Are you a landlord? How do you find it?

[RainCloudsInTheSky]

We may have an opportunity to be a landlord but we are cautious about it. Does it take up much of your time? We would probably pay for the fully managed option so hoping it wouldn’t take up too much?

we’ve had a chat with estate agents and feel like we are understanding what is expected. Insurance has been recommended and I am yet to see what the cost of this may be.

would you recommend? Or wouldn’t do again? Interested in anything

I have been an accidental landlord a couple of times. My feeling is that if you want to be a decent landlord (provide nice space, undertake timely repairs, don't overcrowd etc) then there is very little if any money to be made. And pray you dont get tenants who take the piss and/or wreck the place, there are sadly lots of those about.

A lot of landlords make the mistake of thinking that if an agent gets you tenants they will be good quality. They just want to get your house rented! I vet my tenants myself and would rather wait a bit longer to find the right person than stuff just anyone in there.

Even though I do it myself I still credit check and reference them (you can buy this easily online). Then I meet them in their current property to see how they live. A letting agent wouldn't do this. I know I'm a good judge of character and tbh don't trust other people with something so important. I'd only use an agent if I lived far away from the property and physically couldn't do this.

You've been very lucky. I interview my own tenants as well. They have been people in professional jobs like working as a teacher, accountant etc. But you honestly can't predict what someone is like when they are renting. The tenants which turned out bad for me usually started off good..even for a year or so were good and then suddenly there were problems.
I have rented before and treated the places that I stayed like I would my own property but not everyone feels like that unfortunately.

I think also once covid hit some people became greedy and used it as an excuse to lie & cheat the system for money. Leaving their job pretending to be unwell, claiming benefits but also doing cash in hand jobs on the sly.

Even when I was house hunting I came across many properties with tenants refusing to leave even though their LLs wanted to sell the place. One viewing I went to even had tenants locking the doors from inside so no one could get in to view the property!

I have a flat 40 miles away from where I live. It’s fully managed and the agent is pretty good. They have vetted renters properly and I have had the same tenant for about 8 years now. If she needs something new/fixed she gets in touch with the agent. The agent emails me with some quotes and I approve it (usually). The agent handles all the certifications and the rent. If the tenant needs a new washing machine (for example) I would tend approve a decent one - not the cheapest option. All repairs etc. are done within the week unless there’s good reason why they can’t (very rare). Property is inspected once a year and a schedule of planned improvements is made if necessary (e.g. replace mouldy bath sealant might be an action).

The agent increases the rent in line with inflation though I refused to increase it during COVID.

I was a tenant myself for a long time and I like to think I’m a pretty good landlord now. I know what’s important to a tenant - safe, secure, attractive, accommodation with a responsive landlord at a fair market rent.

I know I've been lucky as no amount of vetting will guarantee good tenants. For instance some of the dirtiest people I have known are in a profession you would think would be clean (both nurses 😵‍💫)

I know what you mean...some people are honestly so nasty 🤮 I don't understand how they can live in such filth.

But then I've had ones that are the opposite. I had a family who moved in & deep cleaned the whole house (even though it had been cleaned prior) & then they even painted all the walls white. And any issue in the property, they would fix it themselves because there was a builder in the family. If only all tenants were like that...

Wow, gosh. People are so strange. I say I don't think anything would shock me these days but people continue to do so! I deal with the public in my day job and it's true that there's nowt as queer as folk!!!

I've done it twice (2 different properties) and I wouldn't do it again.

3 tenants.

1st - american lady with pets. No problems. Looked after property. Reported issues so they could get fixed. Drove me mad though asking me advice on things constantly about property and area. Overall didn't put me off being a landlord. She stayed 2 years before giving her notice.

2nd - a very polite, well spoken, well dressed young man in his twenties (I think american again, can't remember). Moved in and didn't open curtains or blinds for entire time he lived there. Nor windows. I lived close by and saw everytime I walked by with dog (It was tenement flat in Edinburgh). I got so worried about place I asked him to leave so I could sell it. In flat all floorboards had swollen up and when they dried out there were gaps between them. This was a really lovely flat - well decorated, furnished to a very high standard. No issues paying rent but I couldn't take the worry. He was only there 6 months. I think if I had left him there for years the flat would have been damaged with moisture/condensation/damp.

3rd - rented to a couple. In my opinion flat was bordering on too small for a couple but ok. Then they had baby. Boiler broke down but they did not report it. Instead stuffed up air vents in windows so flat was freezing with no air circulation. When they moved out found this out, plus broken toilet. They were there 9 months. Again think if they had been long term the place would have had damp/condensation issues.

