21 Yr old DD's PIP has been stopped. Desperate for advice

[ForLessThanALatte]

Hoping if I post here lots of people will see it. DD is autistic, has sensory processing disorder, history of suicide attempts and self harm. She is at uni and on her 3rd attempt at 3rd uni. She tried to overdose in her 1st year, woke up after taking pills and really surprised to be alive. She has very severe anxiety and cuts her arms when distressed. Last serious attempt at cutting was a year ago; she ended up getting stiched up in the hospital at 3 am. She never got DLA as CAMHS were useless and didn't diagnose her till very late. We immediately applied for PIP after she got her letter saying she is autistic and initially she got low rate mobility and I queried this and she then got high rate care. The letter was totally crazy - said she says she struggles to cook for herself when she shuts down but 'the telephone assessment showed mo evidence of cognitive impairment'??? Nobody said she had a cognitive impairment she has autism and anxiety and depression. Letter says she showed "adequate memory" and that she "coped well with the assessment and did not sound anxious" - she went mute for 3 days after the assessment cos it made her so distressed. It's like they haven't heard of masking. It says she is not getting any specialist mental health support - she got referred for therapy through the student union. It says she is not taking any medication. This is true but she was on prozac at 14/15, sertraline at 16/17 and quetiapine at 16 also. She hated how these made her feel, bad side effects etc. It is just awful. The letter came today and now it is the bank holiday weekend. Tried calling them today the line would just ring then cut off. She's going to be sick with worry all weekend. It's like the assessor has never heard of masking. She goes for days without eating as executive function is so poor and her mood gets so low but they say she can cut vegetables so that means.. I don't even know. Has anybody got any advice please help x

It is irrelevant what their motive is. Statistically speaking the outcome isn’t in the favour of the applicant with just over 50% ever getting through first stage.

Motive being bad faith is irrelevant? How glib you are.

The process is designed and deliberately rigged by the DWP to prevent applicants getting through the first AND second stage. That is why the government introduced the second hurdle of Mandatory Reconsideration in 2013. It is yet another artificial hurdle to sift out applicants from getting through by giving them false hope they will be heard on MR but actually not reviewing the application and giving even more bs reasons to reject and quash the applicant's hopes.

Stop quoting statistics that ignore the realities of the PIP process. You are talking just like the DWP.

This. Thank you @blueshoes for summarising the exact issues as I see them.

And as for "it's irrelevant what their motive is" this just feels like more of the same gaslighting shite the whole system seems to be geared towards.

I say this because I've experienced an ESA assessment following major surgery and losing my job because of it (within trial period). I have never felt so demoralised, patronised and scared of an outcome in my entire life. How anyone can say it's easy to claim such benefits is beyond me.

@Jimjamjaroo sorry about your experience. So many people screwed over by the benefits assessors and the DWP. Makes me angry on behalf of people like you.

I knew my dd would not have the energy, resilience, organisational ability or sheer persistence to navigate the PIP application to the bitter appeal. Hence I immediately got appointed as her appointee and took over the process and bore the slings and arrows. I thank the benefit charity who told me to do this from day one. The DWP really know how to strike at someone when they are weakest to deny them the benefits they are entitled and which the system was set up to support.

Clearly you know nothing about PIP. I can assure you it is NOT 1k a month and my housing paid! Stop spreading misinformation and get your facts right before you wade into a discussion you clearly know nothing about.

Oh, and my PIP doesn't disempower me. It enables me to do the things I want to do in life, including working full time in a "proper job" as you so kindly put it.

£730 maximum but then young people often get UC on top taking it to around £1400 a month total.

I rang and asked for a copy of my assessment. The assessor wrote down stuff I didn’t even say, and omitted fairly crucial information. Although it takes me 10 minutes to walk 100 yards to my bus stop, stopping every 10 yards, this means I have no mobility problems. I can’t prepare food, as I need my sticks to stand, and even if I chanced using just one, it would be downright dangerous to lift something from the microwave, or a pan from the cooker. I cannot even butter a piece of toast using 1 hand. Yet apparently I could peel and chop food, so can cook and prepare a meal. I go up stairs on my hands and knees and my husband has to wash me, yet I was still turned down.

some assessors lie. I do not know why they do this. All you can do is take the necessary steps to try to get an award, if you feel that is the right course of action to take.

Some claimants lie. Hence the need for such onerous checks

I would expect the people who carry out these assessments to be truthful, and stick to facts obtained during the assessment. It is not too much to ask, or maybe it is.

