Are the new term time holiday laws making you re think holiday plans?

[WindyTums]

Every year, my parents and in laws pay for the whole family to go on a European lodge based holiday. It’s during term time as school holiday costs more than double. DH and I are the only ones who have school aged DC (secondary).

Every year the holiday is arranged for either just before the Easter holidays or just before the October half term. We always go and it’s a great experience for everyone.

This years gathering is just before October half term and I’ve agreed to take the DC out of school for this, accepting we will be fined.
One of our elderly relatives has a milestone birthday next year and it has been agreed to book the next one for just before the Easter holidays. It’s likely this will be elderly relatives last time going.

However, for DH and I, this means our DC would need to be taken out of school again within a six month period and will result in a hefty fine as we have 3 DC. Whilst I could accept the fine, it would mean we could not take a family holiday during term time for another three years due to the new laws.

We simply can not afford school holiday prices. We are planning to decline the Easter gathering but I’m really disappointed and upset for my DC.

I suppose the new laws are clearly working if there are others like us?

Before anyone tells me that holidays are a luxury, not a right, I’m aware of this. However, you can’t tell me this affects the rich and their DC in the same way. It’s another way of separating the haves and the have nots. Nobody on their death bed ever regretted family time.

I work in education and do not agree with the new fines system and we don't fine our students and families. I believe every family should get a week's grace per year but that's by the by. Neither does the headteacher of our DC School and she's apologised to parents for having to implement the new system.

We normally do term time holidays and are doing so this year still. We are restricted somewhat with my DH work so we have to take time when we can. We will of course have to reconsider this at the 3 year mark and do what we can from then on.

We like to visit Italy and plan on using the four day cut off for fines to have some 5/6 day holidays potentially once a year instead if we can't make it away in the holidays because of work. Otherwise we'll holiday closer to home during the holidays too.

You tell me where we can go (2 adults and 2,kids) for under £200 for 4 nights / 5 days with swimming, entertainment, funfair and the circus included. I'm happy to take your suggestions. It's not a holiday for me. I'm doing what the kids like and they want to be entertained.

what is the new rule? I don't take my child out of school unless she is sick so may have missed this one..

Me either

I feel that taking children out of school to go holiday sets a very poor example for them. It gives them a sense of entitlement - the rules don't apply to them. This can effect their attitude to things in the future as general adults / employees

Grand parents have them in the school holidays (in our case for another holiday). We take DS out it's our choice how we raise our child and he doesn't stay off sick. Maybe tackle that 1st and allow schools to give minor meds so they can stay in school. I wouldn't come home with a cold I would take the maximum amount of cold/flu possible yet DS would be sent home instead of getting a dose of calpol.

The way I read it is within a three year period so have planned it as follows

2024- none that count as was before August deadline
2025 - one that counts for next three years
2026- none that count
2027- stage 2 fine as 2025
2028- none that count
2029 - 2025 drops off so stage 2 fine

You could in theory do

2024 - fine 1
2025 - fine 1+2
2026 - school holidays
2027- as long as later than the date in 2024 it will have dropped off so stage 2 fine
2028- as long as it later than 2025 stage 2 fine
2029- school holidays

You tell me where we can go (2 adults and 2,kids) for under £200 for 4 nights / 5 days with swimming, entertainment, funfair and the circus included. I'm happy to take your suggestions. It's not a holiday for me. I'm doing what the kids like and they want to be entertained.

@OhWell45 this is an example of the issue. Butlins doesn't cost that. It costs much more but school holiday people are paying the actual cost. They'd rather recoup a bit during term time than nothing. So they give heavily discounted term time holidays.

If everyone could take holidays at any point, it would be far more. Basic supply and demand.

Yes it has made me think twice, we’ve booked for summer holidays next year. Would have loved to have gone in term time (and probably would have with the standard £60 fine) not just for cost but for how busy it is, with two ASD children, this makes a massive difference.

With good attendance this year we will likely to term time next year and then youngest starts GCSEs so will problem miss a couple of years holidays.

This is such a sad, almost communist sentiment. Being able to have a holiday might lead to insurrection later on in life? Why won't they just keep quiet and trudge out their lives, goddammit?

Maybe they don't want to be employees, maybe they want to be the employers? Heaven forfend, the riffraff are forgetting themselves - Betsy, get the broom!

It has made me think but actually I plan to use any absences in a way that doesn’t meet the threshold for a penalty notice.

December: I will have 6 sessions of unauthorised (although 1 of those is a piss take as it’s the last day when they go home at lunchtime anyway).

I would then certainly not have any planned during the next 10 school weeks (this is the thing that might catch people out- school week is not a calendar week!). However I might well take them out for a day before one of the may bank holiday weekends which would be another 2 within the school year but not within the 10 weeks.

What if does mean though is that a full week of leave is risky. It might be totally ok under the rules to frequently take 4 days off every term or so but not to take off one 5 week block.