Admin is offputting.

The worry is really offputting.

1/3 looked after place. 2/3 I would say cause a decline in property through ignorance or not caring.

I couldn't do it again and i was probably quite 'lucky' with tenants when I hear some of the horror stories.

I've had a decent experience. I rent out a 3 bed end terrace. It needed a lot of work doing to it so the first few months (before tenants were in) was expensive and it wiped out any profits for the first year or so. I did roofing work / damp proofing / new bathroom / flooring / decorating throughout / repointing the huge gable end wall / clearing the garden etc. I wasn't reliant on the income at that point so it was OK - I'd budgeted for it all. And getting all that work done at the start has made the following years pretty stress free.

Insurance and the various safety certificates you need are necessary but not that costly. I use an estate agent who found a good tenant (a family with 2 kids) to move in very quickly after going on market (they were I think the first to view it).

The same family have been in there since 2018 and they keep the place in good order. I've had a few further smaller expenses / repairs over the years but nothing huge and no major dramas at all. Its all been very hands-off for years now and the agent does a good job. After paying the mortgage, I pocket approx £350 a month from it, which has enabled me to work only part time around my young daughter, which was always my plan. I charge below market-rate as I value having good tenants.

The holy grail of tenants! 😍😂

I wouldn’t recommend it unless you’ve got the time to be involved yourself and the money to do emergency boiler replacement tomorrow.

The most hassle I’ve had was either the agents themselves or because of them. And the worst tenant I’ve ever had (who cost me £££££ to evict) was the “professional” recommended by the agent.

I always meet my tenants myself and since losing a very good tenant because the agent ignored minor repairs (I only found out when I met the tenant in the supermarket after they left) and then the expensive professional I’ve managed the property myself.

If you are going to fully managed you must still find out all your responsibilities as even if the agent cocks up it ultimately falls on you and there are a lot of very shit agents.

I have two properties. One inherited and then another in the same block bought from a shit landlord who was destroying the building. He bailed out when new social housing locally meant rent prices dropped for the rip off folks (most decent landlords weren’t affected).

Both my current tenants are waiting on social housing. One of my properties is adapted and was only meant to be let out briefly to a family friend. Since then the local housing officer has asked me to consider people each time a tenant has moved into social housing. We’ve also been through the start of the process to sell it to the council three times but each time budget cuts meant they’ve had a freeze on buying.

I could probably make more money charging higher rent and having a higher turnover of tenants but I make enough to cover costs and a bit in the bank to cover the big things when they need done. That’s enough for me as there is no mortgage.

Lots of LL’s disagree but the long term stability of a tenant on benefits isn’t something I see as a negative. More money is made locally by 6 monthly tenancies to people in short placements at the local big employer, but I wouldn’t find the work of the constant turnover worth the money.

Honestly, id suggest you sell and take advice on how to invest the capital for the best returns. Have worked in the PRS for a long time and whilst it's true that landlords now theoretically have the upper hand due to demand, there's a huge amount leaving the market, and there's plenty of reasons why.

It's a pain in the arse, frankly. And managing against mental are either shit, expensive or expensive AND shit, so you'll still have a lid of work to do, and a load of costs to bear.

I don't know the details but there are additional requirements re fire safety for example.

HMO's require licensing.

The requirements can be different in different areas. My council class two or more households as a HMO whereas the next council along it's three unrelated people.

Unfortunately a lot of the people who want to live in these houses can't afford to buy them/ or they don't want to! Plus all the expenses that owning a house entails. And all the maintenance..
I am sick of this victim mentality from some people.. no one owes you a house!!! And no one is taking away the opportunity for you to buy yourself one!!!

Yes. I am a non-dom with a UK portfolio netting me around 10k a month.
Rents are below the market rate for above-average accommodation.
I select all tennants myself and the initial period is 5 years. This is on the basis that a low rent for 5 years enables people to save for a deposit and buy after that time.
Very occasionally I will offer a tennant the option of buying the property at a fair, market rate.
I also have no problem in evicting people, who do not stick to my rules.
All properties undergo a quarterly maintenance check.
Several higher end estates agents have approached me as wanting to "manage" my portfolio. I usually let them take me out to lunch and schmooze me before relling them to b*gger off.
In the event of my death, all properties will be sold immediately (this is a clause in the tennancy contract) with the occupants having the right of first refusal, and the amount achieved by the sales will be divided equally between my surviving relatives.
All properties are owned outright, so no mortgages involved, makes thing a lot cleaner.
I visit each place personally once a year and that trip culminates in a drinks' reception for all tennants.

