Chance of a lifetime or too good to be true? Notting Hill, London flat.

[Springingintolife]

Sorry, long one, but trying not to drip-feed.

I'm on homeswapper and have been a while as I feel very cut off where I live due to not driving, having an illness (fibromyalgia and hypermobility) and not being close to the bus stops to just nip about and do things with my nearly 5 year old daughter.

What I have is a 2 bed semi with front and back garden and a drive in a semi rural area on the outskirts of a large town in the south east. Ten minutes drive from the beach and can get into London within an hour. I feel you have to have quite a bit of money here to have a good quality of life with a child, as everything has entry fees and needs driving to, or takes quite a while on public transport.

That's the reason I've been on homeswapper. I have looked at some places and talked to people about swaps before but they haven't worked out for various reasons. I've never pulled out on anyone- apart from one flat which was splashed on the front page of a local paper for having serious mould issues, just after the swap was approved.

Someone has contacted me with a one bedroom ground floor flat in a very very posh road next to Notting Hill, with a private garden, and I'm having a think about whether this would be the change I would need. The reason they want to move is they don't have RTB and they want to buy somewhere. (Let's leave the RTB debate out of this conversation please!). I have RTB but as I'm not able to work full time at the moment, it wouldn't be something I could make the most of.

Positives about the swap- I grew up on the other side of London so it's familiar. Has a garden still. Smaller flat so less cleaning and maintenance. They seem to think the tenancy gives the right to do work to the flat and thinks the living room could be converted to two bedrooms, so potential future bedroom issues may not be an issue. Free public transport for children. Free museums so things to do at the weekend. Lovely parks with paddling pools in London. My brother lives on the other side of London and is expecting a child with his DP so closer to a cousin for my DD and could afford to visit regularly. Get to be in an affluent area so if I wanted to do some part time work like tutoring or cleaning, I could charge a decent amount. Might meet rich handsome man. Can access universities if I decide to go back to studying one day. More going on. More inspiring area to keep me motivated and improve mental/physical health on nice walks. Always somewhere new to see. DD is mixed race so would be in a more diverse area.

Negatives- losing the RTB but potentially could swap again when DD is a teenager. Losing a bedroom and would need to do work in the future to create an extra space and can't guarantee I would be earning enough to fund it. Flat doesn't have double glazing so might be colder in the winter and cost more to heat. Although I looked online and has same energy rating as mine. Potentially smaller space to heat. Person said they would take everything with them including the oak flooring, so I'd have to move in with potentially a concrete floor and put carpet onto a credit card, although cost of this would be offset by not having to buy a car and learn to drive more imminently. Housing association don't have great reviews online for repairs, but looks like person has spent a lot of money installing new things into the property. (Apart from the oak floor, which they say they're taking). Possibly having noisy neighbours above us. Although I already have a shouty next door neighbour anyway. We lose the beach, but it's cold most of the year anyway. We lose the countryside, but I don't manage to get out and about in it enough anyway.

However, I don't know about the area these days, as I left London years ago and I hear it's changed a lot, so I wanted some honest mumsnet experience.

Housing association don't have great reviews online for repairs

This is a huge fly in the ointment. A LL who has to be hassled and forced to carry out repairs is a nightmare. It's exhausting and can be costly if you're suffering additional expenses until the repair is done. If you've got a good LL now I'd stay put for that reason alone.

Get to be in an affluent area so if I wanted to do some part time work like tutoring or cleaning, I could charge a decent amount.

This part you're reading too much into, it's not necessarily true. There's more people in London so more competition for jobs, especially unskilled jobs or part time jobs and jobs that fit around school times etc . There was a thread recently and the person in London was paying significantly less for their cleaner than some of those much further away.

Don't underestimate the cost of living in general. Everything is costlier in the south east and especially in London. Food will be more expensive even. Absolutely everything costs more. I moved from London to Wales and had a much much better quality of life on the same income due to everything costing less. Maybe this is less relevant if you're already in the SE.

