Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Chat

Join the discussion and chat with other Mumsnetters about everyday life, relationships and parenting.

Original poster

Why does Liverpool have such an iconic status?

204 replies

TigerOnTour · 07/04/2024 20:13

Why do people rave about Liverpool? I feel like it's seen as more 'individual' than other cities, but why is this? It shares lots of characteristics with other big cities like Manchester, Leeds, Cardiff, Birmingham and Bristol but they don't have the same status. Is it just the Beatles?

OP posts:
MammaTo · 08/04/2024 10:07

Tygertiger · 08/04/2024 07:56

I’m Northern and worked in Liverpool for a time. The people there have a much stronger sense of their identity than most people who live in big cities - most Scousers have strong links to Ireland, the Catholic Church is a big influence and many can trace their ancestors back to the dockers who had their own culture and way of life. You see a little bit of that now in the way Scouse girls take pride in dressing up for nights out etc. Plus they are linked by shared events which give them a sense of identity, such as Hillsborough (most people know someone who died or was there - it’s hard to appreciate the impact of Hillsborough if you’re not familiar with Liverpool, and even today you can’t give away a copy of the Sun in the city) and the fact that they voted Remain is a source of pride to many too.

The music scene was huge - obviously the Beatles, but lots of other acts too such as Gerry and the Pacemakers and Cilla Black - the Cavern Club launched hundreds of careers, and again because the Beatles were such regulars there in the 60s before they went to Germany, and Liverpool’s size meant that the CC was a main venue for a night out so most teenagers/people in their 20s in that period who were going for a night out got to see them - so they feel collective ownership of the Beatles in a way that, for example, Londoners can’t feel about the Rolling Stones.

Yes to all of this!

Theres very much an influence of “scouse nans” on everyone - I was brought up with grandparents who were evacuated during WW2 and fought in WW2 and that strong fierceness was passed on to my parents and onto me and my cousins.
We all very much live for the weekend too, whether people agree with that or not is a different matter - but socialising is a massive part of liverpools history.

DiaryOfaTTCer · 08/04/2024 10:07

It's because Liverpudlians also don't consider themselves to be British - scouse first. You won't find another city with the same togetherness. The history of Hillsborough and how the city of Liverpool was treated and perceived by the rest of the UK also adds a lot to this feeling.

The government wanted to leave Liverpool to go into a 'managed decline' in the 1980s - they weren't going to let that happen. Next thing you know - voted capital of culture in 2008, billions of pounds of investment and now one of the most visited cities in Europe.

Liverpool also has the most grade one listed buildings in the UK outside of London. It is a beautiful city. Sadly this is because of the money that was brought into the city during the slave trade.

It's got everything you could want for a short weekend break - museums, galleries, great nightlight, breathtaking national trust coastline, historic docks, music history, great shopping, numerous theatres...

Liverpool is full of personality - very similar to Glasgow.

It regularly finds itself on list of 'best cities in the world to travel to' and for good reason.

Original poster
TigerOnTour · 08/04/2024 10:09

History-wise, Bristol and Liverpool have similar backgrounds until the coming of the railways. But maybe Liverpool is more disconnected from London and therefore has developed more 'confidence' and more of an independent voice. It's very interesting.

OP posts:
DiaryOfaTTCer · 08/04/2024 10:10

ilovepixie · 08/04/2024 09:04

I've never been to Liverpool but the impression I have is a jobless rundown city with lots of theft. I realise this is probably from TV programmes and news reports from the 1980's and 1990's

LOL. I'd recommend you give it a visit sometime

Ifailed · 08/04/2024 10:12

I think Liverpool is similar to Newcastle, both have a long history, maritime association, strong local accent etc.

I've visited both a few times, they have been pleasant trips but I'm not drawn to live in either.

User135644 · 08/04/2024 10:17

TigerOnTour · 08/04/2024 10:09

History-wise, Bristol and Liverpool have similar backgrounds until the coming of the railways. But maybe Liverpool is more disconnected from London and therefore has developed more 'confidence' and more of an independent voice. It's very interesting.

I think Bristol is pretty similar in general. Hasn't got the football success of cities like Liverpool, Manchester and historically Leeds which is ultimately a big thing in England, rarely had a club in the top flight. Loads of good bands out of Bristol as well, if not a Beatles or Oasis. The vibe is similar to Liverpool though.

Liverpool and Newcastle are alike as well.

Soigneur · 08/04/2024 10:24

TigerOnTour · 08/04/2024 10:09

History-wise, Bristol and Liverpool have similar backgrounds until the coming of the railways. But maybe Liverpool is more disconnected from London and therefore has developed more 'confidence' and more of an independent voice. It's very interesting.

