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If you work in education, what do you think is causing the current attendance issues?

699 replies

NeedAnUpgrade · 15/01/2024 12:30

I’ve read quite a lot on this recently. DD1 is 10, she’s always been reluctant to go to school. She had a spate of UTIs, stomach aches, headaches etc. She’s had a bit of time off sick but we only triggered the attendance letter recently as it went below a certain threshold. DH and I have always done our best to get her into school, being reassured that she’s ‘been fine all day’ by her teachers. It all came to a head this year (yr 5) after a complete meltdown, several anxiety attacks and refusal to leave the house. She’s now on a reduced timetable at school and on the waiting list for an ASD assessment.
Academically she’s ahead but just can’t seem to cope with the school environment.

I’m just wondering what those who work in education think the issues are. Am I just a terrible parent? Although I’m not sure what else I could do. I suspect a complete lack of funding in education has had the biggest impact on schools and students. Especially those with SEN.

OP posts:
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KickHimInTheCrotch · 17/01/2024 06:33

My DD loves school and wants to learn and would never miss a day (year 8) but the behaviour issues at her so-called good secondary school are shocking. Kids fighting in the playground. Kids assaulting teachers in lessons, damaging property, openly stealing from local shops. She had a chair thrown at her in a lesson. The school has traditionally had a very good reputation locally but in the last few years that has changed. I think a lack of consistent teaching staff is an issue and parents not raising children to be decent people. If she said she'd had enough and didn't want to go I wouldn't blame her. I wouldn't want to go into an environment like that every day.

BalloonSlayer · 17/01/2024 06:35

My view is that children were constantly being told school was essential and vitally important.

Then Covid hit and it was clear it was NOT essential and vitally important. Not just the not going in but the very patchy home learning lessons that were set.

Now Covid is over children are expected to view school as essential and vitally important once more. But they are finding it difficult to revert to this former view. And so are parents I would guess.

babyproblems · 17/01/2024 06:42

Some really interesting posts on this thread. I don’t have much experience of Uk primary school but I’m surprised at pp’s saying we should have a work from home cirriculum- the problem seems to often be lack of social ability and that isn’t helped by children not mixing. Agree lockdown made school seem more optional; a bit like going to work every day. Since lockdown our quality of life (in our household) has improved ten fold; we used to both have to be out the door at 7:30am 5 days a week. Now we are both at home full time with occasional travel and I know which I prefer. But for children it doesn’t teach you the social skills that being in a group does. Obviously the lack of funding in the UK is a major major problem. hopefully after the next GE that might change..

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Clarebelle878 · 17/01/2024 06:44

Hereyoume · 15/01/2024 12:50

It's a bit difficult to sell the concept of education and career to a 15 year old who watches Mr Beast become a Billionaire by messing around on YouTube.

"Work hard my precious child, study, get top A levels, spend 4 years in Uni, come out with 40k in student debt and get a 28k a year job in the Civil Service"

"What do you mean you want to be famous on TicTok?"

"I don't care how much Piewdepie is worth, you can't get rich playing X box and making stupid comments online"

"Yes I know he did, but you cant"

That's why there's an attendance crisis.

Or maybe I'm being too cynical.

I agree with this.

I also think the huge increase in the cost of living, and housing in particular, is a significant factor. Get your £28k a year job in the civil service and spend most of your salary on a house share, scrimping the rest together for a deposit on a one bedroom flat. You can see why some kids don’t want to play if that is the prize on offer.

MigGirl · 17/01/2024 06:45

I think a lot of the problems people have already mentioned where there already before covid.

What has made things worse since, it that we lost a lot of mature teachers who where close to retirement as they suffered through covid and then said stuff it and retired even if a year or two early. So staff shortages have got worse.

Covid gave a lot of students the idea that school was optional, the rigid approach that you must be in school all the time got broken. Also even when students are at school some will pick and choose which lessons to turn upto.

We are way underfunded, in the last 5 years our department budget has been cut not increased, yet a lot of the products we buy have gone up.in cost a significant amount. This means cutting back not being able to deliver everything. I can only see that getting worse.

AnneValentine · 17/01/2024 06:45

CarAccident · 15/01/2024 12:36

parents who dont work or work from home and cant be arsed to get out of bed to take their children to school and so look for any excuse to avoid it .

As someone who works in a school that’s an awful attitude and completely biased.

Not a single one of our persistent absentees is in that situation. 90% parents working, most in professional environments who aren’t in the home and don’t realise their child is not in school.