I'm not saying don't move, you've obviously thought about it and have plenty of positive reasons to, but don't underestimate where you are now. It does sound as though there's a lot going for it.

I personally wouldn't give up well fitted double glazing for somewhere that doesn't have it. I also don't buy the whole thing of "oh you can convert into a 2bed flat no bother". That maybe wishful thinking.

You mentioned not getting out much. Is that health related? Because living in a small flat you really do your living outside the flat IYSWIM. So you might feel more trapped than you do now, if you have to stay home a lot for health reasons.

Noise risk would bother me personally too. Have you ever lived in a flat before? There's more neighbors surrounding you so more risk of noise (and bullying, it only takes one rotten apple to move in and turn some others against you and suddenly your life becomes hell in earth). I find noise that comes from above far more intrusive than noise from next door or below too. Even people wearing shoes indoors on hard floors, especially DC running around, is awful. To the point I'll only live in houses or top floor flats now, it ruins my life otherwise.

Can you go stay with brother for a week and travel daily to the area you're thinking of moving to to get a feel for it, talk to people working and living there, ask what schools are like etc? I agree with you about the free stuff (and cheap and accessible public transport), London is great for that.

All depends on how much weight you put on that and in being near family I suppose. Maybe those eclipse everything else for you. Although getting from one side of London to the other to visit brother might take just as long as getting there from where you are now. Also what's that relationship like? Would he welcome you visiting more? You might find that moving makes no difference to how often you see him and that he does nothing to facilitate a relationship between you/DD and your new niece.

It's a hard decision for you.

A good friend of mine has a HA flat in Notting Hill, it’s lovely but tiny but in an amazing location. He’s constantly weighing up size / location and for him location has always won. Were it just me I’d do exactly the same, my dream once DC have left is to sell my house in zone 3 and buy a flat in central London.

BUT, I’m not sure I’d do the same in your shoes at your stage with young DC, in fact I did move from my lovely 1 bedroom in North London to a 3 bedroom in SE London for more space. If you are able / can afford the renovations to make it into a 2 bedroom then I’d say go for it but also ask her to leave the bloody flooring , that’s so cheeky! 😉

Easy to say if it doesnt involve your front yard being used as a toilet.

@Springingintolife DEF check out carnival route, schools as PP have said.

Is it GF or lower Gf? Think about dark, damp and security. Also who is above you?

Have you considered that it would be an in-year school transfer and that if all schools are oversubscribed you may be allocated any old school quite a distance away?

I do agree with others though, I very much doubt your HA will let you become intentionally overcrowded.

I would also suggest you take a step back for a second and see it objectively. Single glazed windows, needing a credit card to put down flooring etc when you use words like being destitute. Every negative thing people have said you've almost batted away or said it's basically not relevant so it doesn't seem you're looking for impartial views but deep down want people to agree with you. Following your heart instead of your head.

What are your work arrangements? London is expensive for school wraparound care which often has a waiting list.

O would try to buy the floor and exchange, your daughter can have the bedroom and you can make a divide and have have a small sleeping space. Go for it

Incredibly selfish decision OP.
It seems like you're blinded by the thought of being able to move to a central London flat which otherwise is unaffordable hence 'once in a lifetime opportunity'. If you were single on your own, I'd say go for it. But with a child, absolutely not. Your child is not going to be 5 forever and will need her own room at some point. Also denying her a garden, transition house to flat is harder than you think with a child.
Not to mention your health issues; how long until your MH starts suffering due to being stuck in a one bedroom flat in a very expensive area? Let's face it, whilst it's a fantasy to live in central, it's crap being there unless you have a lot of money.
Luckily, I don't think the swap would be allowed as you will be intentionally overcrowded.
It's a bad decision and I can't believe how many other posters are supporting it.

