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Rageychild · 02/11/2024 12:14

Webbb · 02/11/2024 11:01

Also, Claire gained a lovely family whereas Jessica gained the knowledge she should have been brought up in the abusive childhood Claire described. That must have been hard to swallow.

Weirdly I thought the opposite reading the article. I thought it would be harder for Claire as she's the one who got very unlucky in this. Jessica had a lucky escape and was given a better life.

cheesescheeses · 02/11/2024 12:14

SerendipityJane · 02/11/2024 12:09

I am surprised this is the only example in the UK.

Only proven case.

Apparently.

Ours has been ‘proved’, it’s just not public (yet). There will be others for sure that have agreed to keep it quiet.

Westfacing · 02/11/2024 12:15

AmandaHoldensLips · 02/11/2024 10:39

I know this isn't the point and might sound ridiculous, but having had a couple of babies myself, I'm wondering how the mothers did not recognise that the baby handed to them was not theirs.

This is so tragic.

There was a case some decades back where one the mother's complained straight away that she had been handed the wrong baby after it had been in the nursery overnight, as was the practice then. But she was persuaded otherwise.

The girls grew up in the wrong home and I can't remember exactly how the truth came out - think it was the doubting mother who investigated further and was proven right.

Samcro · 02/11/2024 12:15

poor Jesica, how awful to be replaced like that.

RedToothBrush · 02/11/2024 12:15

Purplequestionmark · 02/11/2024 12:07

I am surprised this is the only example in the UK.
I feel for Jessica but by the sounds of it she had the better upbringing of the two, sad that she cant embrace her new sister and try and make the best of such a sad situation.

My child had ankle tag 8 years ago but it kept coming off. They aren't fool proof.

"Sad she can't embrace her new sister"

Except she hasn't got a new sister. She's got a replacement.

And that's how it will feel.

Lwrenn · 02/11/2024 12:17

How devastating 😢 💔

My newborns were all with me from the second they were born until we went home but I can totally see how this errors occurred over the years. Just heartbreaking.

EliflurtleAndTheInfiniteMadness · 02/11/2024 12:18

AmandaHoldensLips · 02/11/2024 10:39

I know this isn't the point and might sound ridiculous, but having had a couple of babies myself, I'm wondering how the mothers did not recognise that the baby handed to them was not theirs.

This is so tragic.

There's all sorts of reasons involving problems with the birth that would explain why a woman wouldn't have gotten a good or non out of it look at baby before they were taken away to nursery. Where I live babies room in, I could easily see confusing my first had she been taken to the nursery after the horrible birth I had and how out of it I was afterwards. Not everyone gets a straightforward delivery and a nice bonding moment afterwards.

Ambienteamber · 02/11/2024 12:19

OhBeAFineGuyKissMe · 02/11/2024 12:08

I have read that baby separation from mum (surrogacy or adoption) has impacts on the baby as they lose all the familiar sounds and smells they had a pre-existing bond with. So that could have had an impact here as well.

Growing up and looking very different from your family, maybe different abilities (everyone else is really sporty/ clever/musical and your not) must be really hard and then to find out something as catastrophic as this! It is totally unimaginable how everyone must be feeling.

(I have a teaching colleague who thinks babies are blank slates and personality etc… is 100% nurture when I think nature plays a big part)

Oh my God this is so true of my mother. Really bad attachment issues even tho she was adopted as a baby and did not even find out until middle age.
She really struggles with all interpersonal relationships.. is a hoarder and only really shows attachment to objects.
Obviously it's not just the adoption in her case but having spent time s a newborn in an institution where there were probably many babies being looked after by a handful of nuns. So a lack of 1 to 1bonding there in her first month's.

I used to think babies were blank slates and if a baby were adopted young enough it would have no impact psychologically..
But having talked to a lot of people this is not the case at all.
I have a friend and all 4 of her children are adopted. Were adopted as babies. They all have considerable trauma. She's a fantastic mum but gets constant support from social services regarding them.
It can be compounded by them having come from difficult family situations as babies.. but even if that hasn't been the case, just being separated from their bio mum's can cause considerable trauma. Now days there's thankfully so much knowledge regarding this and support given to adoptive parents on how to handle it.
But I did not realise the impact when I was younger. Babies are not blank slates at all.

MrsForgetalot · 02/11/2024 12:19

AmandaHoldensLips · 02/11/2024 10:39

I know this isn't the point and might sound ridiculous, but having had a couple of babies myself, I'm wondering how the mothers did not recognise that the baby handed to them was not theirs.

This is so tragic.

But even if you had doubts who would listen and take you seriously? It would just be PND. And how could you have proved anything anyway in the absence of a dna test? The hospital would probably double down anyway, for the sake of simplicity.

I think I’d have known my first, but maybe not been as certain of my second, I still have a sixth sense about my eldest and he’s 16 now. But I don’t have the same connection with the younger child - definitely mine though as she was a homebirth.

HarlanPepper · 02/11/2024 12:20

OneFluentCrow · 02/11/2024 11:33

I could respond individually but for the sake of time I'll keep it brief. The people concerned who did not contribute to this podcast have been portrayed in a very positive light.

There's keeping it brief, and then there's being irritatingly cryptic.

WhatsitWiggle · 02/11/2024 12:21

Another feeling for Jessica. I'm inferring from the article that she has moved away, given that Tony and Joan "travelled" to tell her the news. What a shock that must have been. And whilst Joan says Jessica will always be her daughter, she's embraced Claire - going on holiday together, spending Christmas together and they don't live too far apart. I guess Joan and Jessica's relationship wasn't all glitter and sparkle and Joan gets another go with a "new" daughter.

