Why vaginal birth?

[SantaSusan]

Inspired by another thread. I'm really interested to understand the reasons for most women opting for a vaginal birth.

Disclaimer: I really, really want this thread to be a nice discussion to share views. I'd hate for this to descend into a judgy or unkind thread! Obviously, however anyone chooses to give birth is their choice alone. And as long as your precious little bundle arrives safely at the end, then who cares how they got there!?

I ended up with an elective. I never in my wildest dreams thought I'd have anything but a vaginal birth. However, for reasons I won't go into, it was decided during my pregnancy that a c section would probably be the best option for me. Everyone I spoke to absolutely loved their c section experience, and 99% of the comments online were so positive, so I wasn't worried about it at all once it was decided upon.

I had absolutely no pain during my c section or during recovery. I breastfed right away. I was up and about pretty much immediately. This seems to be the experience of most women who've had elcs. I would have an elective section again and again. If I'm lucky enough to have another baby, it'll be another section.

As such, I often wonder why more women don't choose to have their babies this way. It's so common in other countries. I think there's a lot of misinformation around c sections. The risks are also lumped in with those of emergency c sections, so electives are often painted to be riskler than they actually are.

You often hear people saying it's major abdominal surgery' in quite a judgemental way, which of course it is. But as far as surgical procedures go, it's generally very straightforward and in most cases, is easy to recover from.

I also repeatedly hear that vaginal is best as it's the most natural. But just because something is the 'natural' way to do something, doesn't necessarily mean it's the best. There's lots of things we do now with technology and with medicine that isn't the 'natural' way, and nobody bats an eyelid.

I can't quite put my finger on why I was so opposed to c sections previously. It's like it was subconsciously ingrained in me for no reason other than popular rhetoric. Which is why I'd be interested to hear why others decided a vaginal birth was best for them? Or why others knew they wanted an elcs? Has your subsequent birthing experience changed your minds at all?

Defined as being told you’re low risk by your doctors - based on age, BP, weight, existing conditions etc etc.

You’re right though, you can’t tell what the birth will be.

I should have said, a vaginal birth with no interventions is the safest for ‘low risk’ (defined as above)pregnancies that progress as expected, with the baby in correct position.

ECS seems like the next best thing to me! But surely comes with a risk of infection and generally a longer healing period. But there’s always exceptions.

I gave birth via elective Caesarean section for both DC

The first was for maternal request and the second was termed elective as I'd had a CS before

No previous birth trauma/other trauma, I have simply never ever wanted to give birth vaginally.

I've seen vaginal births and cannot un-see what I've seen, so no midwife was going to reassure me it was "all going to be fine dear"

For the maternal request CS I was lucky my GP was so understanding and helpful by referring me to the obstetric consultants when my midwife team just pretended not to hear me asking about ELCS each time I asked from about 30 weeks

Was around 37 weeks when I saw the consultant, they sent me to see a psychiatrist (because clearly I was insane for wanting a CS!) spent about 5mins with them and they agreed CS was best.
Went back to see obstetrician and I was booked in for ELCS at 39 weeks!

So for me, the whole vaginal birth thing was a huge no thanks and I was delighted with being able to have two elective CS.

No regrets.

And no judgement towards anyone who is desperate for a vaginal birth.

I was desperate for a cesarean section from the start.

Each to their own.

To put some temporal context on it, DC1 is coming up to 10 years old now

CS for maternal request really wasn't much on a thing

And I remember posters on the wall in the ante-natal clinic of my south London teaching hospital stating that they will NOT agree to CS for maternal request.

I managed to wrangle my way around that one!

For me it was a female dr who refused me an elective c section and a male one who overrided her and allowed me to have one. I’ve heard that nowadays a woman can choose which option she prefers, I don’t know if this is true though.

“Maternal request” is open to interpretation though.

just saying “I want one” will be refused.

requesting a section because you have a valid reason- be that physical health or mental health, showing you have considered all the risks and benefits to BOTH, and made an informed decision on that basis will be taken seriously and in all likelihood granted.

mental health is a fairly large catch all as well, so not difficult to request a section for that reason.

my cs was nearly 18 years ago when rates were increasing rapidly after various celebrities were having sections to preserve their fashionably thin bodies. The NHS had clamped down on unnecessary cs. I presented my case and got my section 🤷‍♀️

I just can’t understand why anyone would want a v birth 😬. I know it goes way back to when I was in primary school and watched a baby being born. I was so horrified by it that I swore there and then that I would never go through that. I had both mine through elective CS and never regretted it. I admire women who choose to go the more natural way as they are braver than me. I don’t mind admitting the idea of natural births terrified me.

