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Original poster

Benefit fraud consequences

25 replies

Friarclose · 30/07/2023 07:22

I'm going to be a bit vague here but if anyone could tell me what the likely consequence will be, I'd be really grateful.

Someone I know, let's call them A, inherited a large sum, £77,000, in 2021. A doesn't work, never really has. Doesn't give a real reason for not wanting to work, just doesn't want to.

A lived rent and bill free with the person who died and left them the inheritance. After that person died, A moved into rented accommodation, using their inheritance to pay for rent and bills.

A was claiming Universal Credit prior to the death of the person who left them inheritance, and decided to continue claiming even with 77k in their bank account. They also put in an additional claim for Council Tax benefit.

2.5 years later, A still isn't working. They are down to their last 12k. They have now very stupidly put in a application for housing benefit. Of course, they have been asked how they have been paying their rent for the last 2 years, and now have to have an interview and be explored for possible benefit fraud.

They have no previous criminal record.

Does anyone know what might happen to them?

OP posts:
TwilightSkies · 30/07/2023 07:25

You can’t get Housing Benefit if you are on Universal Credit. Strange that they applied for it, rather than the Housing Element of UC.

But anyway, they will be investigated and then have to pay it all back.

Beezknees · 30/07/2023 09:12

This story seems odd. You can't just decide not to work and claim UC for years. It's not possible. If they are fit and well, and have no dependent children, UC will make them look for work. And if they were living with someone who had £77k in the bank, they would not have been able to claim UC, as they take into consideration the whole household income.

Polik · 30/07/2023 09:16

Do they have children? On what basis are they getting UC?

Interested in this thread?

Then you might like threads about this subject:

Benefits
daisychaindays · 30/07/2023 09:29

Yeah the OP's post doesn't make sense as UC / DWP have access to the applicants bank accounts so they can see what savings they have. This posts reads like it's intended to stir up feelings against people who receive benefits.

Beezknees · 30/07/2023 09:33

daisychaindays · 30/07/2023 09:29

Yeah the OP's post doesn't make sense as UC / DWP have access to the applicants bank accounts so they can see what savings they have. This posts reads like it's intended to stir up feelings against people who receive benefits.

That's not necessarily true. I have received UC for years (lone parent) and they do not have access to my bank account. But it's true that you can't just claim willy nilly because you "don't want to work." I was made redundant recently and as a fit healthy adult with an older child (15yo) I was required to look for a minumum of 35 hours a week of work. I had had to visit the jobcentre weekly and upload all of my job applications to my account.

daisychaindays · 30/07/2023 09:35

@Beezknees i think they do in order to confirm you meet the criteria? and also to adjust pay out if you work for example for a short period but still require top up

Beezknees · 30/07/2023 09:36

daisychaindays · 30/07/2023 09:35

@Beezknees i think they do in order to confirm you meet the criteria? and also to adjust pay out if you work for example for a short period but still require top up

No, they don't have access to your bank account unless it's specifically requested. They get information about your earnings from HMRC and wage slips, not bank account.

Noizettely · 30/07/2023 09:36

Jain with hard labour. 37 years.

ArcticSkewer · 30/07/2023 09:41

If you want to help them you probably need to get all the facts.

Why would they have applied for Housing Benefit rather than the housing element of universal credit?

Why did they apply for it now and not before?

Why have they been claiming universal credit and not working? Are you sure it's not, for example, ESA and they are in the category or people who are not able to work?

In other words, your story seems unlikely as is presented here, so what advice can we offer?

HappyJoyousFree · 30/07/2023 10:23

Don't you need to submit bank details etc when claiming benefits so you can evidence you don't have money sat there? If so presumably they've deliberately hidden this money to be able to claim benefits.

I think the longer a fraudulent claim goes on for the greater the consequences as the more money is defrauded from public purse. It could be anything from a fine to a jail sentence. It might stand A in a better position if they just be honest in the interview and don't try make excuses why they believed they didn't need to declare the money and go in with a reasonable plan to pay any overpayment back. It wouldn't hurt to start paying back before the interview although I don't know how that would work or how you would do it.

HumourReplacementTherapy · 30/07/2023 10:48

How much in UC have they had since they inherited £77k?
Depends how much in benefit theyve had if DWP take them to court with the aim of a custodial sentence.

Original poster
Friarclose · 30/07/2023 13:08

I'm not trying to stir anything up!

A has been fobbing off the job centre for a long time. They do a few days of work here and there (they took courses to be a security guard) but literally a few days in the whole year.