I also think as a response you’ll see more people with ‘very sick’ children on Fridays or chucking their kids into school on route from an airport rather than letting them rest up at home.

Quite right! My kids know unequivocally that unless they are vomiting or have diarrhoea, they’re in school. It’s incredibly selfish to take pupils out for entire weeks at a time and it’s attitudes like the OP’s which rub off on the pupils and make them not fully value their education, making behaviour worse in the classroom for everyone!

This was a contributing factor in my decision to home educate my dd. We did it previously as were made homeless and moved a few times in a short period and I didn't want to keep changing her school. The absolutely thrived. She went back when we were settled and hated it. The behaviour of other children was terrible. She found much of the work too easy and then the parts she struggled with she got no help for so I was teaching her at home still myself anyway and got her a tutor. Then my SEN son wasn't given a school place because the LA don't have schools for kids like him and he had fuck all education for over 2 years. I took that all the way to tribunal and won in May- still not sorted his education though have they. The double standard here is disgusting. My boy couldn't cope with a holiday when it's busy so if we don't holiday in term time it would never happen. My dd meant all health was on the floor so I thought fuck this. Took her out of school and immediately went on holiday.

I think it's not ok for the government to have such control over our children. I think parents should respect the school system and be grateful for the fact their kids get free education in this country. They should not be taking kids out term time teachers helping them catch up again is giving more work to over worked teachers and they should be doing their part to tackle their children's behaviour at school. But the reality is my dd wasn't getting an education due to the other children's behaviour and my son had no education because the government doesn't value SEND kids. It feels like they want control where their citizens have been loosing respect and faith for years but only for the easy kids the harder to support kids can miss years of education and noone is answerable for that it's disgusting

It's come up is teachers can't take term time holidays... they can and I know some who do through taking unpaid parental leave which all parents including teachers are entitled to. Schools aren't going to shout about that though!

@Pippa905 as my children are in their twenties I’m certainly not entitled to parental leave. The same goes for most of my colleagues. (I currently have 5 colleagues in my school who have children under 18 - everyone else has children over 18 or none). In all my time working in schools I’ve only ever known parental leave to be taken for emergency reasons such as child in hospital.

Sounds like the rules are working then.

I've never taken dc on holiday during term time, so it doesn't affect our holiday plans. I haven't really kept up with the change in law as it doesn't affect us.

@LadyDanburysCane No you're right, employed teachers with school aged children (up to 18) are. The entitlement is set out on gov.uk and is different to carers leave for emergencies.

You have to have been employed for 1 year and if you're entitled whilst employers can delay it they cannot say no.

I was always taken out of school for holidays and I have a degree and a good job, I have two adult kids that are now 25 and 23 and they both have degrees and good jobs despite taking them out of school EVERY year for two weeks. I now have a 10 year old and I WILL take her out of school every year if I feel it is necessary! Infact I’m taking her out for 3 weeks next year for a holiday of a lifetime in Florida, because if I waited until the holidays it would have cost an extra £3k. Instead of the Government putting laws like this in place, why don’t they stop the holiday companies from hiking up their prices during the holidays and parents won’t feel the need to take them out of school. Why don’t they stop doing residential trips, and that will give them an extra week of education - why should the school be able to take them out of education for a week to go away with them, yet we can’t! 😡😡

Residential trips ARE education! They aren’t sitting in a sun lounger around the pool! I accompany our residential trips and they learn a lot! There are team building exercises, exercises where they think outside the box, exercises where they push their mental limits, they learn to be part I’d something “bigger”. Classroom learning on return often expands on things they learned at residential.

This law will not affect the wealthy in the private school and only penalise working class familys, particularly people who work or have small business related to seasonal sector. These people can only get time off during term time.

DD goes to a private school and they threaten to withdraw your place if you go on term time holidays. I have never and will never take DD out of school for a holiday (and she’s ahead so probably could afford a few weeks off with no damage) I think they are having to do this because it is a problem. I can’t remember much of holidays as a child tbh. i think they are much more important to parents than children. Kids remember other things not just holidays.

Honestly OP I do sympathise that it’s a big deal for your family and you really wouldn’t want to miss out (I wouldn’t want to either). Maybe you can be clear about the changes and that you can no longer do it and ask for changes to the schedule.

It wouldn't stop me. Family time with grandparents is precious. frankly unless is secondary school exam times I'd pull them out and plead sickness but.

@MrsTerryPratchett
I'm in Scotland & have always taken my kids out of school for holidays from a couple of days to a week. I make sure I don't expect the teacher to cover the missing assignments. I do it:

But everyone does it here in Scotland that I know.
Both my daughters got into top Russell group universities despite missing a week or so a year:

You work in education and take term time holidays? How?

Do you get a fine if you miss 10 sessions (ie 5 AM and 5 PM sessions conjointly?)

Private school holidays are often different to tbd local authorities by a few days/a week, many parents with children in other are looking to take those days because it makes for cheaper flights etc.