HummusDip · 17/01/2024 06:50

I recently completed a Child Protection course. Neither of my children eat properly at school, both too anxious to use the toilet, and it’s the place they are most likely to experience bullying or physical abuse. Yet the course was all about noticing these signs from outside the school environment.

School are under resourced, and bogged down with paperwork, policies, new ‘initiatives’, poor behaviour and stressed out staff.

Segway16 · 17/01/2024 06:56

The people who don’t wfh are so obvious. We have actual jobs that cannot be done with children about. No parent is going to keep their child from school “just because they’re wfh”. They still have to actually work. The bitterness is astounding.

Macramepotholder · 17/01/2024 06:59

There has been a global issue with school attendance since covid- including in countries that have much better social welfare systems and SEN provision. So we can surmise from that that the breakdown in social contract between schools and families is one of the reasons. I actually spent the early part of my career working in education and crises and one of the maxims always was- keep the schools open. In war, natural disaster, health emergency- keep them open. Because they're such a core part of the social fabric and precisely because as some posters have pointed out, it's so difficult to claw back once you've done it.

I also grew up with a parent who worked in school attendance (they used to go round to kids houses and get them out of bed!) so have seen this over the longer term. There have always been a hard-core of families who persistently miss school. This is often due to poverty and chaotic lives- given the uptick in poverty and the continued cuts to the social welfare net, this will be more families than before. EBSA has also always existed. It's not a new phenomenon. The first line of support for this was EWOs who have been cut across the board. They could support with linking to other services, negotiate between parents and schools or for e.g. social work if needed. That's all gone and been passed onto schools to manage themselves, which removes to advocate role from outside of the school.

I was at primary in the 80s and we had standardized testing (remember Richmond tests?). But they were low stakes. The teaching my year 2 child has is boring (mega chain MAT). But she still likes going to school. We had some bloody boring teaching in the 80s too- SPMG books were coma inducing. The standards of teaching were often very poor. Behaviour at my secondary was really terrible. There were massive safeguarding issues. None of these things are new and lots are much better (I had a teacher in year 4 who would spend an hour every afternoon playing us Christian songs on his acoustic guitar- imagine the uproar now!).

We also need a schools inspectorate. Without out one you have wildly differing standards across schools and poorer kids lose out. But the way Ofsted and school interact is causing some weird behaviours in schools, and that needs to change. Some posters upthread have said how their schools are lovely vibrant places, so it's possible to do, but you have to be a brave school to go out on a limb and do it and probably not part of a big MAT.

I also have a child with ASD who, shock horror likes school. She likes the routine, the dullness, the discipline. This could change later of course. She is really very obviously autistic, but I am not sure things would have been better- in fact they would have been worse. She would have been shouted at to make eye contact, there would have been no reasonable adjustments or extra support. She might, I guess, have been left to do not much work, which probably has changed.

So it's also not universal that all kids with SEN will be refusing school or hate it. We know lots of other children with ASD who are attending and well. But when you combine a lot of these factors together, with Covid as the fuse, that's what happens. Yes, individual children will have different reasons for non attendance- but at a system level, that's why.

Annony331 · 17/01/2024 07:00

Aside from those with genuine medical issues who we arrange additional online tutoring for.

Our issues are parents who don't value education and live disorganised lives for whatever reason. Despite fines, letters and offers of help just continue to do their own thing. They don't see being out of school as an issue. Most parents do their best to get the children into school and are only off when necessary..

Magnoliasunrise · 17/01/2024 07:02

The current Education system may soon have a total reboot starting with some schools scrapping GCSE's for the September 2024 intake at Year 7. This may well spread to other schools and eventually filter down to primary schools with less onus on exams and results. It would be a far less stressful learning environment for both kids and staff but it's going to take some time.

Morningmeeting · 17/01/2024 07:05

I think there will be lots of reasons.

Inevitably, one of them is that the way we have designed our school's simply doesn’t work for a lot of children.

Our education system has narrowed to suit children who are academic, like team sports and are fairly confident and extrovert.

Children who aren’t like this struggle.

we need to widen schools to focus more on practical subjects, be less intensely academic ( the stuff my kids are expected to learn at primary level is ridiculous) , to allow for more movement and activity in learning.

We need better resourced schools, smaller schools and better trained teachers.

The focus should change in schools to helping kids find out what they love. That is what will set them up for successful jobs/careers aAnd as productive citizens.

