Query about making a flexi working request

[Countingsheep23]

Id be grateful for help/comments/experience as I make a flexi working request to my employer.

I work in an industry which is flexible and known for being family friendly but my employer more generally and section isn’t typically flexible which is disappointing.

i basically just want to go back for 3 days a week because I love being with my baby but also I want to minimise the horrific childcare bill we’ll have. We’re in a position where this is possible. We don’t have any family childcare so will rely on nursery.

i understand 3 days may not be possible for them to approve and the role won’t lend itself easily to a job share so was wondering how complicated and specific a request can be…

for example can you do X number of hours and do 3 days one week and 4 another. Can someone help me run through how that could put forward in a straight forward way and be possible? I’ll have to certainly try to keep as many of the 37 hours as possible as dropping hours won’t be particularly well received. I was thinking maybe some sort of annualised approach where I did the hours over a 2 week period.

im sure I have read how just because someone is a manager and senior a request cannot be rejected on those grounds but I feel this will be the reason I get just cloaked up in one of the 8 reasons.

my plan for the additional day would be a mixture of dh doing the odd one using his flexibility and also buying additional nursery days. Ideally nurseries would do a half day but they don’t offer a half day.

if this isn’t possible at all I guess 4 days would be fine but I feel gutted at him having to do 10 hours a day in nursery on more days than necessary because my employer isn’t flexible

i have been asked to send in my thoughts to my boss before a request is made so it can be considered. I have felt quite vulnerable in my job while off on mat leave for a number of reasons so feel quite out of my depth and anxious about it all

i know to contact pregnant then screwed but would love to talk it through here before I get advice from them when I’m hopefully clearer

Bump 😟

I don’t have any great suggestions but wanted to reply.

When are you due back?

I don't have a direct answer but I have colleagues and friends who work full time but compressed hours, so they do a nine day fortnight for example. That might work for you - you could suggest working four days over three?

I also wouldn’t offer 3 days one week and four the next. They will be used to you being around 4 days and send you work on your “every other week”. Plus if nursery fills the space or DH can’t get time off, you will end up stuck.

I agree 3 one week 4 another wouldn't be approved where I work, I know people who work 5 days over 4 but my concern for you is saying how your job couldn't be done on a job share so how can you get your work done in 3 days?

Thanks so much everyone.

I’ll be due back mid feb but I’ll have a bit of leave to take.

I don’t think my role couldn’t be done on a job share just it’s unlikely. My role is leading a small team and so a mixture of overseeing a team and also doing some of the work we do therefore I do the same tasks as others just sometimes to a different complexity (or not!). I’d assumed with the line management sharing a job would not really work.

I don’t want to work full time is partly my issue. Bluntly I’m not our breadwinner and won’t be so I’m wanting to ease off work wise to help our household balance work and life and with our nursery fees being £72 a day with all the outsourcing I’d want to do to manage full time it wouldn’t be viable. I feel - naively - I can try for some better work life balance for our unit if I have days free of work. I fully know there’s not one way to have it all though. The downside of modern life I guess!

it’s interesting you say a different pattern of days wouldn’t be approved. I know it’s more ‘complicated’ but I’d sort of been thinking it could be easier and easy for all once implemented. It would give more visibility to me in terms of my output in hours than me doing the shorter week and it’s just a 9 days in a fortnight but with a less than full time total of hours.

I have given it more thought and was wondering if a slight reduction in hours could work - i could put a case to where some work would go. So a drop from 37 to 31 or 32 and then drag those over 2 weeks so we had nursery 3 days and 4 days alternative weeks. I can’t pay for half days at nurseries and I’m desperate for more time with my baby and a smaller nursery bill… aren’t we all ha! Are there glaring issues with this? I’m really asking for less than someone who just drops one day a week and from my ropey maths it’s 8.5 or 9 hour days which I could work with childcare etc.

I see that for those emergency issues which occur if on my day off it’d fall to someone else in the team but if my days are consecutive and not Monday and Friday then I’ll never be more than a working day away. We have a deadline driven workload so it’d be possible to build into my calendar and planned work all allocated work of that nature.

Hi Op, my organisation would grant a request of 3 days one week and 4 on the second week.

I think the key is to state a case on how your employer would not lose out and how you could still be effective in your job. How would the department function in your absence?

You need to show your employer that you've considered the impact of dropping hours on your work and colleagues.

Are there quieter periods where your absence wouldn't have so much impact?
Are their elements of your job that can easily be reassigned?
Think about how they have managed during your Mat leave.

my role has been covered during my maternity by someone in my team who’s a grade below so one of the more senior team members. I understand they’ve done really well and so would return to their post with a breadth of experience they previously didn’t have.

yes there are quieter periods and then busier times. As is the norm everywhere we are sorely understaff and resourced though so we never really have a quiet time where it’s full on quiet.

