DD has been stuck on the M5 for 6 hours

[GinForBreakfast]

I know there's been a serious incident but you can't leave people stuck on a motorway for 6 hours. That will include elderly people and tiny children. In other countries they manage to clear the roads far quicker.

No sign of anything moving and even once she does she's still 4 hours from home.

It's very sensible to keep things in your car. But you're making the assumption that no major harm can befall you because you're fit and healthy. It's not just about medical conditions.

Look at it another way, apart from the practicalities - what if you were on your way to hospital because a relative was dying? What could you bring with you then that would help?

I wish I could explain just how random the things are that happen out there. It's not right to sneer at people for being unprepared. It could happen to anyone.

Your poor dd. I admit to not knowing that much about accidents, but I always struggle to understand, once the casualties have been moved, once the scene assessed for forensics etc, how they can't open up at least one lane, asap, to get traffic moving.

If you are on a repeat, you can collect it when it's due, not three days before because you want some extra to keep in your car.

That's not the case. Source: years of personal experience of taking medication and being able to collect medication over a week before it runs out.

Again, collecting your meds early is something that the NHS is recommending because your pharmacist might be sick that day, the pharmacy flooded, or the medication you need being out of stock.

This is another example of oversimplifying things and calling it a solution.

So what do you call all the people saying that the police should reopen the roads faster, turn cars around sooner, set up diversions sooner, etc?

"My husband is an accident investigator. The initial accident and emergency care followed by investigations will take a few hours but not 5 and during that time the diversions should take place. "

Exactly.

I always struggle to understand, once the casualties have been moved, once the scene assessed for forensics etc,

How long do you think these things actually take?

That's certainly not my experience. I would be able to request extra if I was going away on holiday, but no my GP would not prescribe extra medication for me to keep lying around. That's nice that yours does.

Unfortunately I have had personal experience of the police not wanting to attend breakdowns to relieve traffic. I had one when I worked in lorry breakdowns where one was blocking a roundabout at a junction. The police were actually pretty rude to me about that and I had to make more than one call to persuade them to go.

Granted, that was another circumstance to this, where they have to attend due to the seriousness of it, but I was quite surprised by how reluctant the police were in general to relieve potentially dangerous traffic. It was different police forces too, as this could be anywhere in the UK.

It's not my area of experience other than that, so I wouldn't like to comment on it further. I suppose it's unlikely there isn't some improvement that could be made on efficiency though. Having a crumbling infrastructure can't be helping matters.

Whenever eco protesters close the roads we hear plenty about the serious knock on consequences. In fact, that was part of the reason why some of them got such severe sentences recently.

It should not be acceptable for the road to be closed for this long. It puts people in danger. A tragedy has occurred but there’s no point creating another one.

what if you were on your way to hospital because a relative was dying? What could you bring with you then that would help?

The same can be said for missed flights or any other circumstance in which the journey is time-critical.

What do you think the police and Highways Agency can do in that time-critical situation when someone jumps off a motorway bridge? Nothing!

You prepare for what you can prepare for. You accept what you can't prepare for. That some things can't be mitigated against doesn't mean that you shouldn't try to mitigate against what can be mitigated against.

Ever since Covid, the consistent NHS messaging has been "get your meds early". In your position, I'd raise that with your GP because having to get to your last dose before being able to get a refill puts you at risk if you, say, test positive for Covid so can't visit the pharmacy for two weeks.

I didn't say people should drive on a wing and a prayer. I said they should accept that they probably don't have the one thing they'll actually need, so they're not as prepared as they think they are. So be careful with the hubris.

A girl landed on the tarmac from a considerable height. She may have fractured her spine. Her spine would need to be evaluated and possibly stabilised before she was even moved off the tarmac and onto the stretcher-trolley. There may be other casualties as well, depending on whether any vehicles collided with each other or the bridge.

This is an unusual incident, it's not the more common case of car A hits car B. It's not surprising that it took longer than usual to clear.

What hubris? I have just reread every one of my posts on this thread and I am not seeing any hubris.

At no point have I claimed that it's possible to prepare for everything that could ever possibly happen. I have said that people can reasonably foresee the risk of delays on the road and reasonably mitigate the physical consequences of those delays. People were complaining about getting hungry and cold, about needing a pee. Not about missing a relative's final moments in hospital.

A few hours, less than 5, per a pp whose Dh is an accident assessor. Not 8 like ops dd is currently. Nor 13 which a pp stated.

Sorry that was to @selffellatingouroborosofhate

That's right, they don't. But I was very smug after I bought a spare wheel for the car not long after i bought it.

