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Now we are a coupe of years on. Do you think the Covid lockdowns should have happened

543 replies

Rainbowdeer · 10/02/2025 16:16

I don’t we should have shut down the schools and I don’t agree with the lockdowns
the damage has been far too great
esp regarding children’s mental health

the economy been damaged far too much

work culture has totally changed

OP posts:
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7
Newbutoldfather · 13/02/2025 12:37

@taxguru ,

There were lockdowns in the Spanish flu.

Pre internet, we didn’t need the internet because there were other ways of doing things.

I have often wondered what would have happened pre internet. It certainly would have been different, but it’s hard to predict how.

Newbutoldfather · 13/02/2025 12:39

Well here is the Swedish report which, unsurprisingly, didn’t take years and years and waste 100s of millions of taxpayer money.

What Sweden can teach us about running a Covid inquiry

https://www.thetimes.com/article/da76e9ca-fc7c-11ed-aa31-73394e195d29?shareToken=29ecede1c5da641639c97c5d3a417b00

And the conclusion was that they should have locked down harder and earlier…

What Sweden can teach us about running a Covid inquiry

If Baroness Hallett is looking for tips on how to run Britain’s Covid-19 inquiry, then she might look towards Sweden. By the time the retired Court of Appeal j

https://www.thetimes.com/article/da76e9ca-fc7c-11ed-aa31-73394e195d29?shareToken=29ecede1c5da641639c97c5d3a417b00

Mightymoog · 13/02/2025 12:40

Newbutoldfather · 13/02/2025 12:37

@taxguru ,

There were lockdowns in the Spanish flu.

Pre internet, we didn’t need the internet because there were other ways of doing things.

I have often wondered what would have happened pre internet. It certainly would have been different, but it’s hard to predict how.

Spanish flu there was only ever advice to avoid crowded places etc.
many theatres etc. did close but that wasn't a gov. law and there was never the over reach of telling people who they could have in their own home, so very different

ThePartingOfTheWays · 13/02/2025 12:43

Newbutoldfather · 13/02/2025 12:37

@taxguru ,

There were lockdowns in the Spanish flu.

Pre internet, we didn’t need the internet because there were other ways of doing things.

I have often wondered what would have happened pre internet. It certainly would have been different, but it’s hard to predict how.

There were not lockdowns as practiced in 2020-1 during the Spanish flu.

We didn't see governments shutting down entire sections of the economy and decreeing others to move home, not least because so much of the work people did then required them to be out of the house. We did not see them criminalise leaving the house except in certain circumstances, for entire national populations.

Some aspects of covid pandemic management were thousands of years old, like quarantine. But we have never had anything like lockdown policy as a whole before.

BiddyPop · 13/02/2025 13:39

For the Spanish flu, there wasn't the same population density, sharing of overcrowded public transport, the sheer movement of people around the planet on planes, and general propensity to get up close to people regardless of what other people wanted. (Yes, there were apartments and tenements, and public transport was used - I am talking about the quantum of overcrowding that went on).

Those countries which locked down hard had lower levels of incidence, severity and mortality.

Those countries which were more lax saw higher numbers infected, more seriously ill and dying.

And the lockdowns were as much about ensuring the public health systems globally, many of which were heavily over-stretched, did not utterly collapse under the sheer numbers of sick people needing treatment.

Yes it has caused many short and longer term problems for individual countries and globally, in a wide variety of ways.

But think how much worse it would have been - sending the kids to school but not knowing if a teacher would turn up because they were sick (or too scared to). Going into the office but the security guards and cleaners being sick so it's filthy, if you can even get in the door. Senior managers having to go to work but getting sick and not being able to manage the big systems of government and public services. People insisting on going out in their cars because "it's only flu" but passing it on even more.

By having clear strict rules, people could get the essentials and essential systems stayed online. Lots of people were supported to not work in the public interest. Many people learned the new skills of remote working, and the business of government, and many commercial businesses, stayed operating with lower levels of absence due to illness because of remote working not passing on the virus. There were fewer dangers for going out to work for those essential workers who did need to turn up in person (healthcare, electricity and broadband and water services, bin men, shop workers etc).

I have personally had a lot to deal with in fall out from lock down, and I have been incredibly lucky in many ways. But I still would have done it, and would do it again if it was necessary.

Those who locked down early like Tonga and Fiji had very very few cases overall. Even New Zealand and Australia.

I was tracking case numbers in the early days (the first 3 months) and graphing the quantum of changes. Ireland had and earlier and a far stricter lockdown, and adherence to it, than the UK - the numbers of those ill initially were relatively similar proportionally to population size, but in the UL they climbed exponentially whereas in Ireland it was a far more steady line of increase and it curved back down again much quicker. Both in terms of infections, numbers in hospitals and also numbers of deaths. Literally the like-for-like daily numbers.

Herewegoagain29 · 13/02/2025 13:54

I found this podcast extremely interesting, it claims that what Europe rolled out was a Biological weapon defence plan through NATO -to protect populations in a local area from the release of a bio weapon and not a public health plan at all.
I had not thought about Covid as a bio-weapon before but that's what gain of function was set up to create, and even if it was the USA funding the WuHan Lab and it's release being an accident it's obvious the military would be worried at first that it was a bio attack.

This podcast claims that they use SEABURN response - for weapons of mass destruction /bio destruction.

The podcast theorieses that it was a response being co-ordinated by the military /Nato in all allied countries and this is why we all entered lockdowns in lockstep.

The media censoring of free speech and any speculation that it was made in a Lab was shut down, scientists who suggested it were discredited.
We had no freedom of movement, punishment through the law for civil disobedience. When you think about it, it had a very militeristic feel to it.

