How do other countries move house and avoid chains?

[Nevermindtheteacaps]

Having just, after 9 months which included several collapsed chains, sellers pulling out, buyer threatening to pull out, forays into the international banking system and countless other stresses completed on the sale of our house I am wondering:

If the UK house buying system with chains and no guarantees is the worst in the world, what do other countries do? And do they tie up buying and selling so no one is left homeless?

@MissBuffyAnneSummers I would say your experience is very rare.

So to summarize in most other countries:

1. People move less. But how? Don't you get a starter home and need to move up? Or change areas? Get divorced etc

1. You frequently own two properties and cope with a bridging loan

1. Temp rental accommodation is an option

A lot of the problem is that UK property is overpriced and seen as a key asset in terms of financial stability and retirement. And renting is more insecure. Other countries you rent at low cost, can't be turfed out by landlord, and pay money into pension rather than rent.

In lots of countries you build a whacking great house when you come of age (25 or 30 or whatever) and it's where you stay forever. Often one big house is subdivided for parents, grown up kids and other family members so multiple apartments under one roof.

In the UK housing is treated as an asset as if it was no different to baked beans or whatever, ignoring the human consequences. So people squeeze onto housing ladder in tiny house and bad area then trade your way up.

You can't say UK property is "over priced". That's what people are paying.
Property is more expensive than some places, it's true.
I've bought and sold in England ok, I couldn't be doing with the temporary rental malarkey, though.

@NoCloudsAllowed - you're right - it's "property" and an "asset" more than a home.

Certainly in the US it’s a lot more common to have very long mortgages which I think makes prices more stable.

Also renting is a shit show here so people are less likely to want to do it.

The process would be faster if you could see survey stuff before you offered.

I'm in the process of moving , we are 6 months in already .. hoping to move in Feb ..

We don't have a mortgage so the idea of renting is ridiculous to us . Paying out more money than you pay now to live in a less nice house ..mo thanks

Anyways it's been for so far . I think the key is to expect a disaster and then if it goes well you are lucky .

It's the costs involved that are so shocking in the country .. stamp duty is madness and even estate agents fees are extortionate.. I know they earn their money sometimes but others not so much !
It's costing us £50k just to move and that's without the extra costs of the house 🤦‍♀️... hopefully it's worth it !🙏🙏

A lot of the problem is that UK property is overpriced and seen as a key asset in terms of financial stability and retirement

Yes, far more productive for people to make money from their job but not where we are at.

Although I think people now to not buy as many houses as in the past; ftbs are older, much harder to move up the ladder & moving is often £££

So to summarize in most other countries:

1. People move less. But how? Don't you get a starter home and need to move up? Or change areas? Get divorced etc

Speaking for Germany, there's no such thing as a starter home. 70 percent of people are renters and happily so, due to strong tenant protections. There's rent controls and very very limited evictions. If you do buy it's regarded for life. Rarely before age 40 and often involves actually building your own house - buying the plot, getting an architect, the works.

So in other countries where you are effectively committing and paying deposits…what about a survey. If the seller produces one how do you know it’s not been doctored? If as the seller you want a full survey and it shows something untoward? You are already committed.

What happens then if the seller refuses to budge on price?

We are staring down the barrel at this! I'm kind of of coming round to the idea of renting to allow the sale of our home, but what scares me (apart from paying astronomical rents) is there's nothing in place to secure the one we are 'buying'.

in Scotland and many other countries the seller pays for the survey and searches, but has no say in what is written you can't influence it. It is a bit like medical evidence you have to give the whole picture regardless of which side is employing you as an expert witness.
obviously if you want extra surveys you pay for them before offering or very quickly afterwards get them done in cooling off period which can be upto 14 days in some places so if something shows up which fundamentally alters things you can pull out,

in many countries you don't buy a starter home you rent until you are ready to buy a family home and then you stay there.
so by not buying until maybe 5-10 years into a marriage/ relationship the risks of having to sell due to relationship break down are probably less, Also by buying later people are not buying when they change jobs every couple of years but once settled.
in many parts of Europe people just don't buy flats/ apartments they rent long term and only buy when ready for a house, hoem ownership in large cities is much less than in small towns and villages

I moved from Germany to the UK when I was 27. I only knew one person who owned a flat and that was thanks to an inheritance. I doubt I would have bought a house/flat anytime soon if we would have stayed.

My sister built their house (fairly normal to not buy from a developer but do it on your own) when she had her three children, they now live in it for over 30 years with no plans to move.

Starter homes don't really exists, you rent until you are in a position to buy long-term. And lots of people who move/get divorced first rent in a new location and buy at a later stage.

The Australian and Swedish systems look great. Bosh, and you're in!

