A+E targets- does it include people who came along but then gave up as the wait was so long

[cakeorwine]

Waiting times to see a doctor can be very long at A+E at the moment.
I can see the target for when the "clock starts" and the "clock stops" and the target:

All UK countries have a "four-hour standard" that at least 95% of attendances are admitted, transferred, or discharged within four hours of their arrival at any type of A&E department. In December 2022, England implemented an intermediate minimum standard, where at least 76% of A&E attendances should be seen within four hours following increased pressures on the NHS.

If someone turns up, waits to be seen, looks at the wait time and then after say 3 hours, they decide that they don't want to wait and leaves - is that measured and if so, does that count towards the being discharged in less than 4 hours?

Or are there any metrics that record how many people turned up and how many of those "gave up" as the wait time was too long for them?

I can only speak for my hospital, but with a broken arm everyone would be referred to A and E where you are booked in and then taken straight away to the minor injuries waiting area which is in the hospital. There you wait to be triaged, usually a 10 minute wait.

That article references people who have sought help elsewhere, these will be people streamed away by ED clinicians as being able to be seen in primary care/pharmacy/UTC so the 1 in 5 will not be people who left before being seen or before receiving advice.

To clarify the 1 in 5 will include that cohort, it will still be small numbers of people leaving before being seen without advice. Although I agree these numbers have gone up since the pandemic as healthcare has been increasingly difficult to access.

There is always someone ready to blame patients (they didn't really need to be in A and E, if they could leave) rather than accept that in many cases the system is not working even if every single person had decent reason to be there!

My DH took DS to A and E when he had bumped his head as a toddler, after it was suggested by 111. After several hours (I can't recall how many) they came back without being seen. DS was OK and needed no medical treatment, but we had followed the advice given.

Another time a colleague of DH fell and cut his head open and was severely bleeding. He called 999 and they suggested getting a cab to the hospital. A poster on another thread said why did he even call an ambulance and it would be an abuse if the ambulance service (or words to that effect) when the NHS own website suggests heavy bleeding is a reason to call 999.

I went to minor injuries to have a dressing changed on a deep cut because I was instructed to when I feel sure that probably could have been dealt with at my gp practice

Ditto patients wasting apts and making waiting lists longer (yes I imagine many patients do forget/don't turn up) there are also many instances where the NHS themselves are responsible for the wasted apts!

The NHS won't be fixed by people not turning up to A and E with a sore throat.

I had double pneumonia a couple of years ago. Went to the GP urgently because my oxygen levels were so poor. He sent me immediately to A and E. this was at 9.00 am. I wasn't triaged for several hours and then was left in the waiting room til 8.00 pm when they took blood and put in a cannula. I needed to lie down as I was so sick and needed pain killers other than paracetamol. It was torture. At midnight a nurse came out and said there were no doctors to see people waiting til morning and suggested people go home if they could. Luckily my husband was with me, so he put me in the car to get some rest and he took my place in the waiting room. I finally got called in for a trolly at 3.00 am when I got some much needed morphine and an X-ray.

At my A and E there is a notice stating if you haven't been triaged within 20 minutes to let a member of staff know.