Yep, both cities built their wealth on the back of the slave trade.

Toddlerteaplease · 08/04/2024 10:30

@DiaryOfaTTCe, I remember thinking that if Hilsborough had happened to any other city, it would be long forgotten. It's certainly not remembered in my city, and that was the other team playing that day..

Original poster
TigerOnTour · 08/04/2024 10:39

@Soigneur yes I know.

OP posts:
ScottishScouser · 08/04/2024 10:46

Toddlerteaplease · 08/04/2024 10:30

@DiaryOfaTTCe, I remember thinking that if Hilsborough had happened to any other city, it would be long forgotten. It's certainly not remembered in my city, and that was the other team playing that day..

To be fair though - and I'm not one to defend Liverpool on this and have often been told I'm unreasonable when I tell them to get over it and move on - it was not your teams fans that mainly got squished. I was at school with a couple who did.

However it was nearly 40 years ago!

Hoplolly · 08/04/2024 10:57

Bowlercoaster · 08/04/2024 07:59

It's because of the TV series Bread 😁

That TART Lilo Lil!! I'll swing her round by the tits!

Lighthearted response of course, I just wanted to mention Bread 😄

Haha I watched that the other day, used to love it when I was a kid. Greetings!

Candleabra · 08/04/2024 10:57

ScottishScouser · 08/04/2024 10:46

To be fair though - and I'm not one to defend Liverpool on this and have often been told I'm unreasonable when I tell them to get over it and move on - it was not your teams fans that mainly got squished. I was at school with a couple who did.

However it was nearly 40 years ago!

Show quote history

Yes but I don’t think the press would have behaved so despicably towards the fans of anther city. Or the police. It’s still utterly heartbreaking what happened to the fans. As if it wasn’t bad enough, then the fans themselves were blamed. It’s almost worse now, years on, because we know about the coverup. It really wasn’t just a tragic accident. South Yorkshire police were a disgrace, and they still haven’t really been held to account.

Tygertiger · 08/04/2024 11:04

Anyone who doesn’t understand why Liverpool hasn’t just “moved on” from Hillsborough needs to read “Hillsborough: The Truth” by Phil Scraton. It’s incredibly detailed and well-researched - Scraton is a criminologist and was on the Independent Panel for the disaster. The title isn’t meant to be sensationalist - its the headline the Sun led with when they published their vile lies about the fans.

Lifesprettyweird · 08/04/2024 11:05

Manchesters the special one?!

I didn’t find anything different or interesting about Liverpool 😬

AuntieSoap · 08/04/2024 11:09

Lifesprettyweird · 08/04/2024 11:05

Manchesters the special one?!

I didn’t find anything different or interesting about Liverpool 😬

Really? You didn't find 'anything' interesting about Liverpool?

There's something interesting about every city if you look. You must have had your eyes closed.

PermanentTemporary · 08/04/2024 11:16

Finally visited Liverpool a couple of years ago to dig into some family history, and was absolutely blown away by the size and scale of the city. It was a major port of the country when Britain was a huge trading power, and that's how it feels. Manchester and Newcastle are is fantastic but the scale isn't quite the same even so.

My family was based there mostly in the late 19th/early 20th century so my perspective is a bit different maybe. The reason Liverpool had a big music scene was the scale of its trade links, plus having money back then - it was a rich city, plus the Irish influence, plus a strong working class culture. Everyone sang, all the time. You can see Paul McCartney taling about it in Get Back - families visited and sang together, and all the churches had big choirs and music elements (my family were Unitarian). So children had an immersive musical education from birth and essentially did an extra day of school on Sunday, mostly music, resulting in increased literacy and musical/language skill. None of that exists any more - its been torn apart by mass media.

ScubaDivingSpiderMonkey · 08/04/2024 11:20

I've only ever been there for weekends but I've always had a great time in Liverpool. I love the atmosphere of the place.

Ted27 · 08/04/2024 11:30

@Toddlerteaplease

I wouldn't expect any other city to remember Hillsborough the way Liverpool does. It wasn't 97 of your fans who were crushed to death, more injured and I expect many many more who have PTSD or other mental health issues.
I'm from Liverpool, thankfully for me I don't know anyone personally who was there on the day, but at the time I didn't know that. I remember watching the news that day and seeing the death toll rise and not knowing if my brother had gone to the match or not.
I think one of the reasons Jurgen Klopp is so loved in Liverpool is that he has brought back that sense of family to the club. And that's how it feels - even if they weren't your actual family, it felt like the 97 were.
We wouldn't be still 'banging' on about it 40 years later if there had been some justice as opposed to the cover up and attempts to smear a whole city with lies.

