At wits end with employee

[TempestTost]

I need some strategies to deal with an employee I supervise. Sorry it's long, but I am just not sure what approach to take.

Background I've been in my job two years, it's mostly been quite enjoyable, it's a role I haven't really been in before. I supervise about 8 people working together in a service organization.

There's been a fair bit of employee turnover over the past 3 years, a combination of retirements, covid, and people looking for better pay. About three of the current group have been there 7+ years, the rest are newer. One of these is a woman getting near retirement. She's a hard worker, very reliable. She is very competent at her job though I suspect she'd rather be done, she isn't enjoying it much. She's not that creative about her work and tends to be rather rigid but it isn't really a problem in her role. Particularly she's resisted technological changes though she's learned what she needs to. She's also always tended to be a bit passive aggressive but nothing crazy.

Part of her discontent is because of changes in our client base, we are in a city area that was middle class but now has a significant contingent on benefits and many are drug users. This has been a very fast change. I don't find it particularly stressful, and the newer employees were mostly hired with this setting in mind, but the older employees do find it stressful.

Anyway - the current situation is that we have two new employees, one transferred from another site, and the other a fairly recent immigrant, his English is still a work in progress. They've been with us less than 6 months. Both are bright and get along well in the environment, but also have issues that have to be managed a bit - in one case mh issues, in the other mainly language gaps that mean things get missed. I'm still figuring out the best way to get the best from them but they are, I think, making progress.

My issue is that the older employee has seriously taken against both of them, and now me; she cannot seem to stand that they and I are not doing things the way she thinks we should. She constantly brings up how things used to be done, either by people in my role, or the one above mine (that person is also new.) I am starting to feel she's a bit of a bully, which I had not suspected before, and she is quite happy to go around me and make complaints above. I am starting to wonder if she would be dishonest, but then I think I am just being reactive because i'm upset.

What's possibly more concerning is I think it's affecting other employee's attitude to the newcomers. They are much more positive people and kind, but they have been bring "mistakes" made by the new employees to me, but often upon investigation it turns out it wasn't a new person, or in other cases it's trivial stuff. I am pretty sure she is talking about them, and probably me too, with other staff. Which is a change, previously I found the place unusually free of gossip.

I've always tried to learn from the people who have been there longer - I had to as I had no other real direction in the job. And I am approachable and try and give them real autonomy in their work. I am not as good as I could be about being really authoritative, I find straight up confrontation really unpleasant (though I think most people do?)

In any case - I have no idea what to do about this woman, or even what approach to make. I think any support from higher up is likely to be minimal, apart from a sympathetic ear from my immediate manager.

Any help or insight appreciated

Tell her hard as it is she needs to accept change, it’s what happens!
does she have medical issues.
Say you’ll get to consider if she wants to stay.
i left work under a lot of stress, not being quick enough in a fast based job, ( offered less hrs) little did I realise Parkinson’s emerged, now unfit 2.5 yrs on.
i’m 61 and life circumstances mean I did the right thing

I don't really get any say in keeping her on or not. In any case, I can't picture how that happening, the upper management have kept people on with much more serious issues.

Actually, last night I dreamed that she told the CEO that I was a racist to try and get me fired, (which might be the only thing that could get someone fired here!) which I suspect is why I am feeling so stressed about it all today.

So the issues are that she doesn't like the customer base with a high proportion of drug users. Well, I can understand that. Is it because she doesn't feel safe? Is there anything that can be done to reassure her? If not, she'll have to accept them or change job.

Reminding people how things used to be done. Is that her perceived view of wanting to maintain standards, which is not necessarily a bad thing. Can you ask her to use her experience to train and support the newbies as a 'mentor', Maybe it would encourage a bit more mutual understanding.

Well, confrontation means challenging someone in order to provoke a reaction - so no, not many people do like it.

Have you actually spoken to her about it? I notice you did x the other day; I was concerned because the impact of that is y, and that's damaging to our team; can we talk about that / I'd like us to avoid that in future / how can we address that. It's not fun, it does require you to act with some authority, but unless you act somehow - why would she stop?

When do you do appraisals and set objectives for the year? Perfect time to tackle this within a framework.

When she goes over your head does she get referred to you to speak with you about her concern?

And what about your training and development? Could you get some help with how to deal with the issues?

"she cannot seem to stand that they and I are not doing things the way she thinks we should. She constantly brings up how things used to be done,"

Lay down the law and tell her its not her problem, STFU and carry on with her own job instead of worrying about what/how you work and manage others.

If she doesnt play ball, stick her on an improvement plan and manage her out.

Who gives a fuck how long she has worked there, her age or her old ways of working. Shes not paid to give her advice.

You need to come down on her like a ton of bricks or you will forever be pandering to this utter parasite. Fucks me off to no end when employees who think they know best actually know fuck all.

