Pressure to be “More Scottish” than you are?

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I grew up in Glasgow in a middle class family. My parents were both Scottish. My dad from an Edinburgh Anglo-Scots family and my mum from a working class mixed background, but who spoke Gaelic due to her one grandfather being a first language speaker.

We spoke both Gaelic and English at home. I was sent to a Gaelic language school. The pressure to be more Scottish than anyone else was insufferable, even bordering on slightly xenophobic. I hid the fact my father was not a first language speaker (he can’t speak the language at all). There was a presumption that I and my family would all be SNP voters and if you dared say you were anti independence then you might as well have been Maggie Thatcher herself.

I was wondering it anyone else has felt a pressure over the last 10/20 years, or even recently, to become “more Scottish”? Or if people in Ireland or Wales might also feel this recent national pressure?

Who on earth is "pushing" Scots?

The reason you don't hear Scots spoken in every situation is because the vast bulk of Scots speakers are multilingual and use English in formal settings or where the other party in the conversation might not be a Scots speaker out of courtesy. Scots is very much my first language as it was used by both my immediate and extended family in all domestic situations, so I spent 4 years speaking nothing but Scots before I was ever given any formal education in English.

This idea that Scottish people are invariably English speakers first and foremost, who only "lapse" into Scots through laziness or familiarity simply isn't true. My first language is Doric Scots, I was taught English at school, although I was obviously familiar enough with it through TV etc before then that I was essentially bilingual by that point anyway.

but as a living language it's just not a thing

This is just complete nonsense. My family still speak nothing but Scots amongst themselves.

I arrived back after MacCurtain St had been turned into the Victorian Quarter, and it still makes me roll my eyes. Mind you, when we were house hunting in St Luke’s, I was hissing ‘No fecking way am I living in a house called Kingsville, or Empress Villas!’ Where we live now also has a lot of that kind of house name. I am frequently tempted to rename ours ‘Michael Collins House’.

I am also English and also moves to Glasgow for uni, but over 25 years ago and I still live here. I don't recognise anything you have said at all? Nobody ever comments on my accent at all really except to occasionally ask where I'm 'from', but 'anti English sentiment' - no I've honestly never experienced it. I wonder where you lived...? I work in some very deprived areas, where people are from much less diverse backgrounds than the places where Uni students tend to live, and still haven't experienced it.

As the the OP - my DH is Scottish and I don't think he's ever felt pressured to be 'more' Scottish. I don't know anyone who actually speaks Scots or Gaelic at all. So maybe it's a regional thing, this pressure. My eldest son does some acting though and castings often ask for the child to be 'Scottish with a Scottish accent' and I wonder if he's not Scottish sounding enough for these parts because his mum is English.

@mybeautifulhorse i lived In Motherwell, Hamilton and Coatbridge. I’m not sure if it was specific to the time frame (Scottish independence was a fiercely hot topic) Had more trouble there than in central Glasgow to be honest where in the main tourist bits I didn’t feel worried. I did have three occasions where random people told me to fuck off home when I was with my (Scottish) friends and they over heard my accent. Once was an old lady in a pub on a Saturday afternoon, the second was a large group of young lads outside of a supermarket and the third was a man in his 50’s behind me in the que in a bakery who said he couldn’t wait for independence so that people like me could fuck off back home.
My friends who were with me started to feel intimidated too on my behalf, they couldn’t believe it! They offered to start ordering my drinks in a pub etc so that I didn’t have to speak 😂

I genuinely don't understand what you mean more Scottish? We have a Gaelic medium class in a local primary and a department in a high school, thats ita boy my Dd went to primary school with went to the Gaelic class when be was in p3, that was 20+ years ago, I don't know anybody else who went.

Anyway I'm rambling what do you mean more Scottish is it an Aye instead of Yes thing or a ken instead of know ?

I’m Welsh and I feel that the Welsh Government and certain online organisations are pushing the Nationalist agenda. A llot more than say 30 years ago.

My DH is English and has plenty of hassle living here. From low level "banter" right up to him coming home very upset because a guy had said to him that pedo was the Scottish word for English people.

My sister moved back from Scotland to Wales because she felt the anti English retiring was rising. She’s Welsh but not strong accent so perceived as English.

This thread worries me as someone who has just moved to Scotland (near Edinburgh). OH is Scottish though which I think makes me feel less like an imposter somehow and all my in law family are around here too.

So far, over the past few months every person I have met or spoken to has been hands down lovely to me. Not a single negative feeling at all. I've felt a bit awkward when I've not understood what people have said to me and quite embarrassed but I'm hoping I'll get used to it sooner rather than later.

No. I'm from the central belt (kinda - third culture child) and now live rurally in Perthshire. No pressure to be Scottish or vote SNP.

My dc all went to the Gaelic school in Glasgow and we're neither Gaelic speakers, nor "sharp elbowed west end types"! We did live in the outer Hebrides for 10 years and plan to return once our kids are all settled (we kept our wee house). All the dc were born up there and there was only a Gaelic nursery in our area. When we moved to Glasgow we wanted to keep that up and they are all fluent second language speakers, even now (all in early 20s now) speak Gaelic amongst themselves, especially if they're plotting something!!