I’d not do this either, your daughter will grow up and cramped in a tiny space where the living room is a bedroom is simply not optimal. I think you’re swayed by how nice it is in your eyes and not thinking mid term.

Im a Londoner through and through - I grew up in central Notting hill as did my DC. We left 5 years ago for the following reasons.

Crime is rampant - our ground floor flat was burgled three times while we lived there.

My youngest DC was robbed of her mobile phone on the way to school while walking with friends. Muggings are so so common.

Oldest DC said she constantly had to be vigilant and became a more "street" harder gangsta person than she needed to be.

Neighbours and sense of community is non existent as people can be transient in central London and on edge about making close connections. No one gives a shit about anyone else and you're lucky to know your next door neighbours.

Access to health - while GP appointments are pretty bad to access outside of London, it's nothing as bad as it is in Central London. Also you're breathing in disgusting air all the time.

The carnival will kill your soul.

People will be having sex, shitting, pissing and vomiting on your front doorstep on a scale you cannot imagine and there's nothing you can do to stop it.
Notting hill residents try to move out during carnival weekend.

If you were single, younger etc then yes jump at the chance. Otherwise I'd run a mile.

Most people move OUT of central London for a better quality of life - There's a reason this woman is desperate to swap with you...

She hates living there.

Op it sounds wonderful, go to for it. I know the area fairly well it will 100%boost your life style and quality of life.

Yes it's expensive in parts but as the moaning minis keep pointing out many poorer people live there also and there are definitely cheaper "caffs" down the bottom of portabello road etc

Or just take your own out, problem solved 🤣.

Go for it if you can. Good idea really sofa bed room share.

I don’t think you need to be so gloomy!?Carnival doesn’t kill your soul!

if the swap is allowed then you’ll have a one bed garden flat in a highly desirable part of London that potentially in 5 years time you could swap again for a 2 bed in a still good but less fashionable area.

home owners make these trade offs all the time and move about upsizing and downsizing, changing areas etc so no reason tenants in social housing can’t do same.

and yes Notting Hill was pretty grotty in the 80’s , it had riots! And was also where rachman had a lot of housing and so where once of the first ever housing associations started to improve the housing stock there Notting Hill Housing Trust ( which previously was posh hence all the town house and lovely squares)

I’ve always thought of Notting Hill to be quite a diverse area. I used to have other friends who lived in some amazing housing trust flats of Portobello Road (they made a fortune over carnival charging people to use their loos 😂).

I also knew one of the poshest women Ive ever met who lived 10 minutes away in Chepstow Road who couldn’t have been more different .

I work in Bloomsbury and a huge amount of the flats there are social housing but you also have super expensive private homes too and incredibly bouji shops but you also have very normal places as well. I think that’s just how London is.

I also think London is an amazing place to bring up children. My DC get to do amazing things I would have only dreamt of when I was their age

That said the space would be a concern for me and much more knowledgeable people above have pointed out it might not be viable to downsize.

Good luck though OP, hope it all works out.

Gloomy to elaborate on the realities of living in Notting hill? Get a grip love.

Carnival is wonderful to visit but not if you live directly on it's route.

Unless this wonderful Notting hill life has been your experience and you have lived there then you have no idea what you're talking about! We moved out for the valid reasons I have given as have many other people.

Mainly because of the crime and the effect it was having on my children. I'm not talking about the 8Os riots here, but my recent lived experience of the area.

There are soooo many pretty little play parks around there including the larger Holland park one. Ops dd certainly won't be deprived of outdoor space!
The parks are far far nicer than ours where we live and ours are few and far between.
A non argument.

Im a Housing Officer, and we wouldn't allow you to do this swap and make yourself overcrowded.

@Tigersonvaseline - that’s Holland Park playground is lovely. But often has entire school groups in, or holiday play schemes using, or just all the other children while also live near. There was easily 100+ children last time we went, which meant it was rammed

I'm sorry OP but as pp's have said, this won't be approved due to you making yourself intentionally overcrowded at the start of your tenancy. Don't set your heart on this, just keep looking.

