Kirstie Allsopp reported to Social Services

[Eastie77Returns]

I know she’s worshipped on MN so will don by hard hat now😅 I think reporting her was absolutely ridiculous but I do question the wisdom of letting her 15 year old son travel across Europe on his own (well with friends). She mentioned lots of kids do this after their GCSEs. I think it’s usually after A Levels?

Is KA really idolised here?! She's a pain in the arse, what on earth is there to idolise?

I wonder if all these people who feel that a boy who was days away from being 16 was too young to do this are in favour of 16 year olds being given the vote.

You've missed the point - if we expect 11 year olds to navigate big London termini on a daily basis (and loads of them do) then 15 & 16 year olds ought to be able to work out how to get from major city A to major City B on the continent. KA said her son planned and saved up for it all himself before bringing it to her as a proposal so I imagine he is a reasonably savvy teen. Also I imagine she and her husband went through it with a fine toothcomb and had a number of conversations about "what it" etc. (Kirsty is clearly a planner) And he'll have had a mobile phone and a bank card on him. I just don't get the over protective culture these days that wraps kids up in cotton wool and, frankly, I take my hat off to KA for agreeing to this.

I was, similarly to her son, younger than most of my school mates, so my first holiday ( youth hostelling but in the UK, though it was a walking holiday so it was out in the sticks in isolated places) with friends I was only 15 and my mates were 16- none of us were allowed to go the year before and we were a bit cross about it, actually- our parents decided we had to wait until post-O level. But my effective age in maturity terms was at least that of my contemporaries- if anything, older than most. IN fact, thinking of it, older than many adults....
And kids are often far better travelled these days than I am even now, so being abroad (but not too far away or in a dangerous country, of course) may not be a big deal either- though now we're not in the EU I don't think I would allow it- within the EU I'd feel more confidence that I could weigh in and sort things out if anything went wrong in an EU state.
I'd say it entirely depends on the kid- how mature they are, can you trust them, who are they going with, where, what are they planning, etc.. My parents knew I was sensible about outdoor stuff, I already had loads of experience even solo hiking, and wouldn't even consider boozing either, for example.

So you think being capable of looking at the political aims of the different parties and make a decision about which party you believe best represents you is the same as being capable of being able to effectively judge and manage risk in multiple different situations across multiple unknown countries and cities over a period of several weeks?

@Londonmummy66 I think you make a good point there - the skills you need to make a local public transport journey aren't massively different to the ones you need to make a long distance one. And the risks aren't any higher.

Frankly yes.

Right, I'll bear in mind next time I put a cross in a box and stick it into a ballot box that I can be proud of myself because I've just completed the equivalent of 3 weeks of international travel.

I travelled to Germany with my 16 year old (female) friend via ferry and sleeper train when I was 15, back in 1985 before internet, social media and mobile phones. I can't stand KA but I think her being reported to social services is utterly ridiculous.

Making a parenting decision which isn't one I would make, shouldn't result in referrals to SS. Would I allow my 15 to go inter railing, no. Do I think it's a SS matter? Also no.

To be honest though I think it does shed some important light on the over reporting to SS of families (who generally don't tell anyone, I'm aware of lots in my job... and in my view 90% totally without any sense to them). They add huge stress to families. But also overload SS who have to triage. In part this is because almost any organisation that comes into contact with children and young people is urged to report absolutely anything. No level of sanity check is permitted. Only SS are allowed to decide even the most clear cut examples don't warrant SS.

That's without even considering the huge the number of malicious reports...it's a good way to harass someone with almost no 'come back'. Unlike maliciously reporting to the police which will get you pretty short shrift.

Brilliant. It's far easier and safer to book and undertake journeys like that now, and far easier to keep in touch as well, so I'd say there's a LOT less risk doing it now than there was then.

Not quite sure I understand what you're saying. My point was that if someone is mature enough to be able to cast a vote which may decide who is going to run the country then surely they should be mature enough to do what KA's son did.