You have articulated exactly why I feel PIP is unfair .It is often people who do not believe in themselves, who think they don’t deserve things, ( so don’t appeal ) have low self esteem who find assessments incredibly stressful who often suffer the most with their mental health. It’s fine if their parents do it for them of course but what about older applicants ?

And the majority of claimants don't. I've never seen an assessors report to be fully true. And I do help people with PIP applications.

But the galling thing is when you have given them 30plus letters from Consultants, OT, wheelchair services, physio etc etc

You have filled in the form using typed notes attached to every page explaining in exacting detail how x,y and z impacts your life and how you need help and explain the ways

NOTE...never just fill in the boxes on the form as then they say you haven't provided enough information. And if for reaward check always refill in the questions never say as last time. Answer the questions in full and then say also refer to form of 2020 .....

Then you go to interview and then ask the same questions again and you give the same answers.

Then the report comes through and you genuinely question have they got you mixed up with someone else. I've had diseases I've never said I had, lived in houses I don't, had extra children, lived with a woman.

So I can do all I can to give them the correct, accurate information. I back everything up with MEDICAL EVIDENCE and they can't do me the same courtesy.

Luckily, like a pp I've never had to appeal as I did receive the amounts I was due. Though I have helped others and sometimes the joy it brings me to point out their blatant mistakes and ableism by some (I'm saying some not all) assessors is fantastic!

As so many of you all know so many people who get PIP and benefits they don't deserve....let me give you my shock moment from someone I know who works in the benefits office. "If the file isn't thick enough I just think nah you're lying and don't look at it properly" - from a manager who processed ESA applications.

"As so many of you all know so many people who get PIP and benefits they don't deserve....let me give you my shock moment from someone I know who works in the benefits office. "If the file isn't thick enough I just think nah you're lying and don't look at it properly" - from a manager who processed ESA applications".

😲

The onus should not be on a genuinely ill/weak/vulnerable person to prove themselves to a complete stranger during a snapshot assessment, who neither has the qualifications, depth of knowledge, experience or training a proper medical professional has. It's a disgrace we treat people this way, the majority of whom work hard and legitimately pay into a National Insurance Scheme to protect themselves, should the worst happen.

It is also why our medical professionals should be trusted and better supported to spend enough time with their patients, to be able to determine and thoroughly assess their capabilities and suitability for work. It horrifies me that fitnotes are under review, with view to giving these decisions to these same type of DWP assessors.

It's those who don't have family to support them I really feel and fear for.

This is an excellent point and I worry so much about young people who are in a similar situation to DD but who don't have parents / carers who can at least try and advocate for them.

What qualifications do you need to become a PIP assessor? I am sure the first person we spoke to said she was a nurse and I think that the one this time round said they were as well. But apparently 'nurse' isn't a protected title - I think I read this on MN!

they can be Nurses, Physios, OT's or paramedics. My friend used to be a Paramedic and went into PIP assessing but it broke her within about a year, it's not an easy job. She just wanted to do her best for people but found it awful. I worked with someone recently who had been a PIP assessor recently but hated it so much she left. She said the assessors had in depth training on all conditions.

If you are a trained nurse, paramedic or physio, why waste your skills doing that job? I'm guessing many have left those jobs because of burn out. So, can you imagine the levels of compassion fatigue amongst the PIP assessor work force? They will be completely numbed out to the distress and anguish of those applying, some may even take pleasure in turning people down.

Reasonable pay, 9-5 hours etc. The person I know was doing it as a lone parent and needing 9-5 hours. It's not bad money for asking people questions and then writing up a report, although I appreciate a lot of responsibility if you have a conscience. I appreciate they don't always do that well ! Around 35k starting salary. To be fair to the people I knew who had been PIP assessors, they both left because their ethics would not let them continue in the job. I think they have a pretty high turnover of staff. I was with a client on friday whose assessment was cancelled fifteen minutes before the assessment time as no-one to step in when assessor went off with an emergency.

Your friends with ethics left the role, so it makes you wonder who is left then?

Yes exactly.

I imagine PIP Assessor is a job that can be done remotely whereas those jobs could not.

You'd wonder how anyone who started out in a caring profession could stand to be part of a machine like the DWP and agencies like Capita and Independent Assessment Services that gaslights disabled applicants at their most vulnerable with lies and outright rejection and puts hurdles such as MR ahead of the tribunal, so as to beat out any vestige of a desire to appeal. Just to meet a target whilst turning a blind eye to misery and suffering.

Not surprised anyone with ethics will not last. And those that stay have sold their soul. My dd's assessor was an ex-paramedic.

Also, if someone has not worked to pay NI, needs to be a certain amount over 2 years, they cannot get ESA

Shall we clap for these people?