If kids aren’t going to school it’s because they hate it and don’t see it as having any value for them. And that’s the real problem. It’s that we need to fix.

CharlieBoo · 17/01/2024 07:06

I don’t really know, two of dds friends from an outside school sport she attends don’t go to school (both 15). Both have major anxiety and refuse to go. I don’t judge, I haven’t patented a child like that, and I know it can’t be easy. It does seem to be a new ‘thing’ though and I hear of it more and more.

Giveandtaketime · 17/01/2024 07:09

There was a girl with similar issues at my sons primary school. She was also very clever. We live fairly close to a Montessori school. The child's parents looked into it & they decided to see if this type of school was more suited to her needs. It worked & their child is thriving & loves it there. Perhaps there are lessons to be learned.

SadSandwich · 17/01/2024 07:13

It was definitely covid for me and not because we had to stay at home but the fact that parents had to home school rather than be parents. It changed the nature of how households worked and we have never really got that back. I will always feel angry that we were assumed to be teachers at home even though we were scared ourselves, working from home, worried about loved ones, worried about our children’s well-being. I lost a lot of respect for the teaching profession as the assumption was that as parents we could just fill in and it didn’t matter that most of us had no training, no idea how to teach in an engaging way and didn’t understand the curriculum but it seemed like we were just dumped on to get on with it regardless. As parents the home schooling was totally distracting - and worse, badly organised. They should have let us as parents nurture and support our children, instead we had to negotiate for our children to do their schooling and it was a point of conflict and stress for our household. That is what happened.

Doctorbear · 17/01/2024 07:14

I listened to Gillian Keegan on The Rest is Politics the other day. It was utterly depressing. All she really thought about was results and league tables. There was nothing about a love of learning, creative thinking and broadening of the curriculum, just results. Sadly this is a reflection of schools. My very bright YR11 is revising for GCSE, it is about learning flashcards. She has no love of learning and doesn't seek out knowledge - as long as she can memorise her flashcards and do practice questions she'll be fine.

I think that leads in to a huge societal shift. Professions which used to be seen as desirable and/or attainable are no longer valued and respected. I would never encourage my DC to be a DR or a teacher for instance - so much stress and responsibility for not enough money to live comfortably. Academic achievement doesn't mean as much any more unless you are very top of the tree. With an increase in cost of living, all kids are seeing are parents who working their arses to scrape by. Why is that something yo aspire to when you can be a social media star who failed at everything in school but live a fantastic lifestyle.

Passingthethyme · 17/01/2024 07:17

CarAccident · 15/01/2024 12:36

parents who dont work or work from home and cant be arsed to get out of bed to take their children to school and so look for any excuse to avoid it .

This

Lightermoon · 17/01/2024 07:17

The school system is a one size fits all. For children with sen there is a lack of support and understanding. Plus most staff are not trained in sen. I have a child with asd also on a part time timetable. Primary was managable, secondary has been another level with anxiety. If staff were a fly on the wall in my house I think they would be less quick to judge. It’s not poor parenting I’ve tried everything. School doesn’t suit my child.

shockeditellyou · 17/01/2024 07:18

ftp · 17/01/2024 00:21

Definitely NOT - you sound like an involved caring parent.

If you have a polite child, DC will not be used to the lack of consideration/ manners from children who have not had to mix and share. Teachers are struggling too - trying to catch them up and teach them to behave better towards each other.

I volunteer in school, so arrive after registration time. I see a large number of reluctant late arrivals, that I did not pre-COVID.

Not that I would suggest it for you, but I have helped a parent force her child through the door, both in tears. She needs to work and cannot afford to allow him to stay home. Once in and she has left, he is fine, and trots into class like a lamb. (I used to see this when taking my 3 year old son to infants, there were 2 children who regularly played mum up.)

My y5's are a conflict of being bored by lessons for younger children (catchup), and unable to grasp what they are getting because the foundation is missing. I do my best to praise their progress, regardless of where they are, but reading help is only available in 1 out of the three classes. Reading age runs from infant to great, and they are aware of and anxious about being behind.

They are also used to 1 to 1 from parents and more attention, that they are not used to fighting for it in a class of 30. They are also not used to sitting still and working for a whole school day - this is not ADHD, just lack of practise at school routine. Home is a comfort space and school is scary.

Could you or grandparent find the time to volunteer?

I think this is the most sensible post on here!

