Insomnia and a full time job-anyone else?

[PencilFace]

Just wondering if anyone can relate. Since I’ve hit my late thirties I seem to have lost the ability to sleep normally at night. It can take me many long, dark, dull hours to drop off and then I tend to sleep fitfully. At weekends I can sleep much better.

I have a job that I really enjoy but it’s getting increasingly hard to be ‘normal’ there when I am frequently so sleep deprived. Long term if this carries on I’m either going to have to go part-time or even quit, neither of which I want to do!

Any other fellow working insomniacs for some solidarity? Or any tips of how to function on little sleep? I’m tried all the usual warm bath, magnesium, CBT etc. Doc says take a SSRI but I’m not convinced.

Yes. I had a thread on this last Summer. I did the NHS sleep programme, I was surviving on 4 hours in bed per night. Someone suggested Phenergen which worked for a while. I am using Magnesium Citrate at the minute which seems ok. Getting about 6 hours now.

I also can relate OP. Struggled with insomnia for several years now. Reached breaking point with it in 2022 and was prescribed sleeping tablets as I’d been awake over 48 hours and was clawing at the carpet in desperation. I was referred to the sleepio programme. Also had insomnia CBT treatment through the insomnia clinic privately as I felt I was out of my depth. I manage well now on around 6 hours a night but i still find having to ‘get up’ anxiety Inducing the night before as I worry I won’t sleep and then I become hyper vigilant with it. I did go part time at work as I wanted the peace of mind that when I struggle to go to sleep, it will only be for a few days and I will survive. In solidarity..it’d horrid, it can get better though.

I know exactly what you are going through , I’ve had sleep problems since having my dcs , I’ve had 3 dcs and two were v bad sleepers , one didn’t sleep properly until 8 years. As a result i developed severe insomnia (random when it crops up ) , now it’s prob running into an age thing as just hit 40 but I’ve had it since I was late 20, early 30’s with my dcs .
The worst for me is a Sunday evening as I’ve a very long day of work on Monday and I’ve 3 dcs to sort as well so very , very busy !!!.
I’ll get the thought when I wake (I never sleep through since having my first child 13 years ago ) in the night “what if I can’t go back to sleep “, it actually happened last Sunday evening and I think I had around 3/4 hours with a full-on 15 hour day … it’s very, very hard. The natural stuff doesn’t work for me ; I’ve tried magnesium (different typs-did absolutely nothing ), tried valerian (did absolutely nothing ), I’ve tried amitripiline (it works but it isn’t good to take it long-term and it made me very sluggish and hungry and I was on the lowest dose ), nytol really works for me but again you aren’t supposed to take it long-term (I don’t know why though 🤷‍♀️) ..
I do think it really helps to just say “it doesn’t matter if I sleep, if it happens , it happens. Your body is resting , you won’t die with lack of sleep (believe me , I know)
I know how hard that is when you have to work the next day tho..I find if I don’t allow the panic to set in during the night I’m more likely to nod off. I feel for you , it’s horrendous especially when you are exhausted and need to sleep.

I recommend it every time somebody starts a thread on insomnia but sign up to the free emails from The Insomnia Coach. It sounds ridiculous but they helped me so, so much. The guy who runs it has a paid one-to-one service too but I never needed to use it (couldn't bloody afford it anyway but there are many raving reviews about it).

I have this. Fine on my working from home days but when I'm in the office (like tomorrow) I won't sleep more than an hour. I feel awful all night and then like death warmed up all day.

And then on Tuesday im so tired I cant concentrate so often 'lose' that day of work just being slow and then have a pile of work to catch up on all week.

Have you thought about just taking a sleeping pill on Sunday night? Sunday is my worst night so now I just take a nytol or similar to pre empt it. Then I can at least be fairly ok on a Monday.

Sorry to hear other people are going through this. For me the most effective thing is to take one of the sedating antihistamines but they apparently they are no good long term.

I've never been great at falling asleep but menopause has made it way worse.

I have had some success with sleep hypnosis (I just got some free downloads from adamcoxhypnotist.co.uk/) and a good set of sleep headphones. I know if that doesn't work, I'm in for a long night (it's 2am here now).

Thanks for this

Post menopause hit me like a ton of bricks in my late 30s/early 40s, the sleep got worse and worse. Couldn't fall into a deep sleep and woke earlier and earlier til I was awake for the night by 2am. Never realised this was a hormonal symptom but when I eventually realised it progesterone tablets solved it with 2.5 weeks.
It was horrendous trying to work fulltime

Being perimenopausal has mega messed with my sleep. Phenergern really helps, but I tend only to take it on a Friday night as I will easily sleep 15 hours when I take it and being woken by an alarm on it can leave me groggy.

I find Wednesday night's are my worst. I suspect because I know Thursdays and Fridays are my long busy days where I don't stop till 10pm ish.

You're in the age range for menopause.

I think it’s hormonal as my periods have changed and it’s very linked to my cycle. It’s just so weird lying there at 1 am when I’ve been busy all day so should be tired. I often feel as awake as if it were the middle of the day.

At the moment I’m strategically taking anti histamines on two or three days a week but I know I can’t just keep doing that. I find the doctors no help although I suppose it’s a difficult one to treat. I had such high hope for CBT but if anything it just made things worse as it made me obsessive over sleep.

