Sensory diet in secondary school. Teachers, please can you help?

[TowelTopia]

DD12 (Year 8) is waiting for an asd assessment. She has been prescribed a ‘sensory diet’ for school which has to be done in one ten minute and one twenty minute block, every day. She will need someone to help her with this at school.

I asked my teacher friend and she laughed telling me teachers barely have time for a tea break and DD has no chance of getting this support.

Can any teachers help whether I should ask the school to do this or is it too much?

It’s a normal bog standard secondary school.

TIA

In my experience some of the professionals like OTs make these suggestions without consideration of the actual practicalities in the school.

ideally if the OT believes a program needs to be implemented at school they should go into school and help put things in place.

A program on short sensory breaks throughout the day which she can do herself may be more realistic and also give her the independence more.

It's highly unlikely but if you have a good school they might. My ds has a ehcp and 24 hours of funded support yet his 1:1 is often utilised else where despite it being a legal requirement to follow ehcp. The issue is lack of funding overall.

I don't know if it's different in different areas but under our local authority there's no class TA past year 2.

Does your dc want to do this? Does it seem to help?

If section F of the ehcp is clear that it should be 24 hours 1-1 then you need to complain to the LA if what is in the plan isn’t being provided.

sadly they are often written in such a way which makes them hard to enforce.

Good luck trying to get a EHCP but realistically I don’t think you will get it for the issues you have mentioned. My son got his EHCP when we applied for primary. They take ages and everyone needs to be cooperative.

I also don’t think you are likely to get someone to do it everyday at lunch without one though.

https://www.ipsea.org.uk/asking-for-an-ehc-needs-assessment this is a good source of information about applying for a needs assessment.

Once term starts speak to the school, it really depends. Even if they have space and a member of staff who can facilitate this everyday it's very unlikely they'll have the equipment or the space or funds to- you do have more chance with an EHCP but its not easy to get one unfortunately even when it's needed. There is indeed a chasm between what a school should be doing and what they actually can, it's the fault of the government and woeful funding. Its worth connecting the school and the OT if they push back.

@Sirzy thank you, I know it's really difficult to prove and my son struggles with communication. On the times I've seen it it's always "there was an emergency Mrs T had to run for first aid " etc but I've seen proof every time I'm in school. I'm giving it one more term there's other issues too) then I'm going to look to change schools if there's no improvement.

Did you read what wrote about EHCP not being awarded even for those with really very severe needs?

My Ds has an EHCP, he spent the majority of his school life in mainstream education without support or a diagnosis (he's now in specialist). He has 10 Gcses including 5 grade 9's. He would be considered higher functioning but still has some complex needs, hence his funded place at an independent specialist school. Academic ability or a so called higher functioning presentation does not mean an EHCP won't be given.

Nobody has said this yet (I don’t think), but in my experience (I’m a primary school teacher) mainstream sensory support is very poor, even in primary schools where it’s common. Generally a very well intentioned TA is given ‘training’, which amounts to a couple of hours discussion at most, and a folder. It ends up as a few fairly pointless exercises that have no real purpose other than ticking a box. It is also the first thing to go when other issues arise.

I just want to add that nearly every school I’ve ever worked in is deeply committed to supporting children’s needs. There is just a lack of expertise, that can’t be simply overcome. It needs experts, time and money. All of which are in short supply.

OP, I think it would be reasonable to got back to the OT and ask them to adapt the sensory circuit so it can be done independently by your DD (replace deep pressure applied by an adult with wall presses etc) and without too much equipment (just things like theraband that could be kept in a bag/locker).

That way you are only asking for your DD to be given some time and maybe some supervision for the first couple of times. It would also mean she could do it when she needs it instead of when an adult is scheduled.

Have I missed what specialist equipment is actually required? If it is a limited one off purchase such as some stretchy bands, gym ball, weighted roller etc, followed by the 2.5 hours per week and nothing else, there wouldn’t be a need for the EHCP, unless you want the legal force behind it. The reason I say that you are unlikely to get one for 2.5 hours is because really it shouldn’t be needed. As mentioned previously, the LA will take the view that they have already funded this support and therefore an EHCP will be necessary if this support does not enable progression in the way they would like.

I would be interested to know if the therapist has been into the school to see how the needs present in that situation and adjusted accordingly. They should also provide training to staff and then visit school to check on progress.

To those saying email during the holidays, most SENCOs are ‘on call’ as such, but for placement consultations and responses to EHCPs that have already been submitted. By all means email, but do not be disheartened if there is no response as they may be limiting contact for the legal duties only.

Also, please save some of the anger and vitriol on this thread for the election booth. We are broken and trying to operate an unsustainable system. There is some fantastic work going on and many, many dedicated professionals trying to improve outcomes. Please don’t tar us all with a sweeping brush - including the SENCO at this school whom has yet to be asked what their capacity is.

That’s across the board. In a lot of areas NHS OTs aren’t contracted to do sensory at all sadly.

I have fallen lucky with DS that his OTs over the years have managed to link sensory into the reason we were referred to kill two birds with one stone.