I moved overseas so rented my house to two colleagues at much below market price because I wanted good tenants and trusted them, and I left much of the contents. Now 5 years later I could probably get double the rent on the market but don't want the hassle of finding an agent to manage the property, and would have to remove all the contents. They contact me if there's a problem and I find a trader to fix the issue. I have a good plumber who knows us well so I trust him with any issues too. You have to keep up to date with legislation about electric checks, landlord licenses etc. Insurance keeps going up despite no claims.
I'm not making much money from it but too lazy to try and get (unknown) market rate tenants and no plans to sell as it's in London so will keep increasing in value.

I was a landlord for a few years after we moved overseas. First tenants weren't great and left a bit of a mess, but not too bad. Second tenants were wonderful but they moved on and bought their own house. I sold it then. I didn't really make any money off it, and found it a constant financial stress, even with the lovely tenants. I wouldn't do it again, despite an OK experience.

I was an accidental landlord (moved in with partner so rented mine out until decided if move was permanent which it is lol!) And honestly I would just sell it and invest the money somewhere that will give you a bit of monthly income - way less hassle! Like PP have said, theres more work/admin involved that you would expect even with a fully managed option, and unless you a) dont rely on the income or b) dont care about the property then I feel like its more hassle than its worth 😬😅 And I had relatively straightforward tenants (some payment issues though... so definitely get rent cover as part of insurance if you do go ahead!)

I have been a landlord for 12 years, of a nice flat in a nice area of London, have consistently made a profit, yet would not recommend it to anyone.

I have managed it myself, and in recent years had it fully managed. And when things are fine and there's no problems, it's easy money. When things go wrong (leaks, damage, tenants not paying rent) it can be immensely stressful and is not for the faint-hearted.

Highlights have been a tenant who was earning 80k in the City not paying rent the last few months of his tenancy, stealing a new mattress I had let him buy (deducting it from his rent), leaving weed burn marks all over the carpet and not paying any energy/Council Tax bills the entire year.

Or recently, getting a call late at night from the downstairs flat that my flat was leaking into theirs. The tenants were on holiday, estate agents closed - resulting in me racing over there and mopping up water for hours, which had then damaged the newly redecorated hallway and carpet. If I hadn't been able to get in there and shut the water off, the ceiling would have come down.

It's tedious and not worth it IMO. For that reason, I'm about to list to sell. I'll invest the cash in fixed rate savings accounts instead for now - at around 5-6% interest, these will make more than the rent after all the fees.

Good luck with your decision.

That doesn’t mean expenses are free, you still pay a large percentage of them

we are. I was in a fixed period of mortgage when I moved in with DH and got a consent to let. It's really not v profitable now with a mortgage though without one you should be ok.
Insurance costs us about 200 a year.
Maintenance comes in waving but looking like a new roof that's coming in between 6 and 8 k 😳

We’ve probably been lucky, but it’s worked out very well. Just one property, not initially bought for renting out but circs. changed. It was a hellhole you’d hardly put a dog in - we spent a lot doing it up to a good standard that we’d be happy with ourselves. We’ve always had good tenants who’ve usually stayed a long time, and have always kept the rent fairly low for the area/type of property - at the moment it’s decidedly low but again we have good tenants and won’t be raising it any time soon.

We used to use a letting agent but eventually sacked them for incompetence, though they were OK for the first few years.
For the first 9 or 10 years we didn’t have even one void day. If one tenant (for several years two singles) left, a friend would move straight in.

We attend to any maintenance issues asap. Most years there’s been very little, but biggest was a bathroom leak a few years ago which entailed a lot of work and cost us over £4k. But IMO you do need to be prepared for such things - if not, then IMO you shouldn’t be a LL in the first place.

What age/state is the property in OP? ie fairly modern or needing work?
Also how close is it to where you will be living? These will be big factors to how much cost and hassle it is for you to rent out.

Also, you will need to do a yearly self assessment tax return (if you don't already) to declare the rent you're receiving.

I have 10 rental properties I deal with, once you get up to speed and have everything right it really isn't much work.

Also personally I would rent un-furnished. You will get slightly less rent but it means you're not constantly replacing things. And with unfurnished properties you don't pay council tax for the 1st 6 months if they're empty (Scotland so might be different elsewhere)