@willWillSmithsmith Equally, I can't understand why someone would choose to have awake abdominal surgery if they didn't absolutely have to. That seems the braver choice to me! 😂

Surely you have a better chance of preserving your body ? No scar, no shelf, I did exercises from day 3 and yoga from 2 weeks, not sure that is allowed with a c-section. Now talk to me about pelvic floor and you may have a point. In fact vanity was one reason I wanted a VB.

This could have been easily remedied but there was a concerted effort not to do this.

My ELCS was recorded as maternal request even though my notes said mental health across them in big capital letters.

This is because there wasnt (and I don't think it's changed) a box to tick for an ELCS for mental health reasons.

Therefore as far as management were concerned no elcs were being done for mental health reasons and they could just block all ELCS on these grounds to make their stats on CS look better - keeping in mind that ten years ago there was still a target to keep below for the % of CS. (This target has now been removed.)

It really came down to how strict the hospital management were, how much a consultant was prepared to push back against management and how much women were prepared to push back on consultants. This invariably didn't favour many women with mental health issues and the process itself was torturous for them.

It has improved considerably from that but it does still concern me that there isn't proper vocabulary which stresses that mental health is a fair reason for an ELCS.

You can see a hell of a lot of loaded language against that in threads like this even ten years later.

Ha, horses for courses I guess 😁 I loved my c sections. I felt nothing except a very mild tugging sensation of the baby being removed which was not at all unpleasant. I was chatting through it (and getting emotional). No pain during procedure and no labour pains, no farting or pooping the bed 😁. All very clean and sedate which was definitely my preference. There was discomfort while the stitches were in but once they were out I was good to go. I pretty much raved to anyone who’d listen how great elective c sections were 😂

Hated mine. An hour to site the spinal, I have a common reaction to the anaesthetic and my BP drops into my boots. I feel sick, dizzy and like I’m going to pass out. It took all my focus and willpower to stay conscious. No way could I hold a conversation.

i had to have my head tilted down and lots of Iv fluids. I couldn’t hold my baby until several hours after when I was more “with it”. I vomited for several hours after and couldn’t hold down water or pain meds.

same for both sections.

recovery was brutal as well, although fortunately no complications. My friend had an elcs, got an infection and her husband ended up having nearly a year off work while to care for her and the baby while she was in and out of hospital, plus could barely move.

i find it a bit weird that people say they loved or enjoyed their cs. An appendectomy is a more straightforward and less invasive op but I’ve never once heard someone say they enjoyed it!

Such an interesting thread! I gave birth in 2020 and 2023 and I’ve never seen the VB v CS thing ever discussed before.

I’m probably naive but I had two VBs following spontaneous labour with gas and air and hypnobirthing. I know that makes me sound hippish, but it’s just the way it happened. I do remember in my first labour (that lasted 2.5 days, argh) whether they were expecting me to deliver naturally (because I too had seen those birthing videos at primary) and the midwife said ‘of course’ so I just went with it and it was all totally fine and I didn’t really find it horrendously painful or as bad as those videos seemed, it was just like bad period pain to me, so because of that I was totally up for having another VB the second time and relieved I could.

Plenty of friends and family with loads of different pregnancy and birth experiences. All so interesting and valid. As you say, it’s amazing that there is a choice and it’s a miracle however they arrive ☺️.

Oh I’m sorry your CS was so unpleasant. I enjoyed the experience as it was all very straightforward for me so there was nothing making it unpleasant. It was emotional and fascinating to me. I do count myself very lucky that both of mine were text book straightforward though as it can’t be taken for granted.

Are people awake for appendectomies? At least with a CS you get a baby to cuddle, not sure I’d be cuddling my appendix 😁

@JessPess

Yeah, I did hypnobirthing too. I loved it, but it really wasn't a great fix for me (and have a pretty high pain threshold, as I was an endurance runner)

I would have loved to"bad period pain". When induced with a back to back baby, I had "someone hammering a nail into my spine with no gaps between the pain". That's the thing I found really disappointing about the hypnobirthing and antenatal experience - it's sort of presented as if everyone is capable of having the same experience.

@Thulpelly

In an ideal world, they would also consider pelvis size, presentation and pelvis shape, as they do in other countries. And they would be prepared to change tack between tracks readily.

For those who are induced, the leaflets in my trust are actively misleading, suggesting that you can have a normal birth, when the reality is that you are not allowed in the water, you are made to be very close to the bed, continuous monitoring, very medicalised. And often more painful and interventions more likely. This is not acknowledged at all in the literature. When I was induced with my first the only conversation I had said "you should agree to this, because you are 42 weeks, your placenta may fail and your baby may die", which is fine, I didn't want to put baby at risk, but it would also be better to discuss and think about the chances of a good VB from an induction with baby in that position at that stage, rather than do what the system does and say "you're 31 with great health and low BP" so the plan for you is and has always been a VB.

