Farming - kerfuffle

[Solomotree]

interesting how Jeremy Clarkson, one of the biggest vocal opponents of the inheritance tax on farms, literally boasted that he bought the farm to avoid paying it. It’s people like this we need to clamp down on and where people’s ire should be directed. And the vast vast majority of farms will not be affected.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/nov/01/farmers-shocked-budget-inheritance-tax-estates

I'm guessing that you're not a farmer OP! No one, apart from Clarkson, buys a farm to avoid paying tax

i mean they do. It’s a known tax avoidance scheme to buy land and claim it’s a farm. That’s why this has been introduced.

Because cutting up the land means less viable food production for Britain. Large corporations owning the countryside means less biodiversity and less sustainability.

You may feel jealous and resentful that some families are born into this…but the alternative is bad for us all. Being a farmer is a privilege but also a huge responsibility and a lit of work.

Assuming there's a house on the land you'll be fine. With the house you can pass on £2m untaxed.

Beyond that it's at 20% so even £3m would be £200k over 10 years. You could cheaply take out life insurance to cover any expected bill.

You may feel jealous and resentful that some families are born into this

thats so far from the truth it’s amusing. I am a city person through and through. I do quite like a sheep though

You honestly think that going after all farmers is the answer though?
Rich people always find loopholes, maybe we should be doing more to spot them and take away all the fucking loopholes!

Doing this to all farmers now will not stop the JCs of the world, but it will pile on a whole lot of hurt onto the U.K. population.

Honestly, the ignorance.

I am a city person through and through.

We’d already worked that one out.

Beyond that it's at 20% so even £3m would be £200k over 10 years

I don’t know any farmers who could find an extra £200k even if it’s spread over ten years.
Owning a farm and having to have certain expensive equipment does not mean they have money to hand like that.
I know loads of farmers who couldn’t sustain that kind of payoff even spaced out.

Sorry to all of you involved in farming for what's happening and all the lack of understanding this thread. I'm not a farmer, but I grew up in a farming village and have worked with charities that work with the farming community to support their mental health. It's a very different way of life, perhaps difficult to understand if you've not been around it, though I think people have given a good account of the many issues you face. Let's hope something changes.

Then why begrudge people family farms when it is in all our best interests?

Classic. Quite apart from, oh I don't know, food security being quite important, how about we don't always compete in a race to the bottom? So what if other family businesses go bust? That doesn't mean farms should have to, in some warped sense of equality - especially when we rely on them, and very often their decades and decades of knowledge, for our FOOD!

It’s not just a home that the farmer has to sell, it is their livelihood, it’s a whole way of life.
Does the average home come with a business attached? No.
Does the average home produce food to feed the nation? No.

Make no mistake, this will change agriculture & the whole food supply chain in the uk.
Be prepared to pay more money for inferior produce from abroad.

I am a city person through and through.

Haha, no shit!

It's embarrassing for you that you assume JC has anything to do with the farmers that work themselves to the bone so you can eat vegetables.

what on earth possessed you to start this ill educated thread.

I'm actually glad OP did start the thread - I'm reassured to know there are far more people out there that do understand this issue, than don't.

My husband and I are in our late 30’s and have only just started our ‘generation’ of farming. Our children are young - 3 and 3 months so this isn’t an option. Faming families look to the future no matter how far or near that may be. I don’t speak up so much for our position but for all of our fellow farmers coming to the end of their ‘generation’ and fear of what British agriculture will look when we are at the end of ours.

Then why begrudge people family farms when it is in all our best interests?

I don’t at all. I support all and any well intentioned businesses. But fewer than 80 families a year will be affected by this change - and they will be the wealthiest land owners. I can’t cry over that

But your own health and lifestyle is inextricably linked with theirs.

Where are you getting your 80 families figure?

Genuine question, is it possible to plan and use the 7 year transfer rule to pass a farm on or not. I hope that rules like this are workable for family farms or if not the rules are changed.

@ExitPursuedByABare apologies 200 estates not 80.

tax experts question whether the archetypal “family farm” will truly be affected. Pre-budget analysis by the Centre for the Analysis of Taxation (CenTax) suggested that only 200 estates a year between 2018 and 2020 claimed more than £1m in relief each year. Those 200 estates – by definition among the wealthiest in Britain – reaped 64% of all the agricultural relief.

A married couple owning a farm together can split it in two, meaning it qualifies for £2m of agricultural property relief, plus another £500,000 for each partner if a property is involved. That means a farm worth £3m might pay zero inheritance tax.

Instead, it may be the estates of some of the wealthiest people in Britain that are liable for inheritance tax. Those might include vacuum cleaner billionaire James Dyson, who owns 14,600 hectares of British farmland, and Danish fashion investor Anders Holch Povlsen, who reportedly owns more than 89,000 hectares of Scotland. Those estates may now be liable for hundreds of millions of pounds of inheritance tax, where previously they would have paid none

Yes you can. Problem is the average age of farmers is over 60. Most farmers I know have a generation holding the reins into their 70’s as they’ve been advised to. Put frankly they’ve left it too late.

They don’t like to hand over control,
not just because of tax laws but the risk of divorce. Every old farmer knows a story where the son was gifted a share of the partnership and land, got divorced and the settlement meant breaking up the farm.

Haven't RTFT, no time to do more than glance through it.

I live fairly rurally and I know quite a few farmers. I know enough to understand that farming is bloody hard work, and that the farm is constantly tended for an income now, but also stewarded, for the next generation. It's hard work and it's constant: no one goes combining through the night for fun, they combine when they can. Persuading a farmer to go on holiday and leave the farm takes some doing. And as PP have said, most farming families do not have spare 10s of thousands lying around.

If you don't have family farms, the land goes to multi-nationals, who will screw everything out of it: if you think current agricultural methods are bad for wildlife, wait until the bean-counters run everything. While a farmer who cares for his land will work to get grey partridges back on his land, someone in an office selecting the cheapest contractor won't give a shit, and the contractor won't either - not his land, doesn't live on it.

And also, you sure you want multinationals to have even greater control over our food supply than they have already? You sure?

Unfortunately most politicians have almost no understanding of the countryside, and the current lot in power have just demonstrated this in spades.

It's just a fucking stupid thing to do: the potential for damage is huge, and the tax take from it will not make a significant difference to the country's finances.

"I am a city person through and through".

And it really shows! You just can't really understand the realities of farming and the impact of this move by reading an article in a newspaper, let alone one with a political bias. You need to really experience it or listen to people's lived experiences on here.

Where are these new entrants? Where are they going to get the money to buy a farm, machinery & livestock?
Do these new entrants want to work 80 hour weeks? Do they want to work a good majority of those 80 hours for free? Do they want to sacrifice holidays? Days off even?

It is not as simple as “old boys club”

I think some people on here are confusing a family farm with a country manor/estate