I believe that the hours I drop could be the work I do which can be feasibly given to those in the grade below me as it’s not essential to me in my post for the skill or seniority. Due to performance issues in the team there is some scope for shuffling work amongst all to improve efficiency regardless of me making a flexi working request.

in terms of functioning in my absence when the team need their manager I suppose they go to my line manager or the issue waits. I’m not sure how to answer that or explain it in the request. Ultimately it’d have to wait I suppose or if urgent be flagged…. Isn’t this just like if I’d take a days holiday though

on mentioning it to my
boss they asked me to informally put forward what I want. Is this a normal approach?
id have thought it best to put in my formally written request showing I’d considered xyz and addressed issues hence asking for what I want. If I just ping off an email asking for it without outlining all the reasons and doing it formally am I not being put into a position where it’s easy for them to say no when I’ll still want to formally ask for it anyway so I could start my appeal process?

I went back to work on a 2 day/3day alternating week. I discussed it with my manager first outlining what I wanted and why before submitting a formal request. My manager was happy to support my request which meant she backed me with HR, we had already discussed work allocation etc so she could show how it would work. Emailing or discussing informally doesn’t mean you can’t submit a more formal request.

I think the pattern of three days/four days is very risky re childcare on the week with four days. Our nursery wouldn't offer this - I did ask! They said they wouldn't be able to fill the space on alternate weeks so we'd have to pay for four days every week, regardless of whether we used the space or not. Even if you're talking about booking ad hoc on a Friday (because they tend to be less busy nursery days), what if one week they couldn't take your child, and your DH can't take a day off, and you have a big meeting? What's your plan then?

I'd be inclined to go in asking for a 3-day compressed week (e.g. 10hr days) and show how you'd make it work for them (I think in my last request I said things like time to decompress and achieve a better balance to enable me to give my full focus to work on the days I was in therefore being more productive etc) and make sure that you have a plan for when DC is sick so you're not the one off every time.

I've also dealt with this from a managerial perspective, and from that I'd suggest initially asking for an informal meeting to discuss your ideas rather than emailing and putting them in writing. Once you've sounded out the likely response to your proposal, it might help with how you phrase your request.

Agree with a discussion at first rather than an
email

Where I work, there is a woman who does the 4/3 day week rotation, and its been fine. Sure some weeks people might forget, but she does what she can to remind people inc info in email footer to make people aware. Any mistakes people make about your availability are on them, and they need to roll with the reality of what's possible

I've compressed my week into 4 days working a bit longer and 9-12 on Friday and people forget too, despite it being regular each week! I wanted 4 normal days & pay cut, its just a transition. I just say "soz, don't work Fri afternoon" to any request that doesn't work for me. I mention every time it feels relevant, to help with awareness. Its just a case of asserting myself whenever a mistake is made. No difference compared the woman in the example above

If you get a no, ask why as they need legit reason to deny and get an independent view on it. If its a solvable issue, bring it up regularly and say you still want it. Also look elsewhere for a job that'll hire you on your preferred terms. Part of the stubbornness sometimes can be arrogance, similar to how you often get better a pay rise moving on compared to asking the current employer. Be up front about your expectations from the start, and don't be afraid to apply for full-time roles and enquire about tweaking the terms. Only so much they can put on job ads, maybe they just couldn't squeeze it in or just haven't thought about it. Prompt them to think, and take a position on it. Sorry if that sounds bossy, just trying to encourage you be adventurous and cheeky as possible to get what you're after

Your role sounds similar to mine - I'm going back 0.7 which is 3 1/2 days compressed into 3 slightly longer days, so I only have to pay nursery for three but still get 70% of full time salary

I think having time off work has meant I’ve lost some assertiveness around work and I feel quite nervous about this. I suppose because it involves my baby. What a bag of emotions.

thanks so much for all your help and comments. When you mention how you’d consider it from a managerial perspective it seems only natural and what I’d suggest and I have lost sight of that.

I need to know for definite that the nursery can accept the alternative week pattern. If they can’t I’ll be back to the drawing board. I’m aware I may need a new job. There are some factors that make a new job appealing but also I have worked bloody hard to get my job and would feel pushed out due to being a mum in all honesty which is a shit feeling.

in terms of planning for covering child sickness this is something my boss has already mentioned. I hope we get to a 50:50 split of this if not more on dh. I see from his career how the stereotype of man having child flourishes at work so it’s his turn after mat leave.

I’ll have to prepare for this informal conversation and have notes etc so I make a clear case and show I’ve properly considered it from my own side and also theirs. Does it make a difference if the informal chat is an email rather than phone call? If I end up having to email informally I assume a few paragraphs help to put a case forward?