If you work in education, what do you think is causing the current attendance issues?

[NeedAnUpgrade]

I’ve read quite a lot on this recently. DD1 is 10, she’s always been reluctant to go to school. She had a spate of UTIs, stomach aches, headaches etc. She’s had a bit of time off sick but we only triggered the attendance letter recently as it went below a certain threshold. DH and I have always done our best to get her into school, being reassured that she’s ‘been fine all day’ by her teachers. It all came to a head this year (yr 5) after a complete meltdown, several anxiety attacks and refusal to leave the house. She’s now on a reduced timetable at school and on the waiting list for an ASD assessment.
Academically she’s ahead but just can’t seem to cope with the school environment.

I’m just wondering what those who work in education think the issues are. Am I just a terrible parent? Although I’m not sure what else I could do. I suspect a complete lack of funding in education has had the biggest impact on schools and students. Especially those with SEN.

I don’t agree, as an adult you have far more control over your environment than children do. Adults I know with sensory processing issues either go into jobs that suit them or are unable to work. Going to school is not a magical cure for sensory issues, it just causes MH issues into adulthood.
I suspect this has always been the case and completely reject the notion that ASD is somehow a new phenomenon. It’s more understood now and those who previously struggled through life are able to talk about it. Previously they would have felt shamed into keeping quiet.

The reason for "skyrocketing" diagnoses is simply that conditions are better understood now .A huge number of people are neurodiverse and simply won't have realised previously because they didn't have the tools that allowed them to do so. I didn't, but spent years thinking there was something fundamentally wrong with me that meant I couldn't cope with things that others around me seemed fully able to cope with. I was always made to suck it up because there was no other choice - I won't be telling my own DC they have to shut up and put up.

Teaching already has a huge recruitment crisis - requiring teachers to have a first would simply make it far, far worse.

You are so prejudiced Naptrapped

I have experience of 2 school refusers who are now thriving in life and will have plenty of opportunities to find jobs that they will suit.

I think everyone should strive to have jobs that they love. The real world is not school. School is a fake environment which is harmful to some people whether you accept what I , and others, are saying or not.

Yeah okay over controlling kids up to 18 also leads to problems when they enter university. No broom, metaphorically, at backside don’t go. People aren’t being thought to organise themselves, to self motivate etc.

i know someone who went to school in France. Highly structured system. Came back pre national curriculum to a more Montessori feel where children were instructed about the work they had to do across the week and trusted to get in with it. She couldn’t manage. Children who were raised on it balanced their free time, with their work and self motivated.

I’ve posted before about why I don’t believe this to account for most of it, won’t repeat as I don’t want to constantly post the same thing.

And BTW, despite the fact I didn't cope well with school I've always had success with jobs, particularly as I've always worked in fields that have allowed me certain things I was never allowed at school.

I can tell you that everything I hated about school as a 5 year old I still hate now as an adult, and being forced to go through thirteen years of formal schooling didn't cure me of it.

So what does account the increased number of SEN children who are out of school then?

What accounts for increased diagnoses?

I'd love to know your opinions on this.

Why am I prejudiced? And of course they should but is that reality? I’m not prejudiced for facing reality, i would say most of the people I know would say they dislike their job for whatever reason.

Schools are horrendous places. People get that right. And now more then ever triggering more and more people to be diagnosed because they are increasingly ramshackle, unpredictable, massive, under resourced, understaffed. Money! Massive schools shouldn’t exist. Good for no one.

That's really sad. Hardly anyone I know hates their job.

So you don't think that the reality is that there is more flexibility of environment for adults in the workplace than there is at school?

Is that what you are saying?

I agree, where people i know have hated their job they've changed it.

Of course everyone will have a little moan about something but that's not the same as hating or being harmed by the environment.

I think COVID gave an excuse that was never there before.

In the 70s you went to school. A handful "mitched" off but were usually pulled back in eventually kicking and screaming. I'm not sure anyone calculated attendance back then. If you did badly at school, so be it. Teachers weren't assessed-afaik- on results. Results were a students responsibility and, hence, most of us went - even if we didn't particularly like it or were having a hard run there with bullying etc.

When my children were at school attendance had become a hot potato due to OFSTED and changes in the expectations of schools. My kids had very good attendance and only one year did we get the under 93 percent letter. That was when my son had tonsillitis twice and his tonsillectomy. I suspect there were a handful of under 93 percenters each with their own story. Some.undertandable and some more challenging. The school, which wasn't big, had a full.time person liaising with these families to try and improve the children's attendance. Also, GCSE children could do some more practical learning options like BTECS and offsite courses in hairdressing, beauty, animal management and construction to help them cope with the year 10 and 11 syllabus by making it less academic .