At the recent election the only one of the family to vote SNP was dh who's from Northern Ireland! I'm happy to be Scottish but don't feel like I need to put on a show for anyone about it. It's my identity, it's who I am!

Ah interesting. I have always lived relatively close to Glasgow - in posh and very not-posh areas alike, but not anywhere like that. I did live here when the Scottish referendum happened, but never experienced anyone saying anything to me at all. I suspect men may get it more than women because of the football rivalry, but I don't follow football so I don't get involved in conversations like that. I've been here so long now that I kind of forget I have an 'accent' now

Of course Irish people have heard the term Republican. That's precisely what's causing the confusion! I'm in Munster and Gaelgeoir does not imply terrorist/terrorist supporter here. That's why I found pp's post shocking in its implication.

Also agree with pp that Oirish doesn't mean what @Buddysbunda appears to think it means.

That just sounds like the ramblings of the local nutter, tbf.

Absolutely this

Tom Clarke was born on the Isle of Wight. 70 odd Liverpool men were in the GPO 1916. And so on. But you don't have to believe in a united Ireland to love the language. Protestant Unionists are learning it in Belfast.

Fair dues to you 😂. Yes it's all Tudor this and Windsor that and housing estates called Aylesbury Downs and whatnot. Downs are chalk hills and ridges, mostly in southern England. We don't have any , lads ! Cop the f*ck on.

I’ve never felt any pressure to be more Scottish. Neither of my parents are Scottish but that’s not been a problem either.

However, I recognise the sentiment and it’s one of the reasons I avoid Scotsnet like the plague.

My family and me have had plenty of negative comments from people when we have visited England. I'll always remember when my wee brother got chased out of a shop in Barrow-In-Furness when some locals heard his Scottish accent. Often happens when you're trying to use money. Horrible dick heads are horrible dick heads....you will find them everywhere.

DHs family is fairly anti-English. I have had lots of comments over the years. I find it totally bizarre behaviour tbh. I used to get a lot of comments about moving there and I would have to ‘put on’ an accent to fit in. We did talk about moving there once but the more I dealt with his family the more I moved away from it.
Im always amazed when people who live in big cities can be so insular, they literally think Glasgow is the greatest place on earth and they wouldn’t even go to Edinburgh as it’s not as good/has nothing they don’t have.
DH has never had an issue being Scottish in England, people are usually really pleased to hear his accent. I had English friends who suffered a lot of abuse during the referendum.

Ah, don't you just love a Scotland bashing thread from within.

I can never get used to this mentality and wonder about the company you keep.

Agree, these weird threads pop up so often which seem to be presume we're all parochial backwater nobodies who have never met a forrin person.

It’s not at all clear what ‘circles’ @Buddysbunda is talking about. She says ‘Ireland’, but perhaps she’s talking about NI. The fact that she appears to think ‘Oirish’ means something other than what it means suggests to me she’s simply not using language particularly accurately. I’m fairly involved in Irish-speaking stuff where I live, and in the trad music scene, and I’ve done TG4 and Radio na Gaeltachta stuff, and a friend does Irish sports commentary, and I haven’t at all come across ‘Republicanism’ as @Buddysbunda appears to be using it in either space, and certainly not that a particular brand of nationalist politics is a prerequisite for making a career in Irish-language broadcasting or allied activities. I think a more worrying trend in gaelscoileanna is parents choosing Irish-language education as a way of ensuring few/no immigrants in little Fia’s class.

I think there is a kind of person who has a view of Scottishness that they think should be imposed on all Scots. I’m from the north east and was brought up speaking broad Doric. I don’t feel any great allegiance to the lowland Scot’s that the SNP all seem to want to see as the true non Gaelic Scottish language. I don’t like the poetry of Robert Burns because it’s not the dialect I know. I was absolutely hung out to dry by some friends when I suggested he might not have been a nice person (having researched him to give an immortal memory). These friends have now moved part time to the Highlands where they are very anti-second homer, despite being second home owners there. I am now heartily sick of them correcting my pronunciation of mountain names in Gaelic (even when I have been taught how to say them by actual native speakers). They are self appointed guardians of Scottishness who must have their standards complied with at all times.
On the other hand these friends are the kindest, most welcoming people to non-Scot’s, it’s just their compatriots who often fail to meet their standards🙂

Hmm...not exactly. But then, up until more recent years i was always pro independence. Now I don't like how the snp are regarding things like womens rights etc I don't think it's a good time for it.

What has been very noticeable for me lately however is that although there's lots of criticism towards the 'I'm the centre of the world' sort of English folk, there seems to be little towards Scots who are like that. An air of not, cultural appreciation but instead, arrogance has crept in.

Like, I love my country but I cannot stand the 'let's talk about how amazing we are as people every chance we get' shit. Eg: 'people make glasgow'. Having lived many years in glasgow, it's a very mixed bag. I've often thought 'if people male glasgow, you can keep it' over the years.

With some folk, you'd think there was no where else in the world. Like OK I get it, the mountains are pretty, do we have to hear about it 24/7?

It's all very insular and dare I say narcissistic at times.