Ouch, that sounds painful. I think you’re right and it should be made clear it’s not for everyone and it’s not going to work miracles. Tbh, my hypnobirthing lesson was reading half a book when I’d already been admitted in premature labour. I think it was more conditioning for years of yoga that probably helped… that and having two 7lb babies that were in the right position. Lots of luck on my side it seems.

Me, too. Absolutely horrible and not at all like anything I was expecting.

I had two VBs. 16 and 18 years ago so CS wasn’t even mentioned as I was young, healthy, not overweight and the pregnancies were textbook. There was no reason for them to offer and I didn’t ask. I wanted to experience VB. I was curious and wanted to have a natural rather than medical process. (I was well aware of course, that babies and bodies don’t always follow the birth plan and was prepared for the possibility of something different). I was lucky and had two great births. The first in hospital, got there just in time to push so no time for any drugs, and the second at home in a pool. Gas and air was offered this time but I didn’t need it in the end. They were incredible experiences. Excruciatingly painful, yes (like many, I did the ‘I want to die’ routine 😂) but so empowering and wonderful. I still relive them in my mind sometimes.

I also know quite a lot of women who don’t like their ‘shelf’. I’m into fitness and have worked hard for my muscles so am grateful not to have that. (Vain, I know).

I had two vaginal births, one in hospital with epidural which was fine but felt very long and not especially empowering and a natural birth at home (not planned it just happened) which weirdly I look back on very fondly. There was something about giving birth at home and just getting on with life that really put the natural into natural birth. Each to their own of course and luckily there were no complications.

If I were to have another I would choose a home birth as it was just so amazing, although we are 5 minutes away from a hospital which rather reduces the risk. Initially my birth plans were medical so I guess it just goes to show how subjective experience really influences these kind of- let’s be honest very strongly held looking at this thread- opinions.

I felt like I had ptsd after my first VB. Crowds would freak me out as I would look at all those people and just think of the pain caused t o their mothers bringing them into the world. My second was much better as I had an epidural.

I think I would recommend CS to my daughter because so much goes wrong with women's bodies as a consequence of birthing and risks to the baby going through the birthing process.

“I had absolutely no pain during my c section or during recovery. I breastfed right away. I was up and about pretty much immediately. This seems to be the experience of most women who've had elcs. I would have an elective section again and again. If I'm lucky enough to have another baby, it'll be another section.
As such, I often wonder why more women don't choose to have their babies this way.”

Your premise is flawed - just because you and other women you know have had relatively painless C sections does not mean C sections are in and of themselves painless. That’s like me saying I had an easy vaginal birth and every woman I know has had one so I don’t get why someone would choose not to give birth in this way. It’s anecdotal evidence and poor reasoning.

C sections do carry greater risks - the surgeon is cutting through 7 layers, cuts through your nerves, this is not a superficial scratch we’re talking about. Have you ever watched a video of the surgery? Perhaps the fact you are anaesthetised and shielded from seeing what’s going on makes you become somehow detached from how invasive the surgery actually is.

Can vaginal births go wrong and can birth trauma occur? Absolutely. But that is NOT a guarantee. It’s a possibility. Whereas being cut in half is not a possibility with a c section, it’s a guarantee.

I did not want a C section but had to have one as baby was breech and attempting to deliver vaginally carried great risk for my baby and myself. The aftermath after the section was the most painful thing I could have ever imagined. Recovering felt torturous and brutal. A section is not a pathway towards a painless birth.

I don't think I am worthy of admiration for having 2 vaginal births. I was nervous, but not terrified. I had confidence that my body (which had grown a baby) would also be able to birth it. I am in good health, I had no complications. I had good support. I don't think this is unusual. I (obviously) have no scar, feel that breastfeeding came easier (I'll never know) and feel that recovery was smoother.

Had 2 c sections (emergency) and had no issues breastfeeding either time! V straight forward (and I was wk 38).

however I would always try for V over a c. I. Fact my second birth was a failed VBAC. I think vaginally is ideal if you can achieve that

It didn’t ever occour to me to have anything other than a vaginal birth. To me C sections were there for when you couldn’t give birth naturally (I was young when I had my first and nobody said anything other!)

I was very lucky and have had 3 vaginal births without so much as a stitch. I can’t imagine a C section would have been easier to recover from. I’m not sure I would have had a c section on a what if though.

For your average mum and baby, vaginal birth is safer for both mum and baby! That is, a C section is a greater risk not a lesser one. My OB explained this to me when I assumed she’d be recommending a section for my last pregnancy, which was very high risk.

Sorry you had PTSD but you could have had that after a section too. I hope you recovered ok.