The main problem in England, apart from chains, is that nobody talks to anyone. Whenever I've moved house I've spent hours on the phone chasing people for this and that. I had high hopes when I opted for the EA's in-house conveyancing service (all-in fee), but nope - same issue, although to be fair it was very cheap and paid for itself as the EA persuaded our buyer to up their offer by slightly more than the total of EA and conveyancing fees combined.

That's what I was coming to say. I'd expect the process from offer to entry to take about 6 weeks - maybe 8 weeks if there's some kind of problem. And in Scotland the entry date is specified in the offer - once the offer is accepted that can be changed but only if both parties agree, and even then it's usually, in my experience, only changed by a week or two, and sometimes makes the entry date sooner rather than later.

Pretty much everywhere sounds better than here.

I remember my parents dealing with this and getting stressed and argumentative (unlike them) when our house was on the market when I was a small child as far back as the late-1970s, it’s been chaotic and troublesome (in general, not always) for many years. The system really needs reform.

Why is there no push for reform? Who is benefiting financially from the status quo?

My parents bought their present house in the early 70s - the first one they'd been buying fell through, there were chain issues with the one they were selling and it was (apparently - I was a baby at the time) all such a nightmare that my father's hair started falling out with the stress.

He's now in his 80s and has a full head of hair so it was clearly the stress rather than balding!

No wonder they are still living there 50 years later!

I think it’s Spain where the buyer and seller legally agree the deal and each pays a 10% deposit held by a solicitor/notary. If one pulls out their deposit goes to the other, as compensation. Brilliant system.

Buy house, sell your own house at a later date. In between paint and move.

Oh and no pulling out last minute in the Netherlands, if you dick around and cancel too late then you have to pay 10 percent of the purchase cost for doing that.

I've owned 9 properties in the US (military, moved around a lot) in 6 states. Most recent buy was in Nov. 2023. Bridge loans are uncommon here, except in a few cases when building a custom house. Onward chains don't exist. Real estate sales are governed by state law. When you sign a contract to buy or sell, both parties agree to the terms. The contract states all the terms. The buyer puts down "earnest money," usually thousands of dollars, which they lose if they don't close the sale. There is usually an inspection period of about 10 days after the contract is signed for the buyers to get the property inspected and change the terms if there is an expensive problem, etc. Once the inspection period has passed, both parties are bound. The seller must sell and the buyer must buy on the closing date stated in the contract. If a buyer needs to sell a house before they can buy, then they must sell the house and have the money on hand at closing. Closing dates are firm, although they can slip by a day or so for unforeseen circumstances. Unless they sell their previous home in advance, which is wise, the buyers must pay both mortgages until their previous home sells. I have twice done a sale and a buy on the same date. It's doable, but stressful. Our current house was a new build. We put our old house on the market in Tennessee on March 17, had a signed contract on March 18, signed the contract to build our new house on March 21st, had movers load our belongings on April 6, drove to Florida on April 7 and moved into an apartment on a 7-month lease in Florida on April 8. Our old house closed as per the contract on April 12. Paperwork was signed electronically, which most states allow. Our new house was completed and passed all final inspections, which are done by the county building inspector where the property is located, on Nov. 2, we closed on Nov. 3 and moved in Nov. 4.

Having read some of the horror stories on here, I think the US system is better. There are no onward chains to worry about, for one thing, and contracts are only signed by serious buyers ready to perform (or lose earnest money.) Also, mortgages in the US always pay off the property in the end, so while you can periodically shop around and get a new mortgage if you can get better terms, every mortgage you get (usually either for 15 or 30 years) will pay off the property. So once you get a good interest rate you can keep it.

The buyer arranges and pays for the survey in Canada and the USA. There's no way I'd trust the sellers survey! The contract you sign here initially usually has a clause saying that the sale is agreed 'Subject to inspection'. If an issue crops up during inspection that can't be resolved, then the buyer can walk away and will get their deposit back.

We bought our current house in such a hot market that we were forced to make a Subject-free offer and didn't even get a survey! I don't recommend that, but it has worked out fine.

France: most people who are buying a house are doing so from a position of being renters, or are buying a second home. Most people who are selling are doing so from the position of having inherited a deceased relative’s property. Offers are binding and you pay a deposit to the seller so there are no chains. You generally move in some time after the sale has gone through (gives you time to modernise, decorate etc).

In Ireland it used to be common to get a bridging loan. Most houses were sold at auction, so you would bid and buy your new house using the bridging loan to pay for it, then put your old house up for auction. It was a pretty speedy system, I think the bridging loans probably had quite a high interest rate but it wouldn't have been a long loan, maybe a couple of months at most. It all went hideously wrong in 2008 when the market collapsed and some people were left with two houses both much reduced in value, one mortgage and an expensive bridging loan. Now the system is more similar to the UK, although I know a lot of people who have stayed with family for a couple of months to avoid being in a chain.

from germany I know that many people have a savings plan specifically for buying a home. like a pre-mortgage.