Would we be mad to downsize

[YoBeaches]

Logically I feel we wouldn't. But the thought of leaving our current home seems bonkers.

We live in a coastal town and dd starts reception in September. There is me, DH, Dd and dog. No other children planned (I'm 44).

We have a perfect home we bought 10yrs ago. Needed gutting, we've probably invested £100k in our time part through major remodel then just ongoing work. It's. 3 bed detached, driveway for 3 vehicles, on a close, garden is 40ft x 80ft. It's a quiet close, mostly retired neighbours, couple of other families recently moved in.

I work full time in Exec role. 6 figure salary. I've worked really hard to get to that level. I go to the office 2days a week the rest wfh. It's a mentally challenging job.

Dh works full time and is away 2 nights a week. We have a great income between us and currently will pay the mortgage off in 11yrs.

But I feel more and more each day, like I'm dying a bit on the inside. My work motivates me less. I want to be with dd after school. I want more time for myself and to feel less busy and more connected. The weeks disappear into months and I feel like everything is passing by so fast

We'd always said we'd sell our home and downsize when dd leaves home/ part fund retirement etc but I'm wondering whether we should do this now. If we downsized we could stay in the same town, same lifestyle same great schools, but likely live mortgage free with a little left over. This would give me the opportunity to reduce my work or consider new opportunities, or less demanding work where I don't need to earn top whack to pay the bills.

When I say this, and write it down it sounds amazing if it were possible. But I have this fear that I might regret it, or regret leaving this home, our forever home as we thought. That it all sounds a bit mad.

For what it's worth I have been suffering some elements of stress the last 6 months. I feel like life is getting out of control and it's alll too fast.

So, what would you do? Am I having a midlife... has anyone ever done similar?

I'm reading up about this. I should probably speak to a financial adviser for these elements. And what age you can draw the lump sum from too.

I'm reading up about this. I should probably speak to a financial adviser for these elements. And what age you can draw the lump sum from too

55 but it will be 57 in a couple of years time.

What does your husband think...........

Husband would be happy to downsize. He feels we have filled the space with stuff we don't need and has a desire to live a simpler more care free life.

But he's not a money man. He values life experience over investment and would spend rather than save.. He's not good seeing the long term.

He would do whatever feels right for us as a family unit. Though he recognises the effort we put in to get to where we are and a sense of risk we can't define.

In your shoes - one child, able to buy outright and freelance, I’d do just that. We have done similar (house and job downsize, remained in our lovely area) and the peace/fulfilment trickled outwards to my family and we are all so much calmer and happier.

@YoBeaches

Have you got any holiday booked soon?

i think your brain is spinning because you're tired, it's summer & DD is starting school soon.

imo you need to STOP relax, spend some time at the beach with DD & eat some ice cream. Before you give this more thought.

once DD starts school, you'll be more limited with how much more time you can spend with her.

id make the most of being senior with some length of service to negotiate my working hours. I'd choose to pick up DD from school & spend time with her until bedtime then work a couple of hours.

work flexibly in the school holidays and flexi term time too so I could go to things at school.

personally I think you'd be mad to downsize. I'd extend the mortgage & over pay when I could. You have a beautiful, detached home, no way I'd be giving that up. There are several ways to get what you want/need without that.

i wouldn't do anything until you've had a holiday from work (you don't need to go away, you can just enjoy time with DD at home).

I think you should view some properties first and see if you really can downsize and also more importantly, downgrade, downsizing sounds great in principle but it’s not only about the size, it’s the quality and location of the home you will be moving to which will be significantly less than where you are now. I am going to downsize eventually but I won’t be downgrading as the property I want next will be just as expensive as the house I am in now, but it will be smaller as I want a particular location with an amazing view. I hope that makes sense!

