Should grandparents who help out get to see their grandchildren more?

[CrispieCake]

Just that really. It's such a common topic on these boards. Should the amount of time grandparents get to spend with their grandchildren be connected to how able/willing they are to help the parents with childcare?

I mean, obviously to some extent this is unavoidable. A grandparent who does 3 days childcare a week is obviously going to see their grandchild more than one who doesn't help and never visits. But even in those cases, should there be an onus on parents to specifically take their children to visit grandparents if that's the only way to have a relationship with them? I remember growing up one of my grandfathers being very ill for months in hospital and then in a home, and so we used to be taken every few weeks for little visits until he died (his wife had died a few years earlier). But it was quite an effort for my mum (not his child, but she usually did the visits), although she didn't grudge it. Obviously though a grandparent who could visit but chooses not to is a bit different. I guess to some extent it also depends on the relationship between the child/child-in-law and grandparents. My mother was quite close to both her MIL and FIL. They'd had great fun together pre-kids (the MIL and FIL lived quite a hedonistic life for the time 😂) and she enjoyed his company in small doses. If the grandparents are only interested in their grandchild, that's a different dynamic and I think it's fair to say, you're welcome to take little Sam or Susie out for the day but why do you need me tagging along?

I don't think there's any rules - every family will be different. Where a grandparent lives far away, if the grandparent is fit & healthy, it is often easier for them to travel raather than parents with small kids travelling. If the grandparent is sick, and the relationship is good, the child's parent might make more of an effort - within the limits of what's practical & what the grandparent is able for (I remeber my own grandmother when she got ill, got very anxious with children in her house or even in public settings, so we didn't visit often)

But its kind of obvious that a grandparent who helps look after a child will mechanically spend more time them ... and I think trying to equally balance that time with a GP who is further is a futile exercise ... that way madness lies

Any parent trying to balance out time for grandparents so that both sets see the grandchildren equally, will end up doing so to the detriment of their own family time, commitments, etc.

I think it depends on proximity and interest levels. If grandparents live far enough away that it necessitates an overnight visit then for sure they will likely see grandkids less, that's just logistics of life. And if they don't ask after grandkids then why would you make an effort to keep them involved.

I don't believe anyone owes me or my child their interest, but if anyone is not taking an interest then I'll take that as a hint they aren't bothered. And in this very busy life, that means they will drop down the priority list of people who we bother to go and see.

Relationships are a two way street. Obviously your grandparent was in a home and therefore not able to visit, but it sounds like he and your mum were close and he was probably invested in your lives. Makes sense she'd take you to see him.

My mum asks after my son daily, she gets more updates on him than she knows what to do with 😂 My PILs rarely ask, but I think they take their lead on involvedness from my DH, so they facetime every few weeks, like photos on instagram, and we see them maybe every couple of months. If they want to be more involved they can, they just need to ask really.

I don’t depend on either set of grandparents to provide care for my children. I work and pay Nursey fees for dc under school age. My parents and in-laws are retired and enjoy doing what they couldn’t when raising their DC. Why wouldn’t they?

My dc see their grandparents whenever they choose. They know they are loved by their parents, grandparents and extended family.

Grandparents don’t have to provide unpaid child care for your children to feel cherished. Parents are responsible for raising their children. Grandparents provide additional love (and occasional treats).

My DC range from teenagers to 3 years old. I can count on one hand how many times they’ve had a sleepover with their GP. They all know who their GPs are. They all know they are loved unconditionally. That’s what matters.

We live close to my parents (as in on the same street) they did all my childcare so saw DD everyday until year 7 but also fitted into DDs life so at the weekend would watch her sports matches or we would go out for walks together. They wouldn't expect visits on top of what they already saw her as we only had the weekends and holidays together.

Her other grandparents she sees a couple of times a year because they live a long way away and I'm not with her dad. If I was I'd make sure we visit more than he does but she isn't held back by that.

Visiting an ill or frail relative is an entirely different kettle of fish though. You make the effort because they can't.