I think there might be two sides of the story here.

It sounds like your workplace has some issues too: a high staff turnover, low wages and because of your low wages having to hire people who might not have the best level of experience and communication skills and will require training. Plus you now operate in a declining wider environment where some of your clients have issues that can make them hard to deal with and might cause some security concerns.

Frankly to me that does not sound like a great place to work for...

So yes that one staff member might be in the wrong but can you also understand that she might be fearful that this workplace is changing for the worse?

You are also jumping to conclusion that her criticism of her colleagues is 'racist' who it could simply be frustration at not being able to communicate with them or seeing them struggling to communicate with clients (I say that as an immigrant myself, if you are in a job that is client facing you need to have a good enough grasp of the language to make yourself easily understood and to understand people's queries).

By now you really should have have a frank conversation with her & listened to her concerns.

When you speak to her be firm about changes being needed and that you are concerned about her negativity but I also think you are trying to gloss out some of the real concerns that I think many people would have about what is currently happening in your workplace. I don't think I would find this a great environment to work in...

You need to be very polite but insist that you are the manger and you will manage as you see fit, and don't expect that to be constantly questioned.

I'm not sure where I said I thought she was a racist? I don't think that's a factor at all. Language is part of that particular employee's issues, that is just the nature of learning a new language. To some extent his language is probably a little weak for the position, though he does well with clients. But since we've hired him I think it's up to us to try and support his learning. I try and address things as they come up one on one so he can improve, though I've now started to wonder at times if he is being blamed for regular errors he had nothing to do with.

I also don't think I've glossed over anything. Everyone is aware that the pay is an issue, and the funding model is being rejigged, but it's dependent on decisions outside of our organization. Similarly everyone acknowledges that the local demographic has changed, and we've offered training to help people adjust. But we serve the people who live here. I wouldn't have any judgement of an employee who moved on due to either of those things if that's not the working environment they want.

Turn over has been higher recently than before, but again, not something we can control - about half retired around covid, they were older and also changes in technology precipitated some of that too. A few moved on because they had reached the top of the hierarchy here and wanted to continue to develop their careers. And a few due to wanting more pay. But none due to bad working conditions as such.

I do think she feels that standards are slipping, that would probably be precisely what she'd say. Her thoughts aren't always wrong, and I try to take observations on board, but in other cases she is way off and frankly doesn't really know what she's talking about, usually because she doesn't understand the technical systems.

But I think the real issue is her attitude. Passive aggressive, and negative, and pushy.

I do feel like I am going to have to just shut her down, but I am not sure how to go about it, it's not the kind of thing I usually do with people! I have considered if I can somehow arrange for her to win the lottery so she'll retire.

It sounds like a nightmare of a place to work...

A manager who came in not knowing what they were doing and had to rely on the people they are there to manage to know what to do because they - " had no other real direction in the job", plus two newish employees who aren't actually up to standard and seemingly require a lot of support:

"Both are bright and get along well in the environment, but also have issues that have to be managed a bit - in one case mh issues, in the other mainly language gaps that mean things get missed. I'm still figuring out the best way to get the best from them but they are, I think, making progress."

Add to that high staff turnover, low pay...

I'm not surprised she's worried standards are slipping - it sounds like a bit of a shitshow!

"I'm still figuring out the best way to get the best from them" - How long have you been 'figuring it out'? If staff see it as going on too long, they will be unhappy, and it's often justified. After all, there is a point when you've tried, and you have to accept that what you have IS the most you're going to get.

Perhaps she, and the team, think that point has been reached.

So a very hard working, reliable employee who is good at her job is finds herself in a position where:

• she has a new mansger who hasn't worked in the area before
• Is in a role with high staff turnover
• Has a lot of new technology
• Is experiencing a change in client base
• Isn't being paid market rate & has concerns over budget etc

I can see why she might be finding things difficult at the moment. Do you have 1:1s with her? Do you have any rapport build up with her to discuss this properly? Does she ever get an recognition?

"I do think she feels that standards are slipping, that would probably be precisely what she'd say. Her thoughts aren't always wrong, and I try to take observations on board, but in other cases she is way off and frankly doesn't really know what she's talking about, usually because she doesn't understand the technical systems."

Who gives a hoot what she feels.

Shes paid to work, not feel.

And if she has no clue WTF she is talking about as she doesnt understand the systems etc, then as I said, you need to come down on her and hard.

Put her in her place. Shes there to work, not manage or attempt to do your job.

Unless you nip this in the bud, you will get nowhere. Find a way to sack her - shes clearly an incompetent know it all, who actually knows fuck all.

Absolutely discuss the issues with her. That isn't confrontation that is clarifying what you are prepared to accept and finding out what issues she actually has instead of trying to guess - that is the role of a manager. You need to direct the play here, make the workplace more productive before the drama gets to take the fore!