I’m a lifelong insomniac so I sympathise OP.

I don’t have any suggestions other than take 2 Phenergan a night (I’ve been doing this for years) I also take 2 codeine a night. Even with that medication I never sleep a whole night through. Sometimes I lay awake literally all night, especially on the run up to a full moon.

The run up to the last full moon was dreadful. I had one night of no sleep and 3 nights of approx 3 hrs each night. I felt wretched.

Sorry to not be able to give advice - at least you’re not alone. I hope yours is a temporary thing.

You poor thing! Do you work? I’ve had a few all-nighters and they are dreadful. Insomnia seems to run in my family so I think I’m doomed. Have you tried a different sleep aid to help? Kirkland sleep aid is supposed to be very effective. Someone at my work told me today they take amitriptyline and it knocks them out but causes grogginess the next day. I suppose it’s better than not sleeping.

Hi OP. I’m retired now but used to work full time with a family.

I’ve tried all sorts of remedies without success. The last I tried was magnesium but it made matters worse - I felt absolutely wired. Apparently it does have that effect on some people, which is obviously not what I wanted. Years ago doctors were more able to prescribe sleeping tablets but are unable to do so now. I don’t think that real insomnia is taken seriously. It is very debilitating.

Many years ago a doctor gave me a lecture on ‘sleep hygiene’… so… he said, as if imparting some hitherto unknown spell ‘no exciting films, no caffeine in the evening, wind down, etc, etc.’ I had to bite my lip! I said to him that after half a century of dealing with insomnia I didn’t need to have ‘the obvious’ reiterated. It makes you feel helpless doesn’t it?

You’re right that it does run in families… my son suffers badly from it too.

I have given up thinking that anything will change for me as by now I’ve gone through all the milestones of life and that one issue remains constant. I’ve just got used to being tired.

Hi OP I’m flexi retired so older and I suspect the menopause has made it worse but the icing on the cake I think was long Covid. Caught it the first time and during the acute illness I was absolutely wired. Saying that I was off sick from work so it didn’t matter that my sleep pattern was buggered up. It kind of improved but then I caught it again in 2023 and in August last year. Each time it messed up my sleep and each time it takes longer to settle. Last week at least 3 nights I was tossing and turning, at the worst awake til 4ish. Unlike you I’m fortunately not full time but I do find it’s dulling my thinking iykwim. Tried Nytol, mgso4, melatonin, Yoga nidra, you name it and tbh they’ve not worked that well apart from the Yoga for just general well-being and relaxation. Not sure what the solution is, I’ve cut out caffeine and using IPad before bed etc but there’s not much else I can think of, I guess I’m just resigned to it !

Has anyone tried Daridorexant? Apparently it’s a relatively new drug that’s available for long-term insomnia.

Solidarity to everyone who has suffered from this! It really is horrible and above all just incredibly frustrating, I feel like my brain has turned against me. Lying there for hours with racing thoughts, dreading the next day, the headachy-haze in the morning…I’m lucky that the antihistamines work for me but then apparently they cause dementia

I just worry I then won't wake up in time..I need to be up at 5 to make the train. I've done today on 2 hours sleep, exhausted!

I take trazodone at night. It's an antidepressant but also a mild sedative. It works well for me.

I also have terrible trouble sleeping. What doesn't help for me is my work means I have to be "on call" regularly which mostly means I'm up through the night and then have to juggle the kids/school run during the day so whilst I get the next day off I don't get an 8 hour opportunity to sleep. I think this has messed my sleep pattern up. Coupled with menopause I'm on my knees. My work is suffering and I have no quality time with my family because I'm just exhausted. I'm interested in some of these medications people are taking. Whilst I cannot take them whilst on call maybe they will help me when I'm not.

I’ve read a lot of good things about that for sleep. The doctors never mentioned it to me. I’m wary of taking antidepressants as I’m already overweight and worried about gaining more. However I do think that poor sleep is negatively effecting my appetite as I tend to crave carbs and sugar the next day and seem to have trouble with impulse control.

I take Amitriptyline now. Not every night but if I'm in a bad bout.

It took me a long time to get it prescribed and it was only after I'd been referred to a mental health nurse who signed me off after a particularly appalling week of sleep.

The next time I saw the GP, he started on about milky drinks and I got really angry that they just weren't listening.

The insomnia clinic also helped.

This is just a miserable disorder and the impact is massively underrated. First of all I would have full bloods done. Hypo/hyper causes tiredness but deep sleep can't be achieved. Maybe peri or anxiety. I can only sleep if my mind is clear, how many go to bed with a clear mind these days!

I really hope you can get to the bottom of this. Sending good thoughts.

@PencilFace I haven't found that trazodone has led to any weight gain at all, certainly not compared to other types of ADs.

That sounds really tough. I can recommend piriton allergy kids syrup. I can sometimes get away with a large spoonful of that and a small amount of melatonin. It’s sedating without being overly so. Phenergan and Doxylamine are highly effective I find but can leave me feeling very very sedated the next day unlike piriton. Obviously you can’t take any of them if you are on call but it might help at other times.