No mention of the other two sons/brothers, I wonder what they make of it.

Claire gets welcomed into a warm, loving family. Jessica doesn't have that - no biological siblings, biological mother dead, no mention of the father. And effectively replaced in the family she's known for 55 years.

This isn't "we've found a half sibling we didn't know about" or "the baby mum had to give up before meeting dad", both of which add to an existing family. It's "here's our proper sister", the original sister doesn't belong.

Webbb · 02/11/2024 12:23

I was terrified in 2010 about something happening to DS that I made his dad swear to never let him out of his sight for even a second. When they took him off me for whatever reason to test something or other, I made him go with him.

SerendipityJane · 02/11/2024 12:23

And how could you have proved anything anyway in the absence of a dna test?

Blood type testing. Nowhere near as conclusive though except in an exclusionary sense.

OP posts:
GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 02/11/2024 12:25

AmandaHoldensLips · 02/11/2024 10:39

I know this isn't the point and might sound ridiculous, but having had a couple of babies myself, I'm wondering how the mothers did not recognise that the baby handed to them was not theirs.

This is so tragic.

I was wondering the same. I’m sure I’d have recognised both of mine, after holding them for a few minutes right after they were born. DD2 in particular looked just like a GM of mine when she was very old and hadn’t got her teeth in! 😂

TheDowagerCountessofPembroke · 02/11/2024 12:27

I remember a drama based on a true story years ago about a case where there were two couples having ivf but the father’s sperm had been mixed up. They only found out as one couple was black and the other white. When the babies were born they were both mixed race.

As for the tags, there might well be RFID tags in the plastic wrist bands. They are really tiny, Marks and Spencer clothes often have them in as they are so small.

prh47bridge · 02/11/2024 12:28

GrumpyCactus · 02/11/2024 10:47

A bit of a side note, the article mentioned that since the 1980s all newborns have been fitted with radio tracking devices. I've had two babies in hospital in the last 15 years, and they never had anything other than a plastic wrist band with my NHS number printed on and "Baby Surname" written in sharpie?

I thought that was inaccurate too. My son is 4 and he only had a band with information written on. I wonder if it varies by trust?

RFID tags don't have to be bulky. They can look like a simple plastic wrist band. See INFA125 RFID childs wristband | Brenmoor for example.

INFA125 RFID childs wristband | Brenmoor

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https://brenmoor.com/catalogue/infa125-rfid-childs-wristband/

TheDowagerCountessofPembroke · 02/11/2024 12:28

And as for not recognising your own baby, this was over 50 years ago, women weren’t listened to then. If either mother had said that this wasn’t their baby I doubt they would have got very far.

BakewellGin1 · 02/11/2024 12:30

My oldest (2008) only had wrist bands written on.
Youngest (2019) had an electronic tag as well as a written wrist band.
They set of alarms when the midwife forgot to disable it before I went with him for his bloods etc that needed taking.

NotOneOfTheInCrowd · 02/11/2024 12:30

This reply has been deleted

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IncompleteSenten · 02/11/2024 12:32

AmandaHoldensLips · 02/11/2024 10:39

I know this isn't the point and might sound ridiculous, but having had a couple of babies myself, I'm wondering how the mothers did not recognise that the baby handed to them was not theirs.

This is so tragic.

Babies look like babies. Plus you've just given birth and are probably knackered and in a bit of shock. You got a quick look at your baby then they were whisked away and cleaned up. Then you got them back some time later. It's not like it is now where they hand the baby to you for skin to skin etc. They'd be delivered, then whisked away and kept a lot of time in the nursery and be brought to you for feeding etc.

I bet it happened quite a bit.

As an aside, when I gave birth to my first son 25 years ago, his shoulder got stuck. He came out eventually but was injured and had a cone head.

He was taken to a little bay with half a dozen other babies, so I could sleep. I'd haemorrhaged during delivery; he'd nearly died, and I was a mess. I heard what I was convinced was him crying so I got up and went to the little nursery. I stood in the doorway and looked at the babies and couldn't figure out which was mine.

Which sounds maybe a bit understandable except there were half a dozen tiny white bald babies and one nearly ten and a half pound brown baby with a full head of shiny black hair on a cone head.

Guess which was my baby?

Yup.

Yet I still stood there paralysed from I guess the trauma of the delivery, and cried because I couldn't figure out which was my baby.

chattyness · 02/11/2024 12:33

How bloody awful for them all, how on earth can they ever be compensated for that? They can't ever get that time back.
When I had my babies the ankle and wristbands were written out and put straight on the baby before they ever left the delivery room. These were checked that that they matched up every time we were examined.

Username94247952 · 02/11/2024 12:34

Poor Jessica, she's been pushed out the family. I hope she's got some support.

ChocNice · 02/11/2024 12:35

I read that feeling so sad for Jessica. She’s lost everything. Not her fault. She’ll be dealing with that forever. The brother and mum sound ice cold in regards to her.

TheGreatScotchEggControversy · 02/11/2024 12:36

@cheesescheeses would you mind saying what decade it happened? And was it found through DNA testing? (No worries if you don't want to say)

I think when resolved you should tell your story if you think it would help.

It must shake your very foundations.

I feel sorry for anyone that is caught up in something like this.

TheGreatScotchEggControversy · 02/11/2024 12:37

Westfacing · 02/11/2024 12:15

There was a case some decades back where one the mother's complained straight away that she had been handed the wrong baby after it had been in the nursery overnight, as was the practice then. But she was persuaded otherwise.

The girls grew up in the wrong home and I can't remember exactly how the truth came out - think it was the doubting mother who investigated further and was proven right.

I think that case was in America, and one of the children died before the swap was found out. I will try and find the link.