JF97

DiaryOfaTTCer · 08/04/2024 11:38

Tygertiger · 08/04/2024 11:04

Anyone who doesn’t understand why Liverpool hasn’t just “moved on” from Hillsborough needs to read “Hillsborough: The Truth” by Phil Scraton. It’s incredibly detailed and well-researched - Scraton is a criminologist and was on the Independent Panel for the disaster. The title isn’t meant to be sensationalist - its the headline the Sun led with when they published their vile lies about the fans.

Well said.

@ScottishScouser you need to rethink the use of the word 'squished' to describe an atrocity and the death of 97 people.

User135644 · 08/04/2024 11:41

ScottishScouser · 08/04/2024 10:46

To be fair though - and I'm not one to defend Liverpool on this and have often been told I'm unreasonable when I tell them to get over it and move on - it was not your teams fans that mainly got squished. I was at school with a couple who did.

However it was nearly 40 years ago!

Show quote history

They haven't let it go because the cover up and blaming the fans was unforgivable. If the fans let it go the truth would never have come out about the extent of the cover up and the fans would have continued to be blamed.

DiaryOfaTTCer · 08/04/2024 11:41

Ted27 · 08/04/2024 11:30

@Toddlerteaplease

I wouldn't expect any other city to remember Hillsborough the way Liverpool does. It wasn't 97 of your fans who were crushed to death, more injured and I expect many many more who have PTSD or other mental health issues.
I'm from Liverpool, thankfully for me I don't know anyone personally who was there on the day, but at the time I didn't know that. I remember watching the news that day and seeing the death toll rise and not knowing if my brother had gone to the match or not.
I think one of the reasons Jurgen Klopp is so loved in Liverpool is that he has brought back that sense of family to the club. And that's how it feels - even if they weren't your actual family, it felt like the 97 were.
We wouldn't be still 'banging' on about it 40 years later if there had been some justice as opposed to the cover up and attempts to smear a whole city with lies.

JF97

Also well said.

Another thing that makes Liverpool special is the way the city came together to make sure that the S*n newspaper was never sold in the city again.

Beautiful and amazing city with a heart.

Trinity65 · 08/04/2024 11:46

Bowlercoaster · 08/04/2024 07:59

It's because of the TV series Bread 😁

That TART Lilo Lil!! I'll swing her round by the tits!

Lighthearted response of course, I just wanted to mention Bread 😄

Loved that series

I remember when it was at its peak, they had a Theatre Show of it in Victoria in London.
Me, my Mum and my best friend went to see it.

Forget the name of the Theatre now but its where WICKED is currently running

Blackcats7 · 08/04/2024 11:48

I’m a southerner but my first husband was a scouser so we used to spend a lot of time in Liverpool seeing his friends and family.
I was struck by how very friendly the locals were even though I was often asked where I had parked my tractor!
I have since visited other northern cities but Liverpool was and still is the friendliest place I have ever been. Maybe this adds to an “iconic” status?

Trinity65 · 08/04/2024 11:50

OP
I have been to Liverpool and Manchester (I discovered two 4xGt Grandmothers were from said Cities) and I enjoyed both.
Liverpool
The Cavern Club
Liverpool One or something ... There shopping Centre with a beach on top
Duck Bus Tour
Albert Dock were some of the things we enjoyed

Manchester
Affleck's
Printworks
Monroe's
Lowry Gallery

I had heard of both of these places via hearing of The Beatles, The Liver Birds TV Show, Liverpool FC and the River Mersey
Manchester I knew of as being the Home of Manchester United and Granada Studios and, sadly though, Hindley and Brady.

NotInvolved · 08/04/2024 11:52

Finally visited Liverpool a couple of years ago to dig into some family history, and was absolutely blown away by the size and scale of the city. It was a major port of the country when Britain was a huge trading power, and that's how it feels. Manchester and Newcastle are is fantastic but the scale isn't quite the same even so.
Huh? How are you measuring size? Manchester is the third largest city in the UK! Liverpool and Newcastle are similar sized, but using any of the major ways of defining cities/metropolitan areas then Manchester has three times the population of both of them and is in the same ballpark as Birmingham.
I've lived in or around all 3 of Liverpool, Newcastle and Manchester and they are all major cities but Liverpool and Newcastle are definitely compact when compared to Manchester. And all 3 of them were major ports when Britain was a huge trading power too.