is this a Northern thing - Saturday nights out

[EmmaGrundyForPM]

We're staying in Leeds for the weekend, visiting DS who recently moved here. Fabulous city, loads going on.

We went out for a meal last night and I was amazed at what people were (or weren't!) wearing. The women were all amazingly made up and wearing incredibly skimpy outfits. I'm not criticising, but I was amazed that they weren't frozen (no jackets). They all looked incredibly glamorous.

The cities I'm used to are Cambridge, Nottingham, Bristol and London. My dc, now in their 20s, and their friends are in jeans, t-shirts, maybe a pretty top on a Saturday night. These women looked like they were going to a cocktail party but were only going to the pub.

The men also looked a lot smarter than I'm used to - they were in shirts rather than t shirts - but not as dressed up as the women.

I've got a friend who lives in Liverpool who is always talking about her daughters taking 4 hours to get ready for a Saturday night out, but I thought that was just confined to Liverpool. However, the women in Leeds look like they have spent hours getting ready. Lots of them also had a fake tan and their nails done beautifully.

So are northern lasses much more glamorous than us scruffy southerners? And if so, why?

Yes it is a thing. I went to a wedding down south recently and you could tell the northern contingent by how glam they looked!

Yes I’ve been out in Berlin plenty.

But these are basic dress codes like no trainers, you don’t have to have small boobs for them not to be on show (I do not have small boobs)

They do, but when I was young I hated queueing for them. I'd basically only use them if it was going to be lashing down all night. Or if it was below zero and there was snow on the ground. If it was just normal cold, I took an old scruffy cardi so didn't mind if it got lost or wrecked.

I'm a londoner living in the North for a decade and this has been my experience. In London you head out after work but here people won't go out without a 2 hour min trip home first to get ready. I don't think it's confined to nights out, my friends and colleagues here prioritise appearance with regular beautician visits and aesthetics whereas none of my London group do that. It makes me feel very out of place but I much prefer the London way so generally I steer clear of going out lol

Exactly same age and area as you re London! Racers were casual yes. Then post rave and clubbing years it was very glam with tiny dresses, big hair, makeup etc!

I agree with your timeline too re 2005!

However post 2010 especially eg in Brentwood etc (Sugar Hut etc) it was still very glam!

Last time I was out in Leeds (visiting) was approx 2019 Christmas time and yes very glam with heels, hair etc.

I'm a southerner and rarely go out in the evenings now but I must admit on the occasions I do I sometimes wish I could get all dressed up and not have people thinking I'm trying too hard!

also, funny that you’ve post this as a Southerner because I’ve often heard women from the South associated with mini skirts and white stilletto heels for a night out. Not that I’d give a shit what anyone wears, as long as they’re comfortable!

I don't think it's sexism or conforming to the patriarch to get dressed up for a night out. I think women dress to impress other women and themselves, not for men. It's why influencers are so popular and back in my day magazines. That's why people follow fashion and like trends, we want to be seen looking current and trendy.

I'm from Manchester and was lucky enough to have friends in Leeds, Liverpool and Sheffield back in the day. All cities were similar and everyone got dressed up. Yes there were the Indi and goths but they went to venues where everyone had that look. Mainstream pubs and clubs were all similar, very dressed up.

Getting ready was part of the night, friends round, a few drinks, so much fun getting ready. I'm 50 now and have recently had a few nights out with friends, we all got ready together, chatting about hair, makeup, where everyones outfit was from. it was lovely and just like old times, minus the skimpy dresses and heels. We all wore coats, sensible shoes and it was more LK Bennet than new look.

Going out in a jumper and jeans is really drab, it doesn't make you superior at all.
A night out is very different to your local pub.

People’s concept of glam differs - I see that as cheap and provincial.

@CinnamonJellyBeans

Northern people are WAY more friendly and sociable than Southerners. They'll talk to and dance with anyone who looks friendly. It's a much better quality of night out. If you're meeting new people, it's worth glamming up for.

This is a bit of a stereotype, no? I think people in London have a reputation for generally being more reserved than the average person in the north but I think this is overdone and I wouldn't say that's a straightforward north/south thing. You get plenty of friendly and approachable southerners anywhere, just as you get surly people in the north.

