6yo violent at school

[Levithecat]

It’s my son ☹️ we have just submitted an EHCP needs assessment application, but getting the right support (probably a 121 worker) is miles off. The school have been brilliant with him and do everything they can, but his fight / flight response seems to have tipped over into just hurting any child without much provocation. Awaiting diagnosis but expecting autism (PDA has been mentioned).

I feel awful for the other children - and I’m really scared he’ll be excluded, if that’s possible. He has a separate area of the classroom and mostly separate break times etc but clearly he’ll come into contact with his peers during the day, and it was all our hope that he might start engaging a bit more with the class. Have done lots privately and school have had OT, SALT and an Ed psych observation. But they have no funding for more until the EHCP. Homeschooling isn’t an option.

any words of advice anyone? Should I message the class parents to explain? Say sorry to them? School is incredibly stressful for my son, but I’m sure the other parents are very upset.

They managed to find some funding last year for 121, provided OT and he has Lego therapy (which I’d rather like!) - I think they just don’t have any spare cash, and other kids to support. I don’t think there’s bridging funding with our LA, sadly

He isn’t playing up.

Honestly there is no point messaging the other parents. However much they may feel for your little one and their struggles.

The second it’s their child on the receiving end of his violence the empathy will go out the window since as you agree nobody want their child hurt. It’s schools job to safeguard both children and they are failing both and you can guarantee the school will be getting very upset parents on the phones / in person and emails once it’s more than once the same child hurts their child.

The other harsh part is those parents will talk, today Johnny slapped Maria, yeah well yesterday he shoved Ben over… that’s nothing he bit James last week! They will start to avoid you, the children will avoid your child.

But there is no answer other than more and more support a 100% of the time one to one for him. Working out his every trigger and trying to prevent it. Working out of mainstream genuinely is the best place for him overall. Even if his super smart if he cannot regulate and is angry and lashing out it’s not working.

In terms of schools/settings, his dad and I are really keen he stays where he is until we have the EHCP, and then we’ll have to see. The OT suggested an alternative/progressive school, but that would be fee paying unless LA would
cover (unlikely).

Keep an eye on the EHCP timescales. Make sure the LA stick to them.
If the LA refuse to assess/refuse to issue/the EHCP is poor/doesn’t name your preferred placement, you can appeal.

Don’t deregister!

Try not to worry if the school does suspend but do make sure it is a formal suspension and not an informal unlawful exclusion. If they do exclude it will a) provide you with evidence of unmet needs, b) force the school to follow due process, c) limit the number of days the school can suspend for, d) allow you to challenge any suspension, and e) ensure DS receives alternative education for longer suspensions.

The school should push the LA for more top up funding in order to provide more support whilst going through the EHCNA process.

Have you looked at DLA?

It's just there is a small risk your child could be permanently excluded quite suddenly and, although the LA is supposed to find an alternative within 5 days, it's not always that smooth. You and his dad might want to build up a buffer each and both have your unpaid parental leave to hand. Remember if your child has a disability the rule to take take eave in blocks is waived and you can do days.

Unfortunately for you all children are entitled to an education andxaa a parents you don't get to dictate how schools manage these situations.

This was us 7-8yrs ago. Ds was increasingly violent and distressed at MS school. School were supportive to a point but couldn't really do much. The environment was horrific for him. Eventually they had to start temporary exclusions (which helped in the end although it didn't feel like it at the time).

It took SO long to get his autism diagnosis, CAMHS support, all the OF, SLT, Ed psych reports (also highly gifted, tricky combo). Then proceed to EHCP.

Ds was getting so distressed (and everyone at school hated us for the disruption) we decided to stop sending him to school. Not off roll. Just stopped sending him as it was deemed by GP and CAMHS worker that it was severely detrimental to his mental health (the shame a clever young boy carries when he is being violent to other people never leaves them).

Funnily enough, suddenly everyone went into overdrive as he wasn't attending and a lot of focus was out on why he couldn't.

We got his EHCP, he spent 10 months at home recovering and then started an amazing ASD specialist school and he was a different, happy, thriving boy with friends and awards and commendations.

Now he's a fabulous 14 yr old working towards many GCSES at his SEN school and doing really well all round with plans for college etc. I never thought it would happen. It will for you too but just put your boy at the centre of everything you chose.

(Sorry for the essay!)

If its the only school that could meet your child's needs, the the LEA would have to pay
But thats easier said than done .

Has a good point. My friends child is getting zero support she’s even having to pay for private tutors.

@OhmygodDont if the LA is refusing to provide alternative provision, your friend should email the Director of Children’s Services threatening judicial review. If that doesn’t work, she needs a pre-action letter. SOSSEN can help with this for free but there is a wait so she may want to look elsewhere. If a pre-action letter doesn’t work, judicial review proceedings themselves will.

This was us too, so you have my sympathy. Four horrible years...
Same issue, very bright but no emotional regulation, AuDHD.
Do you have a flexible/sympathetic employer? If they do start exclusions, which is likely, you'll need to have some flex with work.
I take it he's already on the SEN register and they're doing the plans, etc?

School got all the extra funding for DD, and she had a 121 even before the EHCP but she still couldn't cope. EHCP meant we could then look at specialist, and she got an Inde SEMH school- we were very fortunate.

Wishing you the best

Thank you so much (and to others) - this does give me hope and sounds very similar.
your point about shame hits hard - he feels so much shame. And he talks so badly about himself (was self harming a bit - hitting his head and other things - but that seems to have stopped)

sounds so similar - thank you for your advice. I’m public sector, so pretty flexible, but a senior manager so the flex only goes so far. And I love my work and it keeps me sane.

awaiting our diagnostic appointment, but I wonder if it’s AuADHD, given what folk have said here. But I’ll wait and see what they say.

Lots of hugs your way. Practically have you tried loop in ear plugs? Helps my ASD niece get through the day as she's still able to hear everyone but it's muted.

My experience 17 years ago was very similar to this, although he moved to a resourced provision, whilst being taught in mainstream with a full time 1-1

It was the most horrendous, painful period of time. I have 2 other sons who have never had a single incident of bad behaviour, never mind violence

We are all ostracised and I had a breakdown due to the stress of an autistic child trying to commit suicide, 2 younger boys who were suffering, and the all round demonisation of my 'terrible parenting'

Keep fighting, he is now nearly 24. In a successful band, lives with his best friends, and just achieved a first in geography

It has made my other boys resilient, protective, kind and very accepting of others.

Pity some of the people on this thread don't have that empathy

As an EP, can I just say I haven't recommended a "visual timetable" for at least 10 years, probably more. I have never yet seen a mainstream school that uses one properly apart from anything else. Who decided that all problems are solvable if a visual timetable is stuck up in the classroom somewhere? Certainly not in my book.

I would have expected some attempts to analyse the barriers he has to managing the classroom expectations and some suggestions on how to better support these....

Don't pull him out. He needs to be in school to get the ehc - you can get one from home but it is really tricky.

The school has a sen budget and can put support in while waiting for the ehc.

Don't discount getting into private provision. Often the LA will pay. Contact the school and discuss. They may give your son a free assessment by having him in for a few days. They will write a report, which is good evidence for the ehc and for getting a place. That's what happened to us - we were constantly told our daughter wouldn't get a place at the school she wanted but she did.