I don’t think it can be entirely reduced down. My in-laws don’t see as much of their grandchild as they could because I don’t have much incentive to facilitate it.

They don’t help out but they also add to my workload. If they come around I have to make small talk, food and drink, and often put up with their criticism. I do this occasionally for my child’s sake as they are good grandparents, but I’m not a saint and would rather spend my time and effort on someone else’s company.

Childcare would be very helpful. I don’t expect them to provide it, but being pleasant and able to put the kettle on themselves would go a long way.

You could make your own thread to complain about your in laws relationship with your dc. You won’t be the first. MNetters love a thread about inattentive PIL. You’ll discover MNetters own parents are the dogs bollox.

Children are not a commodity. Obviously if a grandparent is offering child care they will see more of the child especially on a one to one. How often you see grandparents should be a fairly mutual agreement and unless there's barriers should be a combination of both going to them and them going to you.

We see my in-laws roughly twice a month, we generally go to them as they have more room. When they babysat ds once a week we saw them a bit more (or ds did)

My dad I see once or twice a week, he probably sees ds every month or so. When my mum was here she also babysat ds once a week so we saw more of them.

Distance, working commitments and relationship are all factors.

I’d say as a general rule, no. The amount of time a child gets to spend with their grandparent should not be contingent on how much childcare they provide. You aren’t entitled to childcare from them, but that doesn’t mean your children shouldn’t have a relationship with them, as long as all else is well and they aren’t toxic/abusive etc….Childcare isn’t all grandparents are for.
This doesn’t mean it should always be on you to facilitate spending time. If they are healthy/able then they should do some of the travelling. And it certainly shouldn’t always be you initiating it.
Also, obviously say one set of grandparents sees their grandchildren three times a week because they babysit. That doesn’t mean you are obligated to make sure the other set see them three times a week.

The question in the last few lines of the OP suggests that the grievance is not as stated in the headline. FWIW, you’re probably right.

Mother-in-laws, really do get bad press on here, sadly.

And yet ‘we’ are often the same person…mother and mother-in-law! 🤔

I don’t have any complaints about the relationship that they have.

I could be wrong but when you've had a 38 hour labour, no proper sleep in the night, aren't near other family etc, you'd think the in-laws would step in occasionally as only 30 mins away.
Mine said she used to visit her grandparents a further distance away than me so I should do the same for her. Very helpful.
Did try meeting at shops, which was her bag but kids hated it, after one particular sad day when I made a huge effort resulting in crying on the train as was so exhausted and her response was "What about me?" She had one train to catch, was retired & in good health.
I tried again another time when my own mum was ill, so rang MIL to meet a bit later to which I got a very frosty reception. My mum was ill and I needed to take her to the docs, get prescription, check she was comfortable etc but MIL purely thought about her own wants.

I felt bad for a while and then after 10 years of this type of selfish attitude I thought sod it and stopped making the effort. Husband didn't really bother so didn't see them very much.
They would turn up at really inconvenient times with no warning and expect to be waited on hand and foot! As in an hour before kids birthday party with 30 guests?!? Wta?
It would have been lovely if they helped out but they always added extra work and expected all the attention on them, not the children they had come to visit as in "look what a lovely holiday we've had. Look what a lovely meal we've had, look where we've been again with the other brother and family (that you weren't invited to!) " 🤷🏼
My husband did nothing to help situation as he was scared of upsetting her. Ok with me being upset or inconvenienced though to keep the peace but he puts up with a lot from them to keep the peace too.
When they didn't come to my birthday party after 20 years of marriage as minding other grandchildren I literally stepped away. Kids have very poor relationship with them now which is very sad but they.were very selfish/narcissists so no big loss.
Cautionary tale.
Hope you maintain better relationships if they are good for the children xxx

No. Babies are not pay per view.