OP posts:
Original poster
Friarclose · 30/07/2023 13:08

They've been claiming around £70 a week since the inheritance.

They don't have children

OP posts:
Original poster
Friarclose · 30/07/2023 13:10

And no one has ever looked into their financial status, it's only now since they finally smell a rat that they are asking for financials

OP posts:
drpet49 · 30/07/2023 13:11

Hopefully jail or at least a criminal record at the very least. Fed up of benefit cheats.

Beezknees · 30/07/2023 13:12

Friarclose · 30/07/2023 13:08

I'm not trying to stir anything up!

A has been fobbing off the job centre for a long time. They do a few days of work here and there (they took courses to be a security guard) but literally a few days in the whole year.

You can't "fob them off". You are required to attend weekly, if you don't, you get sanctioned and they stop your money.

Original poster
Friarclose · 30/07/2023 13:13

He does attend weekly. I honestly do t know how he gets away with it

OP posts:
Beezknees · 30/07/2023 13:13

And if you are claiming for over 6 months you get put into an intense "back to work" focused group.

ArcticSkewer · 30/07/2023 13:26

so assuming all other parts of your story are real, and this person has been regularly attending all their intense back to work focus group appointments etc

It doesn't sound like they attempted to defraud by claiming the housing element of uc - why was that? They waited til their savings were low first.

I'd suggest you try and find out why that was. Maybe they just didn't quite understand and thought they were supposed to live on their inheritance but their existing UC claim was exempt.

Consequences are probably just having to repay the money claimed since they received the inheritance (which is not the time the relative died). The dwp might prosecute but if it's a misunderstanding and they own up quickly why would they bother? Most important thing is to be honest and upfront in the interview.

Biscuitandacuppa · 30/07/2023 13:31

I receive UC due to low paying job and once a year (or possibly more) I have to accept my commitments on my online account. Part of that includes informing UC of the level of savings I have. If this person has not declared their savings then I would imagine HMRC can prove fraud.

LondonQueen · 30/07/2023 13:43

I hope they get a prison sentence. Cheating the system because they don't want to work.

HumourReplacementTherapy · 30/07/2023 14:29

So they probably owe £7-8k?
I'd be offering to pay it back in a lump sum in the hope I'd not get sent to prison

OldTinHat · 30/07/2023 15:17

Beezknees · 30/07/2023 09:33

That's not necessarily true. I have received UC for years (lone parent) and they do not have access to my bank account. But it's true that you can't just claim willy nilly because you "don't want to work." I was made redundant recently and as a fit healthy adult with an older child (15yo) I was required to look for a minumum of 35 hours a week of work. I had had to visit the jobcentre weekly and upload all of my job applications to my account.

Show quote history

DWP can access your bank account whenever they like.

Beezknees · 30/07/2023 15:54

OldTinHat · 30/07/2023 15:17

DWP can access your bank account whenever they like.

Show quote history

They can but it's not done as standard just because you're claiming benefits. They do it if they suspect you of fraud and they notify you about it.

LovedFedAndNoonesDead · 31/07/2023 19:19

As soon as it is found they have had over £16,000 in their bank at any point, their claim will close, they will be liable to pay back all UC received since they inherited the money. In addition to this, they will also likely be found to have been overpaid benefits from when their capital/savings went below £16,000 until now when it has reached £12,000 so that will also have to be paid back. In addition to this, there is scope for them to be fined for not notifying them of a change in circumstances.

They will also likely be prosecuted for benefit fraud, which can lead to imprisonment, if the authorities believe they deliberately withheld the information about the inheritance knowing that would affect their claim. To be honest, it’s more probable that they will be given a suspended sentence, possibly community service, and fined than actually be sent to prison as it’s a first offence; however that’s not definite given the degree of dishonesty - they will have had opportunities to tell UC about the inheritance and, every time they were given claimant commitments, they will have agreed to tell UC about ANY change in circumstances.

If they have also received council tax support (other than single person’s discount) from the council it’s likely they will be found to have made that claim fraudulently so that would also need repaying and, given there is likely to be a prosecution for the UC fraud, the council could also add in council tax support claims to the list of ways in which the person has committed benefit fraud.

There is a show on BBC1 during the day regularly called Claimed & Shamed where they discuss cases of benefit fraud (amongst other types of fraud including bogus insurance claims, injury claims and theft from employers), showing why the person claiming wasn’t entitled to what they claimed, how they were found and and what the outcome
of the investigation was including prison sentences. You can find episodes on iPlayer if you wanted to see what sort of outcomes happen to those found guilty of benefit fraud.

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