It's not something I'd do - even though a sensible 15yo would probably be fine. But honestly, there are kids living in absolute nightmare situations. Surely SS have better things to be doing?

My daughter was travelling alone by train in the UK to her friend's family from around 14. Journey of a bit under two hours. Should have been a through service but if things went wrong would need to change at Crewe and/or Chester.

She'd been on trains with me and/or her Mother, mostly the hour or so to/from London, since forever.

Mobile phone and 'Live Arrivals' train tracker meant we knew exactly where she was and we talked her through a delay issue at Stafford. Friend's parents were in the loop by text.

All good and by the time she was doing Uni visits at 16/17 she was a totally confident wee traveller.

They do.

And, like spurious allegations of criminality and police time, it'll be knocked on the head in well under a couple of person hours of staff time.

A 14 year old travelling by train in the UK is fine.
That is VERY different from a 15 year old exploring multiple countries by train without an adult.

Is that really all the consideration you give to assessing who to vote for? The same as going on holiday? No wonder politics is in the dire state it is in.

So he travelled a few weeks before his 16th birthday.

as a midwife I’ve come across pregnant 16yos who social services have installed in a flat on their own. So SS would have been fine with him permanently living by himself a few weeks later. I can’t imagine there’s that much change in maturity in the space of three weeks. People don’t magically become way more mature on their birthday. So I really don’t think they’ll be that bothered.

but I get they have to “do something “. But from what KA said it seems she’s had a message saying a report has been made and logged and if any other reports are made then they’ll visit. I don’t think they’ve actually been to see her?

All seems a bit ott that it’s a concern re KA’s son. Although, neighbour’s daughter and her friend who are both just going into yr 11 and are 15 flew off to Europe together the other day. I thought that was odd - I hope they were visiting pen friends but am not sure

It really is not.

Experience of UK travel and understanding timetables etc is a skill my DD had and I'm pretty sure KA's son had too.

At 15/16 my CSE level French was better than it is now at 64. Oscar and his friend probably had at least a smatter of German and/or Spanish too.

If we were talking about going to Africa or India I could see your point but quite frankly, apart from a shared language, America is way more foreign than near European country where you've holidayed as long as you remember.

It's really not.

One involves being able to make an informed decision over a period of time by reading and analysing sources, with plenty of opportunity to ask questions and then calmly decide. The risk of getting it wrong is that one vote has been cast for something you later regret. FWIW, I'd have voted the same way at 16 as I would have done at 18 and as I would do now. I don't know many people who change their political views radically between 16 and 18.

The other involved being able to immediately handle any number of unpredictable situations that may be thrown at you, including people who may not have your best interests at heart, trying to navigate them through a language barrier, exposure to drugs/alcohol, sleep deprivation, and no-one knowing if the two of you got home safely each evening. The risks include serious injury, sexual abuse or assault, and death.

Jay Slater was 19, got separated from friends, made a stupid decision at 5am and ended up dead. These kids are 15 and 16, how much higher are the chances of them making a dumb decision under pressure?

Pregnant 16 year olds in their own flat are helped to obtain this with the help of professional staff. And everyone knows this is far from an ideal situation. Any loving family would not be sending their pregnant 16 year old off to live alone.

Exactly, and social services remain involved with minors who have babies and move out. Just like SS should be getting involved in this situation.

There was recently a thread where majority seemed to think 12yo shouldn't be home alone. But then in the other KA thread it was totally the norm to let 15yo travel alone in Europe. Im sometimes confused by the age rules on MN.

I have mixed feelings and feel slightly hypocritical because I interailled for 2/3 weeks aged 16 in the Summer of 1991 - and I had a blast. My eldest dd is now 17 and I wouldn’t let her do it this summer - partly because I know what dreadful mischief I got up to, partly because she isn’t as streetwise as I was and partly because Europe isn’t as safe as it was. Interrailling youngsters used to sit propped up against their backpacks on all the main squares, now a lot of those same public places are mainly occupied by bored and unemployed single men, loitering around pestering young women. It’s a different world.
Once she’s 18, I will have to let her go but I will certainly worry about her.