I guess the problem if grandparents aren't willing to provide childcare as such is that, in order to see their grandchildren, they need one or other parent or a nanny in the background to facilitate it. And there's only so many hours you'd be willing to spend in the company of people who don't really like you and who you don't really like just to facilitate the grandparent relationship.

Thinking back to my mother's visits to her FIL, we weren't really the centre of attention during them. She'd speak to the staff first and get an update on how he was, and then we'd go have a little "chat", but then we'd be sat down in the corner with our books/toys that we'd brought and invited to raid the chocolate box while the adults chatted. I'm not sure how much of it was duty/affection on my mum's part (or even if the two could properly be separated then), but there was definitely an independent relationship where the children were not the main attraction, as it were, although he was always happy to see us.

That's not strictly true for parents who see their kids at contact centres, is it? Because it takes time and effort to facilitate the "view", as it were, so the parents have to pay for it.

You tend to see the grandparents who are most interested the most, this doesn't necessarily have anything to do with childcare or even proximity.

I don't think so, helping out is not a ticket to 'priority access' other than the fact they see GCs more often anyway.

My parents live about 30 mins from us, ILs about ten mins. My parents helped more when the kids were little because they weren't working full time and ILs were (and still are). We went over to ILs more regularly though. I was very conscious of not showing any sort of favouritism to either set a) because I didn't want to and b) because MIL would pick up on the slightest hint of it, even if unintended!

But why did you need to be there when the ILs saw the kids? Why couldn't you say "ok, come pick them up at 10" and go do something that you wanted to do? Unless you enjoyed spending time with your ILs so it was a pleasure not a chore?

It's been a long journey for me but I had to accept that it was not my job to ensure my children had a relationship with their grandparents, it was up to them to pick up the phone and come and visit. One set did make the effort, one didn't, but my sanity was restored when I took that burden off my own back.
The set who don't see their grandchildren much have missed out on so much, it makes me sad for them, but I couldn't force it and was exhausting myself trying to make it happen by taking the kids to visit all the time.
I ended up calling my MIL and being totally open, said "I'm aware my parents see the kids more than you do, I just want you to know you are always always welcome to visit anytime, I don't need a lot of notice or planning please just come, we love you and want you to be part of our lives".
They came once in a year. They are retired and in good health. Their loss.

I also realised it's misogynistic to assume arranging family get together is a woman's job, so now I arrange my side of the family my husband arranges his side's get together or lack thereof. It's been very freeing to not be seen as the gatekeeper to access to the grandchildren anymore, nope, not my job, not my problem, take it up with your son.

Not true in our family. DD makes sure that each set of grandparents see the grandchildren once a week for a couple of hours. We love our time with them and they have plenty of time for their own outings and holidays.

I fully admit we see my parents more because they help more. They bring joy to our lives, and help out where we genuinely need it- not what they think looks good for bragging on social media.

In laws hugely prioritise their other grandchildren, criticise my parenting and are generally very negative.

I do make sure we see them and facilitate a relationship but yeah, if we have a spare hour at the weekend we’ll more likely see my parents. DH completely agrees- says his parents reap what they sow.

Even before DC were on the horizon my DM was always clear she would not be a childminder for her grandchildren as her role was to be a grandparent. I must say, I agree with her prospective. I get very frustrated with parents on here moaning about their parents or IL's disrespecting their 'rules' when they are getting free childcare that the rest of us pay £££'s for. My IL's were happy to do childcare (and did so for my SIL) but, because of my upbringing I never considered using them.
The relationship my DC have with their grandparents has not been affected in any way. There should be no 'duty' involved, hopefully just a genuine fondness and interest in each other.

In our case ILs very much only wanted time alone with our kids on their terms. I didn't always see them with them, but we didn't ask them to take the kids as first resort because they were running their own businesses, and I resented it a little at first but then realised it was fair enough if seeing out kids was on their terms because they were working ft and my parents weren't. They did sometimes offer, but we were aware we couldn't ask them too often. OTOH, we had a pretty regular Friday night dinners at ILs with all of us, so that was their main time for seeing the kids.