How’s this for a whole new level of cheeky fuckery - someone has token our allotment!

[YaMuvva]

Moved into our new house in January. Bought off a lovely lady who was a widow and something of a popular figure in the street (relevant).

We were pleasantly surprised to find that in the deeds it came with a garage across the road (which we’d seen at the viewing but it wasn’t clear it belonged to the house) and an allotment plot. We’ve actually been on an allotment waiting list for years so it was nice news.

We’ve already had aggro with the garage - when we got the keys we went to open it and found that it was rammed full of full boxes! I called previous owner directly as she gave us her number (as assumed they were hers) and she said she allowed our next door neighbour for years to use it. He was most put out when we told him to clear his stuff as we needed to use it. This was 3 months ago, and only last week did he finally clear it out, and only did so when we had to get shitty with him and say if he didn’t clear the garage we would do it for him (don’t want to get off an a bad foot with the neighbours but he was taking the piss).

Anyway we have never checked out the allotment before now (it’s not far about a 10 min walk from here) just because of time constraints and illnesses and crappy weather but decided to finally today go and find it as the sun is shining here.

Anyway, when we got there we looked on the sheet of paper we’d been given and found the plot - and a person sitting next to a full and lush patch sitting on a chair having a cuppa! There is also a shed full of tools coffee cups newspapers etc in it too . We asked the person if we’d got it wrong as we are new owners of number 8 on X Street and thought this was our new allotment.

Apparently she is our neighbour down the road (never yet met her) and yes whilst it is the allotment belonging to number 8, the previous owner (a “very dear friend” of hers apparently) let her use it, she’s been using it for 10 years.

My DH, still stinging from the garage debacle, said well I’m afraid your very dear friend doesn’t live in no 8 any more we do and we are reclaiming the allotment, thank you for looking after it but it is OURS to enjoy.

She bloody said no! And that she’s cultivated this patch for several years, she grows all her veggies here and it’s her sanctuary so if we want it we will ‘have to fight for it’! She also said she paid for the shed.

DH said that’s fine, expect a fight then, and we shuffled away in shock. I then rang the old owner and she said “Oh yes it’s Barbara’s plot really she was good to take it off my hands and it would be awful to take it off her”. To be clear - the plot has NOT been sold to Barbara.

I just can’t believe the piss takery of this. DH thinks we should just go and take down the shed, leave it at her front door and dig up everything and chuck it all in a bin.

I feel like the neighbours just took the piss out of the old owner and think they genuinely have a claim to the stuff she was kind enough to let them borrow.

Glad your solicitor has clarified things. I would be inclined to serve her notice on the plot saying you will allow her to continue to use the plot until the end of the current growing season, but that she is not allowed to plant anything else. I'd also formalise this with a signed contract charging a token rent (say £5 per month) for use of the plot and the clear understanding that it be fully returned to you in good condition by, say, the end of September - anything she currently has in the ground will be done by then (I think).

I did know the garage was included before we got the keys, I just didn’t know when we viewed the property. It turns out the garage WAS advertised we just missed it!

This.

Do you honestly think the old owner should have drawn up a legal contract with her friend?

Yes, if she wanted to give it to her.

not a legal type but I would suggest that you deffo not sell it because no one knows what the future will hold for that land, and make sure that Barbara properly accepts that you can evict her and are prepared to do so before you offer her any other options. It sounds to me as though she would look on any reasonableness on your part as weakness and if you don't get the facts clear with her now, she will constantly be trying to take a mile. If you do decide to rent to her then be really clear about notice periods and behaviour while she is on YOUR property. Age is zero guarantee of good behaviour or non CF dom.

@YaMuvva I am not sure your solicitor is 100% correct with the advice they have given. I would suggest you post your situation on gardenlaw forum - they have legal reps on there which will be far more suited to advising on this than a conveyancing solicitor.

I believe you have more rights than your solicitor is saying.

The type of person who would give you a hard time and sit tight while knowing it doesn’t belong to them would 100% be going in guns blazing if they were in your position (not that you should, I’d be going for option one. Not option 3, because she’s already shown what she thinks about respecting it being your property.

Also, the seller clearly knew what she was doing. They were all hoping to get away with it between themselves.