Also it's not necessarily a "better quality of night out". Not everyone wants to chat with Uncle Tom Cobley and All on a night out. If I go out with mates (which happens quite rarely these days), I want to talk to them/hang out with them, not be chatted up by randoms or have dull, shouted conversations with other groups of people about where they've come from. I don't find those sorts of interactions especially life enhancing.

Those are shit lyrics. Cliched rubbish.

Essex are still representing for the glamorous South, aren’t they? Or have I just been watching too much TOWIE?

I stopped off for lunch on a Sunday in a pub in Brentwood earlier this year en route from somewhere back to London, and it was lip filler and hair extension central.

As a northerner I recognise this, but I don't think it's all northern cities. I did an undergrad in Manchester, and a postgrad in Leeds. Leeds was definitely more glam. Some friends were in Sheffield, that was more similar to Manchester than Leeds. It's interesting to ponder just why it's different in different places. I'm not sure I buy the Northern working class Vs southern monied theory, or all northern once industrial cities would be similar, surely?

Not necessarily! As someone else including me said you can add:-

• Bromley
• Beckenham
• Bexleyheath

Add Croydon and Old Kent Road maybe.

What a load of classist, northern bashing bullshit. Some people enjoy getting dressed up! It doesn’t make you any more superior or comfortable with yourself just because you don’t ffs. God this place is turning into mansnet 🤣

People turned away in Berlin for wearing makeup? That would surprise me. Very booby stuff, in certain locations, I can believe.

Berlin's very 'anything goes'. People don't judge, not really. But it's a very casual and, dare I say it, practical place. If someone's made a particular effort to look a certain way it's more likely to be an 'alternative' look of some kind than a 'glam' one.

Now you’re just sounding bitchy!

Its amazing how quickly a thread like this descends into name calling and being nasty!

I know a few east end/Essex girls who’d definitely give northerners a run for their money in the wedding/christening glam stones too!

You’ll find this in Newcastle, Leeds, Sheffield, Liverpool, Manchester and many smaller towns. Part of the honour code of Northern hardiness that you are tough enough to head out in your full glamour but without a coat no matter what the weather.

I think it’s way too simplistic to say it’s a class/money thing. So I don’t think it’s snobbery to point it out. I find it interesting really - no judgement!

In this book he suggests it's to do with the long commmutes in the South so straight out after work, no time to go home and get glammed up. Also travelling by bus, tube or bike makes it impractical to wear a tiny dress and heels. I am a born and bred Londoner and would only wear a dress make up and heels for something like an anniversary dinner or a wedding.

I mean stakes not stones!

There's also a definite culture clash between London proper and the South East.

People who grew up in and live in actual London would be unlikely to go out with the "suited and booted" style. As others have said Essex, Kent (Medway Towns) and bits of the SE London suburbs (Croydon, Bexley, Bromley) people would dress in a more "northern" way.

If you walk into the average pub in Essex on a Saturday night I would think it would be much more "northern" (high heels, fake tan, fake eyelashes) than a pub in central Manchester these days.

It's cultural (and class) more than it is to do with geographical location I think.

DD1 lives in Liverpool, finished Uni recently but loves the city. Despite growing up in a hot climate in Latin America she now never uses a coat when she goes out. Loves dressing up for nights out there.

Yes! We all do it hahaha. Could be -10 and we’d have our dresses and heels with no coat 🤣

You may be thinking more of heavy industry areas where there were fewer opportunities for women to work eg Yorks, Derby, Notts minefields, Sheffield Steel Works etc ?
I grew up in the East Midlands, where large numbers of working class women worked as sewing machinists in the clothing industry. If you were fast & accurate, it was well paid work. Major retailers had their merchandise made by suppliers in Derbyshire, Nottinghamshire & Leicestershire. The British hosiery industry, which then synonymous with M&S, was mainly based in Leicester. I remember seeing pages of job adverts in the local paper for ‘overlockers’ ‘lockstitchers’ etc. Everyone knew many households in which the husband worked as a miner and the wife as a machinist.