I don't have children at school now but I'd imagine the changes imposed by the government in making the curriculum more academic in conjunction with "the COVID" excuse, and less money for schools to spend on ancillary help to bring children into school have between them helped fuel this increase in non attendance.

I do think the more school a child misses, the more it's likely to miss as coming back in occasionally means they are behind on the work and don't have the stability of the friendship groups at breaks. It must feel awkward returning after missing even a day.

I swear there are some people who still think that your standard job involves sitting in a fluorescent lit office in a suit and tie from 9-6, 5 days a week. The reality is that the world of work is fundamentally changing and that simply isn't the case - even now that sort of environment is rapidly on the decline, and I expect will barely exist at all by the time children today enter the workforce.

I think as well that some (by no means all) students with ASD probably coped fine in smaller schools, where there weren't many behaviour issues and the timetable and expected behaviour were predictable.

Now schools are bigger, a lot more stimulating in terms of bright lights and white walls, and technology, bigger classes, more noise and behaviour issues etc

So you're now adding a proportion of children who could previously cope to the really struggle to cope group.

This is how US schools often work, with the middle school and high school being on the same campus but with their own buildings, staff etc.

@Fliopen

Whilst that's true, also the world of work expects you to deliver results whatever hours you work. I'd also argue that you work the hours your job requires at the time it requires them. Schools happen to work on a 9 to 3.30 timetable.

Are these students actually studying enough each week or are they "dossing" around (to quote my 1970s self).

I think it's this - many who could cope in schools in previous decades now can't.

I remember when my DS was in reception we received a letter home instructing parents to send their kids in with calpol if they had a temperature. I thought at the time, no wonder we are a nation full of adults who rock up to the office coughing and sneezing over everyone if we start with that from the age of FOUR. Pathetic. I'm the parent, I'll decide if my child is well enough to attend school or not.

Never looked back since we decided to home educate and everything I hear from my friends with children in school serves only to reinforce that our decision was the correct one. I only wish it was a decision open to more people.

This is sad.

My son struggled at school with dyslexia and minimal adjustments despite it being severe. He was on a precipice more than once.

I can understand parents views if the environment and resourcing now is making it even worse for them.

I think the archetype of a job is 9 to 5, office job. I often talk about people with proper jobs as this. Given that in every country the biggest employers are the health service, education and security services this model doesn’t hold true. Most other careers and many within these areas also do work on this premise though. Of course it’s changed a lot to involve home working. But many careers have nothing officey about them: creatives, agriculture etc.

Ironically, your sensory overwhelms do well in office environments. Calm, hyper focus on interest etc. it’s the let’s drop 3 weeks for the Christmas play, oh baking today, oh crafts morning with 50 parents. Oh yes someone is jumping on the tables, oh yes who have to change rooms 6 times a day, oh no you won’t have the same teacher as last week. What’s your name again? Get it now?

Everyone does better, ND or NT, with consistency, structure, predictability, containment. Managing the overwhelm. 101 of parenting. Schools should be not that different.

Actually, many employers (in certain jobs, obviously this wouldn't work for everything) are taking the view that as long as the work is completed by a deadline to a good standard, it really doesn't matter when or how you get it done.

The obvious answer is we suddenly isolated them all from everyone for the best part of 2 years (with a heavy dose of guilt that they'd kill their grandparents if they broke any rules) and then flung them back into full time school with basically no support for how that was going to impact on them all or the anxiety that was going to come from the transition.

Another issue is that secondary schools in particular, inspired by the dreadful Birbalsingh, are treating children like cattle and alienating parents with increasingly strict micromanagement, with increasing disregard for neurodiversity and just basic respect for children as human beings. Parents don't like it, neither do children, and I'm going to go out on a limb and say most staff don't either.

Also, as most parents now want to be "gentle", there's an attitude of "If you don't want to go to school I won't make you," which is understandable (especially considering worsening relationships between parents and schools) but doesn't always help children who are feeling anxious as avoiding the problem just tends to magnify it.

It appears that the attendance issue is more an indication that schools are (like.the NHS) broken.

Lack of investment in funding is paying its toll. Underfunded schools have been unable to employ or access the right resources for the post COVID period which has led directly to this.

On the other point about when the work gets done. I'd agree. So long as it is. My fear would be that it isn't getting done in the.large majority of cases.