Ok , so you're in a great place with probably 4 years of a 5 year fix left at around 2%.
Which means for 300k on 11 years term you're paying about 2.5k/month

your post-tax income is:
DH: 3k/month
you (assuming just into 6 figures): 5.5k
you if you go down to 3 days/week: 3.6k

So even if you do down to 3 days/week, you'll still have 4k/month income after mortgage. And they might well be willing for you to do that (or at least 4 days) rather than lose you. Especially if you spread it over 5 days, eg 9-3pm each day - which is probably what you want to maximise time with your daughter (no point in being off whilst she's at school)

You probably also have occupational pensions on top, but even without you can afford to be 3 days/week and still have enough disposable income to put a chunk into pension each month.

And you can afford to take unpaid parental leave over the holidays to have more time with your DD. You can ask for up to 4 weeks per year (per child), with a total of up to 18 weeks until your child is 18. It's a legal entitlement. They can ask you to take it at a different time, but they can't refuse. The only downside is that it's unpaid, but with your income (even on 3 days/week) you can afford it. Taking 4 weeks/year for the next few years will cost you a months salary. Counted across the year, and assuming you're down to 3 days/week that will cost you £300 per month.

So you can work 3 days per week + have an extra 4 weeks holiday with your daughter on top of annual leave, and still have a post-mortgage family income of 3.8k/month.

What am I missing here? Why do you feel you need to sell your house??

I was going to suggest asking the bank to move to interest-only for a year (which they'll probably do), invest that money and then spread it over the next few years to lower your mortgage payments without having to change your mortgage, but I can't see why you would need to.

What do you think is making you feel so anxious?

I think FFSwhatisthis is absolutely right. Stop and have a break. Let the stress calm down, and then think about it again.

From my experience when you start feeling like you do now the feeling never goes away.

We downsized in our late 40s and life has been so much more satisfying since.

In your position I would first work out what your ideal work life balance would be and consider whether it is possible in your current role. Could you do 3 shorter days a week (finishing at school pick up time) plus ask for additional leave without pay each year so you have more time off in school holidays. Then crunch the numbers on that. Or can you adjust your work hours so on the wfh days you start early and finish early while DH does the morning routine? I start at 6.30 on my wfh day so am done by the end of the school day.
Don’t forget that there are significant costs and stresses involved in moving.

You can also remove life stresses by hiring in help eg a cleaner and gardener.

I think the anxiety is around work, it's relentless and I don't know how much longer I want to do it. I don't mean not work I mean do something less.

We're not near a city and I don't want to travel again, couple of times a month is fine - but not regularly. So if I can keep on top of where I am then the risk of much lower income is possible and the financial
Impact of that.

Though a couple of you have enacted the conflict in my head really well! I should almost feel like I'm on a cushy number and bank roll it for another ten years. Others describe a calmer more family focussed life which is so appealing.

Yes I need a holiday. And I'm overeating making me feel shit.

My current plan was to not drop salary but finish work early twice a week for pick up and wrap up any work in the evening. I can up to get 6 weeks holiday so was planning 2 weeks parental leave in august (next year) to take a 3 week "long summer break" then be off almost every school holiday, bar one week I think.

The reason I wanted to avoid dropping salary is because loads of women work reduced hours but actually do the same amount of work and it's not fair. To almost push paying for the job to be done well, not how long it takes me to do it. I'm efficient and productive, I'm a strong leader. I'm known for high performing consistently. I've even won awards.

Sometimes I lack confidence in myself. And the pressure at work for the last 6 months has been really tough. And child literally only started sleeping through the night in February this year. I have felt broken, often.

You've all been really helpful I'm calming my mind, Thankyou.

And I think I should do 3 things:

1. Stick with my current plan for a year and see how flexible employer is willing to be, and maintain my boundaries
2. But review the mortgage payments versus pension payments plus tax relief opportunity as this could leverage medium term gains to reduce overall timeframes
3. Do the maths for my back pocket, if I really can't do the job anymore then get out, because the racing mind, insomnia and palpitations need to stop for good.

They have stopped, but came back this week after sleepless nights with sick dd and work pressure.

I think that's what drove me to drastic change is needed mindset.