Dutch health minister Fleaur Agma said in Dutch parliament that control was taken away from her parliament and control was given to NATO.

It was also called an epidemic at the time, before the figures came in and that has always in the past been a retrospective affair to name a disease a pandemic.

The podcast goes into other claims about 'new world order' etc that I'm not a believer in but the Nato control hidden behind the health message I can believe, Sweden for instance was not a member of Nato then, and made it's own decisions which turned out to be correct.

reesewithoutaspoon · 13/02/2025 14:04

The first one absolutely yes. I was in ICU at the time.

Auburngal · 13/02/2025 15:17

Eat Out To Help Out - More like Eat Out To Get Covid.

I in 6 cases in August 2020 was caused by EOTHO.

taxguru · 13/02/2025 15:54

Auburngal · 13/02/2025 15:17

Eat Out To Help Out - More like Eat Out To Get Covid.

I in 6 cases in August 2020 was caused by EOTHO.

Yup, another massive cock up by Rishi.

Mightymoog · 13/02/2025 16:06

taxguru · 13/02/2025 15:54

Yup, another massive cock up by Rishi.

I don't see the problem.
Everyone was going to get it at some point anyway.
The paranoid ones wouldn't have been going out anyway so the only people using the scheme were the ones who weren't bothered when they got it

noblegiraffe · 13/02/2025 16:16

I thought you understood exponential growth? The rate of increase in covid cases is proportional to the amount of covid in the population. Covid spreading faster means that more people have it at the same time which is certainly a problem when it comes to NHS capacity. It is far better for ‘everyone is going to get it at some point’ to happen over a longer time period, pushing that into a time when we had vaccinated the vulnerable, even better.

Parker231 · 13/02/2025 16:29

Mightymoog · 13/02/2025 16:06

I don't see the problem.
Everyone was going to get it at some point anyway.
The paranoid ones wouldn't have been going out anyway so the only people using the scheme were the ones who weren't bothered when they got it

The aim was to prevent everyone getting it and therefore there being cases needing hospital treatment and ICU beds.

Mightymoog · 13/02/2025 16:40

Parker231 · 13/02/2025 16:29

The aim was to prevent everyone getting it and therefore there being cases needing hospital treatment and ICU beds.

the aim was not to prevent everyone getting it.
The aim was to prevent everypone getting it in the first couple of months,
EOTHO was long after the initial infections

noblegiraffe · 13/02/2025 16:46

Mightymoog · 13/02/2025 16:40

the aim was not to prevent everyone getting it.
The aim was to prevent everypone getting it in the first couple of months,
EOTHO was long after the initial infections

What do you mean it was ok for people to get it after the first couple of months? We ended up having to lock down again…

Snugglemonkey · 13/02/2025 16:49

I didn't think it was a good idea then. Definitely don't now. Children paid too high a price.

Parker231 · 13/02/2025 18:08

Snugglemonkey · 13/02/2025 16:49

I didn't think it was a good idea then. Definitely don't now. Children paid too high a price.

What do you think should have happened to protect cases being admitted to hospitals but for children to have a normal life?

Mightymoog · 13/02/2025 18:56

the barrington declaration basically encapsulated what I thought but of course it was a voice of dissent so got silenced and the scientists and medics ridiculed or ignored

noblegiraffe · 13/02/2025 18:59

Silenced? They wouldn't bloody shut up about it.

Yytfrhte · 13/02/2025 19:17

taxguru · 13/02/2025 15:54

Yup, another massive cock up by Rishi.

He did his best to keep the economy afloat. And he tried to help the hospitality sector as much as possible. Rishi was an excellent Chancellor. As PM he could have done a lot more, but by that time his party were on a sinking trajectory

taxguru · 13/02/2025 19:23

Yytfrhte · 13/02/2025 19:17

He did his best to keep the economy afloat. And he tried to help the hospitality sector as much as possible. Rishi was an excellent Chancellor. As PM he could have done a lot more, but by that time his party were on a sinking trajectory

Edited

I'll have some of what you've been drinking.

Excluding 3 million freelancers and self employed from the covid support schemes wasn't "doing his best". At the start he said in Parliament "no one will be left behind" - once he'd taken a lot of flack re the covid exclusion cock ups, he changed his tune to "we can't help everyone".

Excluding 3 million workers, 10% of the workforce was a massive cock-up and caused a lot of business failures, bankruptcies etc.

Roselilly36 · 13/02/2025 19:29

No, never should have happened.

Mightymoog · 13/02/2025 19:29

noblegiraffe · 13/02/2025 18:59

Silenced? They wouldn't bloody shut up about it.

it was ignored as a possible solution but strangely it appears woud have been the better way forward

noblegiraffe · 13/02/2025 19:57

It was ignored as a possible solution because it didn't actually explain how elderly/vulnerable people could be protected from catching covid while it raged among the general population. Perhaps they could have been put in a similar bubble to the one that you assume that school children exist in?

Snugglemonkey · 13/02/2025 20:47

Parker231 · 13/02/2025 18:08

What do you think should have happened to protect cases being admitted to hospitals but for children to have a normal life?

I think we should have actually used the nightingale hospitals and the private facilities like ivf clinics,which were closed for business, but paid great sums of public money to be on standby.
I think children should be prioritised and if we lost more older people, so be it. I would be totally happy with that as an older person.

Parker231 · 13/02/2025 21:21

Snugglemonkey · 13/02/2025 20:47

I think we should have actually used the nightingale hospitals and the private facilities like ivf clinics,which were closed for business, but paid great sums of public money to be on standby.
I think children should be prioritised and if we lost more older people, so be it. I would be totally happy with that as an older person.

Where would the staff come from for the nightingale hospitals and private facilities?

What would you have done to prioritise children?

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