbing.
They shouted for the toilet, eventually the mother came upstairs screaming and shouting at the DC to let them out.

We don't know what is involved with having a DC at home requiring cancer treatment, and I would guess sometimes they need their treatment and don't want it, do there might be some stress and force needed.

I appreciate it is a terrible time for them, and I don't want to report them and add more strain if it's part of having a child at home with cancer.

The DC isn't in school, but we have seen a nurse come to the house, and they have regular hospital appointments so if there was abuse, surely this would be spotted?

No dc should EVER be locked in a room. I would be ringing the police for a welfare check.

I’d normally be one to say stay out of things but if the dc is clearly begging to be let out of the room then they must be locked in. So I’d do as pp suggested

Give the NSPCC a call OP. www.nspcc.org.uk/keeping-children-safe/reporting-abuse/nspcc-helpline/

Call the police OP.

I think my first step would be to offer to go round and help mum. Say you know she's got loads going on and would she like any help with occupying DC or helping tidy up etc. She may decline, but if she accepts it will allow you to get a clearer picture, and potentially help with the level of stress too.

Does the DC have any additional needs on top of the illness? Our autistic DC sometimes shouts to be let out during meltdowns, I'm in the room with him at the time waiting for him to calm down but he will be very very loud until he settles, and we keep him in his room with one of us there to try and help settle him to avoid our other DC getting upset by the meltdowns. Her shouting isn't ideal though.
Only you know whether it seems like it needs a referral or not though as you're the one actually hearing it. I'd base it on whether its occasional or frequent and the level of shouting from the mum.

Thank you. I have offered 6 months ago and they declined.
We don't know if there's additional needs.
inwas going to say I could try and listen to find out if someone might be in the room with the dc but it feels creepy to be trying to listen.
We don't want to be hearing and don't intentionally try to listen but obviously when we can hear a child screaming and crying its hard to ignore.

You need to report this. Better safe than sorry.

Thank you everyone. Itm going to do this and see what they say.

I would hate for the DC to grow up wondering how no one ever did anything to help them if they are being abused, especially given their illness.

I'd be very careful here. Do you know what sort of cancer by the way?

If a child is having a meltdown, the words they say may not reflect the situation. She was a lot younger (2-5) but my child's emotional regulation has been all over the place since having a brain tumour removed. I've had 'stop hurting me', 'stop touching me' 'leave me alone' whilst I've been sat quietly the other side of the room. On occasion I've held the hospital room door open so they could see I was nowhere near here when she was shouting those things.

We also don't know the situation. Whilst crying to be let out of a room seems cruel, there could be a parent in there with a child, they could be trying to leave to avoid taking medication, who knows.

I'm more concerned about the mum shouting back, but that may indicate mum needs more support, rather than reporting.

But bluntly, if you had no concerns about abuse/neglect before the cancer, then I'd think that the current situation is related to the cancer instead. If because of screaming (dressing changes, ng tube changes, meltdowns) my neighbour had reported us for abuse I think I'd have broken down all altogether.

If you have concerns about the stress of the home environment then writing a note to the nurse (or nursing team, you could ask it to be passed along and no one would know it was you) as that will highlight discreetly to medical professionals as to the increasing tension.

I’m sorry you’ve experienced that.

Thing is, there’s every chance it could be anything from what you went through to actual abuse. The thing is that the OP doesn’t know, and so realistically the only way to help this child is to get professionals involved.

It’s entirely possible that the cancer is causing this, but it’s equally possible that it’s not. And so many child abuse cases slip through the cracks precisely because people say “it could be this or that reason and getting involved could harm the family” and so they do nothing, and before you know it families are up in court for the most heinous crimes.

Totally get that, but that's why she should look at the history here as well. I mean it's possible that abuse would suddenly start after a cancer diagnosis, but it's less likely than the myriad of other reasons.

The amount of stress that family will be under is hard to imagine. Every time the parents have to apply pressure for him to do something necessary re cancer his parents will already feel like shit parents. Holding down a kid whilst they plead you to 'make them stop' honestly makes you feel like the worst parent in the world, even though it's to save their life. How would you feel if that was you and those sharing a wall with you thought you were abusing your child.

Just in case it is abuse, that's why a discreet note/email to be forwarded to the nurse is a better plan.

@Somuchgoo I'm sorry for your experience and can't imagine how it must feel.
I understand what you're saying which is why I've posted because I don't want to accuse the family of ca if there is none at such a traumatic time already.

We've been aware of a lot nasty shouting and screaming for a while which would predate the cancer diagnosis (not brain related).

We suspected the dc may be ND due to the huge meltdowns, my DD is ND and it feels familiar when she was the same age, but the parents are also very shouty and explosive.

I'm pretty certain there is no one else in the room with the dc when they're screaming to be let out, as you can hear adults running through the house but again I do appreciate there may be a medical need for it.

I'm still conflicted this morning. It will be fairly obvious it was us reporting them as we share a wall so another reason for my hesitation.

Ok I've decided, I'm going to email nspcc and see what they say.

Report your concerns.

You’re not accusing any one of anything. That’s irrelevant. What’s relevant is you have concerns. Professionals can check them out and that is what they are there for.

Please don’t delay. Children being ill and having treatment does not mean they’re not experiencing neglect, unsafe care, emotional, or any other abuse. It happens way more than you can imagine probably if you don’t work in this field.

How are you still conflicted? Safeguarding is everyone's responsibility. Call the nspcc now. Don't email

But you’re making assumptions here.

As you know, children with disabilities are more likely to be abused than those without. Hence why so many end up in the care system.

It’s not up to the OP to tread carefully. She needs to email professional bodies, not slip discrete notes to the nurses who will almost certainly involve said professional bodies anyway. If a nurse is told of suspected child abuse it’s their duty to refer to SS as a matter of safeguarding. The nurses aren’t going to have a quiet word with the parents to check everything is alright. Do you think that a child abuser is going to say “no, things aren’t ok and we shout and scream and lock him in a room when we can’t cope.”?

Because I'm aware of what @Somuchgoo said and I wouldn't want to put more pressure on the family if I'm wrong.

I've emailed now anyway.

we shout and scream and lock him in a room when we can’t cope @AnyoneWhoHasAHeart

I haven't thought about why they would do it and this is it, isn't it. Makes so much sense now and I feel sick that I've not connected the dots before now.
As I've mentioned the DC is spirited, they answer back and are not a quiet submissive child.
They seem like quite fiery people, little self regulation or self awareness. Often they're having an outside gathering with friends and the conversation flares up suddenly, pp jump in to calm it down.

As I said, I think how they were before/otherwise it's relevant. If things were very shouty before and you previously had concerns (which it sounds like you have) then reporting is absolutely the right thing to do. That's very different from an otherwise quiet, happy family, who are struggling to deal with a health crisis. But that doesn't seem to be the situation here.

My apologies @AnyoneWhoHasAHeart the way I've quoted you makes it look like you were saying that personally!

I wouldn't have thought a child would be allowed to be left alone in a room whilst having cancer treatment. Chemotherapy drugs are very toxic and it would be dangerous if a drip was leaking.

This needs looking into.

I think it's absolutely reasonable to seek help from the NSPCC in your situation. Even if nothing comes of it, you're acting out of concern for a child which is understandable given what you've been hearing. I would speak to someone directly rather than email though - it's better to have a conversation where they can ask you pertinent questions and give you advice directly.