Maybe 4 things - forward book a holiday.

your DD hasn't started school could you find a similar house in a different area,

We wouldn't really want to, we're settled in this town and have made good friends with kids going to the same school so it's a support network.

Should add we live far away from
Family so support is each other. Very good friends or paid help.

I think your issue is with work stress most of all. Just a warning that if you step back, go down the ladder it can be equally stressful with less autonomy and less pay. I would try to hang on till dd is in school and you know what that is like. Meanwhile take some leave.

Can I also say thanks for helping me work through this without anyone suggesting my dh needs to do step up or I should LTB

Employer doesn't know my plan yet re working pattern but I wasn't really going to ask permission as such just... lead into it and have a loose discussion that I'll need a bit more flexibility and this is my plan.

Very very true @StartupRepair

You’re the same age i started HRT for similar issues at work as perimenopause started its steely grip. It’s worth keeping an eye on your overall health and lifestyle as stress has a funny way of creeping up on you. I hope you can find a balance that works.

Glad you're working in through in your head, and figuring it out. I think sometimes stress can overwhelm us and take over every thought. And I understand the need to feel that you have a "way out" in your back pocket - somehow, knowing that there is a way out gives you the strength/stoicism to not need it.

I can understand your reasoning about not going part-time. I went down to 3 days after my DD was born, then back up to 4 then finally back to full time when she was older. And you're absolutely right that it's unfair - when I was part-time I was always doing at least one day more of productivity than I was paid for, since I'm effective and became even more so with reduced hours. BUT - I did find that moving from 4 days to 5 increased the stress I felt significantly. (3 to 4 much less so). Working 5 days, I always feel like I'm robbing Peter to pay Paul (2 hours for sports day means I work in the evening which means I sleep less and feel tired the next day). I'm a bit older than you though, and get tired! Whereas 4 days felt like although I was juggling, I had enough time to give to everything (including my own needs)

Not trying to persuade you to reduce hours (everyone needs to find their own balance) - but saying that if you do decide your job is too much (or ideally a bit before you reach that point!) you could try reducing days to see whether that makes enough difference to keep it. It might make more difference than you think.

For a change in working pattern rather than hours: good plan to present it to your company as what you need and intend to do, rather than ask! It's a huge advantage having a senior role!

And it would definitely make more sense to reduce days in your highly-paid job - even if you end up working more than you're paid for - than to quit it for a less well paid job!!

Sorry I know this is an old post but what did you end up doing @YoBeaches ?

We're in a similar predicament at the moment. I think we are going to do it.
We have an agent coming round so I guess it leans on this.

Some of the comments here are so true. I do feel burnt out (we have a holiday coming up so that should help). We both work 50+ hour weeks and we're tired. Kids are late teens.

The other side of the equation is costs. What can you reduce? For example, do you drive new cars on expensive leases. Can you reduce digital subscriptions. Can you save in food by changing supermarket.

Do you stop holidays abroad?

And could you accept these changes until the mortgage is paid in 11 years time?

My point is that if you reduce your income by reducing work to enjoy life, can you offset that in other ways?

😂 zombie thread, my advice may be too late!

What did you decide to do @YoBeaches ? I’m in a similar predicament: main earner, £200K plus still to pay on the mortgage, two teenagers. Just seen a semi-detached house that would suit but enable us to be mortgage free. Every Sunday night I think how great it would be to be retired, but I’m still only late 40s. I do like my job but I just don’t care enough about doing it for 46 weeks a year anymore. No expensive car leases, state schools, modest holidays, shop at Aldi. Any purchases already go through the lens of “do we really want this or would we prefer to stop working sooner”. Too many stories of people who didn’t make it to retirement or died soon afterwards, plus lots of ambition to do creative and musical things we’ve put on hold because of pressures of work and parenting.

Absolutely downsize now and take the opportunities while you can. We do not have a mortgage but made the decision to downsize and move to a new area for a complete lifestyle change. Since covid hit we have realised lots of the material things we craved brand new cars; designer clothes; designer watches we actually no longer wanted. We now crave the outdoor lifestyle and a stress free life.