I was driving in France and hit a kerb on a Saturday late afternoon - all the tyre places were closed for a repair, they don't open on Sundays so I put the spare on.

It's called taking personal responsibility, being prepared and not putting yourself in a vulnerable life threatening position. I've driven all over the world, and some places, if you don't have a 5 litre bottle of water with you, and breakdown in the middle of nowhere in 40 degrees with no shade, you can die.

I guess the equivalent here might be being stuck on a motorway for 6 hours in a snowstorm without a coat and your heater packs up.

The cold can kill you. Missing a meal can cause real issues for some people. Some people have continence issues. Those are real problems.

Also, you have no idea what urgent business any of those people were on. It's entirely possible someone's life was changed by being stuck in that queue.

Anyway, what's wrong with complaining? If someone is grumpy because they're trapped in or next to a metal box for several hours, that sounds reasonable to me. I certainly wouldn't like to go out and spend the night in my car right now.

I think you'll find that the emergency services health and safety are at risk if one lane is opened to relieve the traffic because some people are just arses the way they drive.

Healthy people maybe.

Some health conditions actually no amount of planning can stop that rapidly becoming a high risk situation

As a minimum I wouldn't be safe to drive away if stuck like that. At worst I would need a prolonged hospital stay agter

@selffellatingouroborosofhate

She wouldn’t get out as was too shy,

Nowhere to hide and pee - Son wouldn’t pee as GF couldn’t, and I didn’t feel able either.

WTF? I hope you told him to go and have a wee!!

That's an excellent point on top of all the reasons I've already given as to why it can be a very long time before the roads are reopened.

I think you may have misinterpreted my post...

It wasn't my son.

I was congratulating Oakleaffy, whose son it was, for raising a man who wouldn't say "I'm alright Jack" but instead would show some solidarity with his suffering GF.

No, I'm not. I'm well aware that major harm could befall me. I'm well aware that random things happen. I literally said that I cannot mitigate for everything that might happen but I can consider the things that are easily solvable and mitigate for those. Note I've said mitigate, not prevent. And I'm not sneering at others. You, however, are sneering at me and it's entirely unnecessary.

If you want me to fully answer the question in your hospital trip scenario, you'll have to give more context. If you mean what am I going to do if I'm driving to the hospital to see a relative who's already there and is dying and I get stuck in traffic or the car breaks down or I have an accident, then either I'm still going to get there in time or I'm not. That's life.

I'm well aware that random things can and do happen. I've done enough driving over 35 years to not need patronising comments. I know I've been lucky. I've not had any particularly serious accidents or suffered any major medical incidents whilst I've been driving but obviously I'm aware that I could at any time. I've seen plenty of random incidents, accidents and near-misses to know that.

I know the cold can kill. That's why I carry clothing appropriate to the weather outside the vehicle, and so should other people. I know that missing meals can risk lives. That's why I carry Eat Natural bars and recommend that other people carry food. I know that continence problems affect people. That's why I carry a Shewee. If you need something to help with "the other side", you might find a dog poo bag helpful. Someone upthread suggested sitting on a nappy (perhaps adult-sized?) under a blanket in extremis.

It's entirely possible someone's life was changed by being stuck in that queue.

A girl and her family's lives were definitely changed when she hit the tarmac. Not "possible", "definite".

What is your practical, achievable suggestion for getting traffic moving again that doesn't involve vehicles destroying what could be crime scene evidence, emergency services staff being endangered by opening one lane (good spot, PrincessofWells), or the Highways Agency having a time machine?

I'm trying to offer practical suggestions, not just sit and moan that life isn't fair.

No, I'm not sneering at you nor was I accusing you of sneering personally, although I can see how that may not have been clear. It's the sneering tone on the thread from those who believe being stuck in a car for this long should be a picnic.

This picture came up randomly on my social media this evening. This is the kind of thing I imagine when I think of people delayed. It's not all about spare jumpers and chargers. It's not a nice experience and people are kidding themselves if they think they would be sitting back and chilling. I can guarantee some of these zen people up thread would be screaming bloody murder after several hours.

those who believe being stuck in a car for this long should be a picnic.

There's failing to understand me and then there's wilful misrepresentation of my words. You have just fabricated that.

Go and find where I said anything like that and post a screen capture of it. I'll wait.

If I'm coming across as a bit "sneering", 1) I'm autistic and don't always realise that my word choice comes across harshly, and 2) I have very little patience for people who don't want to carry even a basic breakdown kit because of their dog cage.