Etsy warning

[Ganachequery]

Quick warning for those who, like me, may be unfamiliar with using Etsy to buy items from abroad.

Two weeks ago I bought two paintings from a seller in Spain. They were £59 each with free delivery. Or so I thought. After I hadn't heard anything for a while I checked my order again and realised I'd been charged 20% VAT on top. It wasn't in the basket but apparently appears at checkout, stupidly I didn't notice as I was buying things from a number of shops and it isn't easy to see what's coming from where. The seller accepted returns so I asked her if I could just buy one of the paintings as it was a bit more than I expected (she hadn't sent them). She said she was still going to send them and if I wanted to return I'd have to send them back at great cost. She was really rude and frankly bordering on inappropriate!

Today I've had an email from Royal Mail saying I'm going to be charged again from customs (we think 20% again, it doesn't say). Although the total of the order was 118, the VAT pushed it over the 135 customs limit. Essentially we are going to have to pay the best part of 50 quid more than expected. I honestly feel scammed even though I now know I should have been looking out for this. I've bought stuff from overseas before and never had this (I assume it was built into the costs though).

The whole thing has made me quite upset so just a warning to others if you are as unfamiliar as me.

It’s not a scam. Sellers has zero control over VAT and other such related charges. She shouldn’t have been rude but when you purchase from abroad it’s on the buyer to understand what fees your country will apply.

It's ridiculous that she's insisting on all sending the painting you don't want! Definitely leave a bad review.

I don't but on Etsy much but I always search for shops in the UK only to avoid complications like this.

Unfortunately this is a Brexit bonus and a reason a lot of small businesses in the UK no longer ship to mainland Europe and vice versa.

I've read your post several times and can't see why you think it's an Etsy issue instead of being that particular seller issue. Perhaps you can clarify?

It's not a scam, it's a VAT and tax issue. I experienced similar when ordering something from another country. Lesson learned!

It’s not a scam. Etsy seller set their price and Etsy then add on sales tax for whatever country it sells in. There isn’t any other way to build it into the price for Etsy sellers who sell
worldwide. It gets added at the checkout.

Likely, you’ve bought things from overseas and the seller just hasn’t paid VAT or done their taxes properly. Etsy doesn’t work like that. All tax needs to be paid.

Customs also has nothing to do with the seller. If you’re buying from overseas, then you need to be aware of any customs charges you face. It’s not the sellers fault that you didn’t look at the final price and check if you could afford the customs fees.

This is all your own fault and nothing to do with the independent artist trying to make a living.

It’s not even a seller issue. It’s the OP who didn’t look at the final price. The seller cannot add the VAT price before checkout, Etsy aren’t set up like that. The relevant sales tax is added at the checkout because you could be buying from anywhere/delivering to anywhere. And customs fees are nothing to do with the seller.

I agree that the lack of transparency of things is annoying, especially when it comes to customs charges as they're so bloody vague about it, but also agree it's not the seller's fault. Hope you are going to review the paintings themselves rather than anything else.

I get that but OP has said the seller hasn't even posted it yet. Posted = custom/brexit/op issue, not posted but insisting = seller issue. Neither is etsy issue.

So you didn't bother to research the implications of buying from abroad re vat and customs charges.
It says on every listing that the buyer is responsible for any tax and customs charges applicable to buying from outside the UK.

But you aren't in the EU so of course you will be charged VAT / customs

What happens if you don't collect - I assume it will be sent back to her? Will you be out of pocket for postage?

I agree it's on you to check out taxes but since you asked her before posting, to remove one then it's unfair she has put you in this position.

Just don't accept delivery.

They have to return it and she will have to refund you.

Actually, this isn't true.

I was an Etsy seller for a decade. It depends if the OP has ordered something made to order (possible if it's a painting?) and the settings on the sellers account.

I'm not sure why some people are being nasty, the entire point of the post was so others don't make the same mistake. I am now aware this is how it works on Etsy/buying from abroad. Prior to this I had no knowledge at all, I thought the price was the price. I've said I was ignorant, there's no need to kick me whilst I'm down! I can't be the only one who didn't know so just want to make sure others don't make the same mistake.

I didn't say the seller should have told me about VAT etc. I did say I felt it was harsh that she couldn't consider refunding one when she hadn't sent it yet and hadn't incurred any charges. She hadn't even packaged it, my order is now a week overdue too.

No mention of it being a made to order piece, my understanding was I was buying the finished item. Obviously I wouldn't ask to remove an item that had been specially made for me.

See in your situation I would as a seller just have amended your order as asked. It’s annoying as a seller but it isn’t worth the potential bad feedback.

I am not sure if it’s changed now (I left Etsy in 2021 when their behaviour went mental and money grabbing) but she could have refunded you the order and you could have re bought - all Etsy fees she would have paid would have been returned for the first order if that makes sense!

This was my thinking too. I actually used to sell prints on Etsy years ago (domestically) and on occasion something similar would happen and I'd refund. I'd also never have been so rude to a customer either - her reply was "should I just throw it away now then?!" which doesn't even make sense.

I think I've been hit twice - VAT because the item was under 135 and then customs because the item was over 135 once the VAT was added. Minefield. I won't make the same mistake again anyway and hopefully this helps someone else.

These were all points made by the Remain campaign before the referendum though. How can this have passed you by?

I'm not knocking you as I have just made the same mistake!

There was no need for the seller to be rude but she in no way controls VAT and customs charges. It's not a scam. It's brexit in action.

I get why you were trying to warn others about buying abroad with customs/vat etc but I still don't get the warning about Etsy itself. There are multiple websites that will sell from abroad that could have had the same issue.

My gripe with Etsy was because it wasn't displayed until I'd checked out - it wasn't in my basket. Perhaps this is how other companies are too, I haven't bought much online from overseas recently.

The point about the campaign, the referendum was 8 years ago. I was young then and probably not paying as much attention to the detail!

This makes it sound like it was made to order for you - which may not be clear on the Etsy listing and may not be what you were expecting - but that would explain why the seller feels that they have to send the item now.