Feralgremlin · 17/01/2024 07:26

From our experience it was additional needs not being recognised and supported, leading to school refusal. We moved to an independent specialist school (a luxury I recognise is not available for everyone) and have a different child who practically skips into school every day.

Tbh if I was struggling, being shouted at for getting things wrong, was always bottom of the class, being told off for asking for more clarification more than twice per task, was constantly overwhelmed and then being disciplined when I couldn’t contain that any more, I don’t think I would want to go to school either.

I think our education system really needs to move away from the “one size fits all” state it is currently in which seemingly only works for part of the population. How that could be achieved though I have no idea!

sashh · 17/01/2024 07:28

When I did my PGCE (secondary) we interviewed the SENCO at the primary school I spent a week at.

She said, off the record, that in her opinion the numbers of ASD / Autism started to go up when classrooms changed.

Children used to sit at desks with a teacher at the front, even at 5 years old. There were breaks and changes but mostly it was a calm regimented environment.

Now primary schools all have a uniform, children sit around desks, there are bright displays everywhere.

Then there is 'progress 8' so secondary schools are turned into GCSE factories.

A child who is an amazing artist, who loves pottery and photography and makes amazing appliqued wall hangings has to sit maths (fair enough) science, more science, a humanity and then has to chose a single artistic subject if they are lucky they might get to do a second one.

From the school / league tables point of view that child's grade 4 science is worth more than three grade 9s in art subjects.

48wheaties · 17/01/2024 07:33

Both my teen children have ASD and loved primary school. Now in secondary school they are both shool avoiders, at home. I work from home which is why it feels safe for them. School feels very unsafe: unhappy stressed teachers, locked toilets, poor behaviour from other kids, academic testing and high work volumes. Yes, they've voted with their feet and yes, I can't be arsed to get out of bed and have a mega stressful start to the day trying to get them into school. So many parents would have to quit their jobs in this situation, but I'm lucky I can wfh. I don't know where it will all end, but for now we are slowly healing so that they get to adulthood and enjoy what's left of their childhood.

Nothankyou22 · 17/01/2024 07:36

My son is autistic and loved being at home during Covid, he developed a severe health anxiety around germs and school was a danger zone, thankfully he has come out the otherside
In primary school we had a lot of school refusal because he couldn’t cope there, lack of staff and support and since starting secondary in sept I haven’t had one belly or headache complaint.
The school is mainstream but he has so many things in place to support him, if he struggles in class he works in a small group in the hub, leaving a min before the class finishes to avoid busy corridors, quiet fidget toys are welcomed, all his homework he does in the hub every tuesday, he has a pass so he can step out and run around for 5 mins, he has a colour coded mood pass so the teacher can see how he feels without the need to explain.
They’re small adjustments but have changed his school experience and that’s because they have the staff to support those with additional needs.

RainbowNinja77 · 17/01/2024 07:55

I work in special education and it sounds to me like your DD is suffering from sensory overload. If the school environment is too bright, noisy, chaotic, all of that, then she won’t be able to cope. If mainstream has her on a reduced timetable, then I would push for an EHCP. That would enable her to access a specialist setting that suits her needs. You can also ask for home tutoring. If she is bright, then make sure they are providing the education for her, even when she cannot attend.

I would like to state that you are absolutely NOT the problem. She needs you now though to fight for her. Too many mainstream settings reduce timetables and fail to meet needs. Fight for her education provision to be one she can access until you find the right setting. If she cannot handle primary, secondary is going to be awful for her. You can also take the initiative and find ASC special schools in the area - look for one that does not cater to behaviours.

FarleyHatcherEsq · 17/01/2024 07:56

@48wheaties I actually asked my GP about this. I was late into the office 2/3 mornings a week and it just wasn't going to end well. I said 'what do most parents do in my situation who have a child who will not go into school?' she said most have to give up their jobs.
So for me as a single parent with no other source of income, that would mean selling my house, moving into social accommodation, living in temporary accommodation, possibly moving both children out of school and receiving about £800 in benefits per month.
I would be utterly miserable. I need to work, it's the one thing I know I can do well. I'm not a teacher. I don't have the skills to teach my daughter. She has very specific learning needs (dyscalculia and possible adhd) she is four years behind.
We would just be at home, skint, and fed up with each other.
I wouldn't have the money for any home Ed groups, a trip to the museum or any of these other things which home edders do. I wouldn't even be able to turn the heating on.
I just fail to see why the government thinks parents are some how to blame for this. Why would we want this life?

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