I often see it said that ‘men are simple creatures’

[nomud]

Said by both men and women. Therefore I guess the implication is that women are complex creatures? This seems like a disservice to both men and women? I could be overthinking this (ASD), but I saw it earlier (by a male poster) and it made me think about it, why is it a widely held belief? Does it mean that men are easy to please, while women aren’t?

(A quick disclaimer, if I’ve said something offensive or stupid, please forgive me as I don’t always communicate my thoughts well. I’m not trying to be controversial or insulting at all, just trying to understand it).

You haven't said anything stupid at all, I think it's a really interesting question!

I think it means that women, generally, are more emotionally complex than men. Women have a range of moods, and men generally, don't.

In my personal opinion, men are 1-step thinkers too. Women have multiple steps of thinking. For example, a man might think "I feel like fish and chips tonight; I'll stop off at the chippy and get myself some". Then they do. Women tend to think "I'd like fish and chips tonight, I'll get some for everyone, including the kids and my husband. But this means the ingredients for the meal I was going to prepare will go out of date; so I'll put those in the freezer. Also fish and chips isn't very healthy for the kids so I will make sure they get extra fruit and veg tomorrow".

I also feel (personal opinion) that men are generally happy if they get sex and food and life is trundling along nicely. Women are much more complex and need many more of their emotional needs to be satisfied to be happy.

"I also feel (personal opinion) that men are generally happy if they get sex and food and life is trundling along nicely."

BINGO. When things are just ticking along nicely I'm super satisfied, but that's just about the time my wife will suddenly have an existential crisis about her life not being properly fulfilled.

I suspect that Men's mid-life crisis is all about reaching a point when we realise that there's more to life than the ticking along nicely that we're accustomed to. Can't wait for mine.

That's probably true, I wrote my post in a deliberately literal manner for the benefit of the original poster who is ASD. But I agree with what you've said - we all have an existential crisis from time to time. We are all human at the end of the day! And that is more important than differences in the male/female psyche.

Obviously its a sexist stereotype and therefore harmful

Yes but the original poster has ASD so needs commonly accepted social gender expectations explained .

It is of course true that putting the male way of thinking, and female way of thinking, in separate boxes (and even to assume there are separate ways of thinking for the male/female brain) is very contentious these days; however that was not what the OP was asking, she was asking the origin of the saying "men are simple creatures".

I don't think so. Men and women are equally complex.

Women are more likely to be socialised into doing more emotional labour, and gain more proficiency in it; men more likely to be socialised to supress their emotions, or exhibit a narrower range of the emotions (anger in place of others for example.) None of this is inherent, and none of this is essential. It's a product of gendered expectations. It's nothing to do with complexity.

Harmful? I think it's an interesting question and I couldn't have explained it better than the first reply

So what do you think is the reason, or origin, of the saying "men are simple creatures"? As you are a male poster it would be interesting to have your answer. I would like to know genuinely, no hidden agenda, I would just like to know your answer 🙂

I think generally speaking men are less emotional, which in turn makes them a bit simpler.

Even on male dominated forums, it's pretty rare to see posts full of hatred for their PILs, or posts about how they can't get along with their BILs and SILs.

I also don't think I've ever seen a post from a man blaming his behavior on hormones.

I have 4 adult sons and if they fell out with their male friends, it was a much simpler affair than when I fell out with my female friends growing up.

A bit less drama all round really.

The only time I ever hear this is where people are making excuses for lazy men who don't pull their weight in relationships and families.

Typical examples being when deeply complex tasks such as remembering family birthdays, planning a children's party or getting the washing done at the right temperature are just too difficult for men, even if they have the required list and instructions - as if they are 14 years old rather than just lazy.

I think men and women are equally simple.
We all need to have our needs met but men seem to fail a lot at this which is why women get pissed off and then get told they're complex.

If men are simple and only want sex and food and things ticking along then women want support and consideration and things ticking along.

They like to pretend they're simple in order to get others (women) to do stuff for them. I actually find them quite difficult and manipulative so I'm sure there are some thought processes going on under the surface.

It's just another way of letting men off the hook. Men and women do it all the time.

""I also feel (personal opinion) that men are generally happy if they get sex and food and life is trundling along nicely"

The problem is that men in relationships often (not always-don't shoot me) don't realise what needs to be done to keep life "trundling along nicely"

Completely agree with this and I think @Theredfoxfliesatmidnight got it 100% spot on

I do think women are more complex and I don't think it is entirely due to the way we are socialised. Personally, I enjoy the complexities of being a woman and the way I think, perceive, feel and deduce things as opposed to the way men do.

I don't see how it's sexist but it is a stereotype. Men don't suffer from anyone saying that or acting on it. They might even benefit from it, as it reduces expectations on them.

Think this is the crux of it.

Let's face it women want only want sex (when they want) and food and things ticking along too. Difference is women for the best part? are the ones that have to achieve the ticking along for those around them before they can achieve it for themselves.

The "simple creatures" look after themselves first. No worries in that.

I personally believe that the only reason anyone believes men have less complex emotions is because

• somehow anger has been rebranded as 'not an emotion'
• its still normal in parts of society to socialise men to believe childcare cooking or cleaning or family organisation are 'womens stuff' There's SO MUCH LESS less to have emotions about, if you subconsciously or openly delegate that stuff to a partner.
• apathy is a depression symptom. But it's also just a symptom of someone not giving a shit, and you only have to read the relationships forum here to come across men who truly don't give a shit about their partners emotions, concerns, workloads. There' nothing 'wrong', they just don't see why they should care, or it's requires work to fix that they don't want to do.
• we don't teach anyone how to be wrong! Conflict resolution is so important in life yet you see it all the time in workplaces, so many people totally offended and affronted to be told they are wrong, and immediately jumping to defence/offence and not to reflect or work towards resolution. And there have been threads discussing how this attitude is found moreso in men, although happy for someone to kick data my way that says otherwise!

Requisite disclaimers:

• Nope, not all men. But fucking lots, enough that it's a problem.
• I know you don't recognise your husband or family or friends or colleagues in what I'm saying - that's great, I'm really happy for you. But it is a reality in a lot of circles.