I'm already so invested in this. Made me laugh when someone said the veggies will all be cursed now.

Please when the comments run out, call the next thread 'The quandary of Barbara and the cursed veggies'

I would get it back of her. Land is incredibly valuable. What happens if you sell? Or you might sell just that parcel of land what then?

She has had 10 years rent free on private land and now the jig is up.

I think it's telling she said to fight for it. She knew she had no rights

I had a run in with a couple who thought they had "the power of ther village" Turns out they didn't.

We did check the garage on day 1 which is when we found the neighbour’s shit everywhere.

Hoenstly it was a crazy day and never thought to go check the allotment

How? They don’t physically check the property for you - if the seller has represented that it’s vacant then they’re in the wrong, not OP’s solicitor.

@YaMuvva
Whatever you do OP, please don't apologise, as your solicitor has advised not to. You know it is your land now and she needs to be made aware of that, on a business footing

I too would go for option 1 to begin with ( a lawyer's letter outlining that it is your property) , but with a couple of options, if they suit you- a) give her the rest of the spring and summer to vacate the allotment, as she will probably already have planted stuff for the coming season or b) Suggest a fair rent for her to pay if she continues to want to use it. She might find she can't afford it anyway. Of course if you want to use it yourself, then don't feel guilty about it. It's your property

Under no circumstances sell her the land as that will a) probably cost her a lot more than she can afford. Land is very expensive and you could be talking thousands if it is a biggish plot and b) will lose you value on your home in due course

Your seller clearly didn't want to have a difficult conversation with dear Barbara who's probably been supplying her with gratis veg for ten years OR the garage hoarder!

OP you must like the idea of gardening but have you ever had an allotment? In the height of summer a full-size one is like having a second job. There’s a reason all the immaculate sites are full of retired people!

The garage situation sounds really annoying, and I can see why you reacted as you did to this. But it sounds like this person really knows what they’re doing and has put a huge amount of work in. Try to imagine how you’ll feel if it goes to rack and ruin because you can’t keep up with it next year, having kicked her off.

Now, I would want to do things by the book-no more verbal arrangements. But a tenancy of some sort sounds like a great idea to me.

Yes I thought that too.

I wonder what’s gonna happen next. Surprised I haven’t found random cars on my drive or people sunbathing in the back garden 😂

Don't feel bad, she's on your land and has to vacate - you bought it in good faith - previous owner is the twat here ... who needs to apologise to you and Babs!

She has had 10 years rent free on private land and now the jig is up.

She probably has a claim to that land now. It would be hard to move her legally. The longer she stays on the land without opppostion the more likely it is that it will become hers.

We bought a house about five years ago that also includes an allotment patch, the previous owner had warned us that a local chap had been using the land and previous owner had to resort to a solicitors letter to get him off. I wanted to get it fenced and plant fruit trees etc but dh wasn't bothered as we don't live permanently in the house. We are now looking to sell and I worry this may bite him on the arse, guess who'll get lumbered sorting it out 😡

Generally speaking, I 'd go for conciliation, and would say take option 3: a nice little bit of (largely) passive income, a patch of land for you and a patch of land for Barbara.
But with Barbara having thrown down the gauntlet, I'm not 100% sure she'd respond well to this sort of proposal.
Maybe present option 3 to her anyway (with NO apology, just calm professional businesslike vibes) and say that the alternative is that she'll be sent a solicitor's letter giving her notice to vacate. Then she knows what her options are and what would be the upshot of both.

I would not apologise, OP, it makes you look as if you are in the wrong, which you are not. I can understand this lady feeling like the place is hers after so many years, but ultimately, it is not nor never has been. She must have known this but probably thought you were going to leave her alone when this was not brought up for a few months. But I would be fighting to get it back, land is valuable and I assume it was included in the valuation of your house so you have paid for it!

I thought allotments were owned by the council and rented from the council. So who has paid for that plot? Surely the council need to advise

Read the OP's posts. She explains this.

Apologise for your reaction, but remain factual about the facts. You own the piece of land, it’s yours, and you own it, and you are looking at the next steps.

The did TBF in conveyancing stages we just hadn’t clocked on when viewing the garage opposite the house was ours (we assumed it belonged to the house it sits next to)