Teacher here and form.tutor. in my experience whilst a form tutor might want to help,realistically they probably will not be able to as most the time they are teaching. That will take priority. There may be a possibility with a teaching assistant etc. I would e mail the school during the holidays FAO Senco. There is usually a general e mail address Your e mail can then be passed onto the relevant party

This is exactly what happens in my school for the children who need sensory input/sensory circuits. They complete them when needed (not at a prescribed time), with "equipment" that already exists around school (like a wall), andindependently (though initially with supervision to ensure they are doing them roughly "properly"). Some of the children have EHCPs, some don't. One of the SEND team has had a little training.

Sensory circuits that required a set time to be completed would be more of an issue because the child would then be missing the same parts of the curriculum each week and who would catch them up and how? Lunch is too short to do anything but eat in most secondaries. Anything that required equipment to be stored and fetched would also be problematic as there is simply no space and no spare adults to get it out and put away.

Please do email the SENDCo but don't expect they can reply over their holiday. They may or may not be on SLT and may or may not be monitoring their email.

This, and so many more of YarisKaris’s posts.

OP, don’t be put off by people telling you DD doesn’t need or won’t get an EHCP. Sadly, many people, schools, SENDIASS, and LAs’ do incorrectly tell parents their DC doesn’t need or won’t get an EHCP, but the parents go on to successfully apply themselves, although they sometimes need to appeal. As has already been posted, the initial threshold for an EHCNA is relatively low.

With an EHCP, if it is correctly written (and if it isn’t parents should appeal), DC must receive the provision and it can be enforced if necessary.

But if the school are willing to put the support in place, why would she need an EHCP? Why not wait and talk to the SENCO first?

Because, without an EHCP, it is unlikely such provision, with appropriately trained and experienced TAs, will be delivered twice every day in a secondary MS. It is also possible OP’s DD need other SEP, which a NA can highlight.

Well yes, if there are other additional needs that have not been addressed using APDR or are as yet unseen / undiagnosed then that could require additional support and a NA is necessary.

However, without knowing what the report and advice actually states, us strangers on the internet have no idea whether the school can put this into place or not. We don’t have any idea what the expertise on the staff is and have no idea on their capacity. We don’t actually know that it needs specialist training (and if it does, the OT should provide it). Hence the advice to talk to the SENCO first.

I work in a secondary mainstream school and I'd be surprised if your DD's school can accommodate this. This is not to say that your DD doesn't need it, or that school wouldn't want to do it, or that the OT shouldn't have 'prescribed it'.

There's a lot of expectations of what schools should and shouldn't do, when the reality is that the main business of a school is education, and even budgets for that are dwindling.

I also don't mean to say that OT and other therapies shouldn't happen in school. It makes sense that they do. However, the reality is that there's no budget to build in the appropriate spaces that are necessary for this, equipment, and appropriately trained and paid TAs that are available for 1 to 1 support, as most spend a lot of their time supervising large numbers of children, and focusing on behaviour, crowd control, or on 1 to 1 support with kids who do have a EHCP, which are very very few.

I agree with previous posters that it's very unlikely that your DD will get an EHCP on this basis. The very few students that have an EHCP in the school where I'm at have extremely complex backgrounds, diagnosis and needs.

Even if your school agree to this, how can you be sure that the person allocated to carry this out is even trained on neurodiversity, sensory challenges, etc., and that won't do more harm than good?

This is similar to GPs telling parents that their kids' mental health problems will be supported at school, and then school will appoint a wellbeing officer who has no mental health training and is probably doing that job because it's term time only (absolutely nothing wrong with that), and there's a student with serious psychological distress being supported by some random who will likely try their best but feel overwhelmed at the enormity of what they're taken on, be wholly unsupported, and likely not to make an impact, which is a better outcome than the possibility of making a negative impact, which is the risk when untrained people are appointed to provide such supports.

Obviously no-one here knows what is in the report. For a start, OP says the OT is going to write a report, so it isn’t even written yet.

Posters suggesting an EHCNA are doing so based on the OP’s posts and their knowledge of SEN law. It is unlikely the provision twice every day can be undertaken by a TA with experience and training (which we do know is needed. The OP posted she has been told that, presumably by the OT) without a EHCP. Schools are struggling to provide statutory provision, an EHCP is the only way to guarantee the SEP.

Those with experience of the SEN system/law are also recommending it because they know it is also likely an EHCNA is required to fully understand DD’s needs and possibly other SEP is necessary too e.g. ongoing direct SIOT &/or maybe SALT given the OP’s DD is awaiting an ASD assessment.

I have plenty of SEN experience and knowledge of both practice and law, thanks. Not suggesting an EHCNA does not mean that I’m without.

All I’m advising is that the OP waits and talks to the SENCO, who is the only person who can state whether this provision can be in place.

Well your posts certainly come across as though you lack knowledge of SEN law and the system.

@OvertakenByLego and @StockardAwkward

The health therapist did say that she would write in her statement that the person who helps DD will need training and that they will be happy to do it . She said it needs to be done properly by a properly trained person

I NEED a new knee according to my GP and consultant. It’ll be around 4 years before I get one though.