@FancyAnxiety - no you don’t Queue to get into Hyde park. But you do often queue to get it into the princess diana playground within Hyde park, especially if you aren’t there at 10am. If op has a 5 year old, she probably wants to go inside the main playground. It’s has a locked gate with security and they don’t let you in if over capacity. Even their own website says on busy days queues expected of between 15 mins and 1 hr
https://www.royalparks.org.uk/visit/parks/kensington-gardens/diana-memorial-playground

With the best will in the world having to queue to get into one of many children’s playgrounds in the area is hardly a deal breaker.

Also I’ve only ever queued once to get in there.

That does not sound like a good plan long term. Your daughter should not have to sleep in the same bed as you.

You need to exchange for a 2 bed.

I would keep looking.

I have friends who lived in a 1 bed flat with their 2 children for a while. Children had the bedroom and parents had the living room with a sofa bed. They put a cabin in the garden with running water and electrics for times when parents or children wanted their own space

OP has already said she pays a certain amount for food where she currently lives in SE England near the sea so I don't think food will be that bad.

From my recollection of the area you have a few Aldis/Lidls in the area (admittedly on bus rides) but there are also markets - Portobello Road street one used to be good. The area has a high concentration of diverse cultures living there who aren't well off so they need cheaper food. There is or was a brilliant Spanish 'supermarket' near the Westway flyover for one. The big Tescos there in the same road isn't bad.

It does look like though, the move won't be allowed due to space issues.

One of my fave caffs ever was just under the flyover, it still is there, Makan. One of my staples for Malay food when I used to visit Portobello Road a lot.

I must visit actually again. Fight the fear of bumping into evil uncle.

Good morning all, I've some good news. I have been on the housing association site and found this on their mutual exchange policy.

We would consider allowing an incoming tenant to move into a property that is deemed too small as long as the move would not result in statutory overcrowding.
We allow for one bedroom for each person (single adult) or couple living as a household and an extra bedroom for:
• Any other person aged 16 years or over
• Two children of the same gender under the age of 16

Just to clear up a few points- there is a lovely decent sized garden. I'm not stuck indoors because I cant go out, but stuck indoors because it's a long treck to public transport and it often doesnt turn up here. My daughter wont walk that far often due tonsensory issues making her legs feel more achey than they are, and I dont have the strength to carry her home, all the way. I wouldnt have that issue in london as bus stops and tubes round every corner.

Another point is, I wouldnt be making my daughter share with me. She has her own room and bed now and I cant even get her to sleep in it. I even put a second bed next to my bed in my room and she wont stay in that. Of course she would have the room for herself and her toys and her things, I dont have a lot of my own things anyway. I can always swap again, when she's secondary school age, if we run out of space.

I have to check the tenancy to see about converting the space and speak with the housing officer. I wouldnt move without thorough research.

Points about crime and vigilance around the area noted, and very much appreciated.

I really dont mind about carnival. I've been and know how it can get and I'd have enough time to get away for the weekend. The front door has an iron gated door on it, so looks quite secure.

She wants to move because she wants RTB. She sounds older and I guess thinking about having something she owns. She's put heaps of money and effort into the home and garden which you can see from the photos, so doesnt look like somewhere shes been trying to escape from. She said she will leave the trees where they are, but is taking the flowers 🤣 To me that is the mindset of someone who really doesnt actually want to have to give up their home, so is trying to hold onto as much of it as possible.

Or put the place up for rent on a film and tv house website

Friends had their house used for 6 weeks for a film. They went on a cruise with the money whilst the film company took over their house

Film company because they wanted to make the house dirty and gloomy and old fashioned and were going to take out the kitchen and bathroom etc they redecorated afterwards and fitted a new bathroom and kitchen friends had ordered So they came back to a fully renovated and redecorated house after a fantastic trip away with money left over.

I can only see the money that could be made.