Etsy forcing sellers into debt

lemmein · 2023-07-15T18:39:01+00:00

Has anyone heard about etsy reserves? Basically, etsy are withholding 75% of sellers funds putting a lot of sellers into debt/out of business as they struggle to pay for materials/postage upfront. Worst still, they take the fees from the remaining 25% which means sellers aren't receiving anything at all - infact sometimes you end up owing them when you receive an order [hmm] Etsy claims they're doing this to protect buyers, but they're doing it to shops that have been on etsy for years with zero issues. They refuse to tell individual shops why they've been put on reserve - the most frustrating company to deal with ever! I've been selling on Etsy for 5 years, never had an issue - over 2000 5* reviews, now I'm in reserve. Etsy claims they release the money once an order has been shipped, however this isn't always the case. I'll try and upload a particularly frustrating conversation I've had with their reps this week 🤯 The whole mess is particularly galling because Etsy's whole ethos is championing small businesses. Anyway, I just thought I'd share the story on here, if you could share on social media that would be fantastic. [[https://news.sky.com/story/they-are-holding-15-000-i-basically-cant-afford-food-etsy-sellers-claim-platform-is-imposing-75-reserves-on-their-sales-12921271 https://news.sky.com/story/they-are-holding-15-000-i-basically-cant-afford-food-etsy-sellers-claim-platform-is-imposing-75-reserves-on-their-sales-12921271]]

TolkiensFallow · 15/07/2023 19:43

This happed to my friend and she’s shut her Etsy store. They’ve got about £15k of hers

i feel like it’s a tax scam allowing Etsy to earn interest

OddBoots · 15/07/2023 19:46

That's awful, is there an alternative you'd recomend?

TenOhSeven · 15/07/2023 19:48

You're not being forced to sell on Etsy though. It's still a choice you're making. You could easily switch to Folksy/set up your own website/sell at markets.

Original poster

lemmein · 15/07/2023 19:50

TolkiensFallow · 15/07/2023 19:43

This happed to my friend and she’s shut her Etsy store. They’ve got about £15k of hers

i feel like it’s a tax scam allowing Etsy to earn interest

It's really shit. I've put mine on holiday mode - it's ridiculous that you start to dread getting orders because you end up owing them!

A lot of my customers pay for express international shipping which costs £32 a pop - I had 10 of them to cover upfront a few weeks ago 😫

I'm sorry about your friend. They really are the most frustrating people (bots!) to deal with, I don't blame her for dumping it!

OP posts:

Original poster

lemmein · 15/07/2023 19:53

TenOhSeven · 15/07/2023 19:48

You're not being forced to sell on Etsy though. It's still a choice you're making. You could easily switch to Folksy/set up your own website/sell at markets.

Not really the point though is it? I've spent 5 years building my shop up!

That's like saying to nurses 'pfft you don't have to work for the NHS - you're choosing to' 🙄

I have set up my own website - it still doesn't make it right what etsy is doing.

OP posts:

Namechange863625 · 15/07/2023 20:12

Are Etsy going bust? It seems the behaviour of a company that is going under. Get your money out and close your account with them.

RecycleMePlease · 15/07/2023 20:37

I won't use Etsy since I reported some horrifically misogynistic wares (against their policy - even forgetting sexism, advocating violence isn't allowed), and they didn't do anything.

It doesn't surprise me they're morally questionable in other way too.

TheBig4O · 15/07/2023 20:46

I hate Etsy. I had a customer request a refund for an item that had not arrived after 2 days! Etsy immediately issued the refund seconds after she requested it without giving me a chance to challenge it or provide proof of postage. The customer then received her item for free and I couldn't challenge it as 'case closed' apparently. Also, their customer service is some of the worst I've ever encountered.

Original poster

lemmein · 15/07/2023 21:00

TheBig4O · 15/07/2023 20:46

I hate Etsy. I had a customer request a refund for an item that had not arrived after 2 days! Etsy immediately issued the refund seconds after she requested it without giving me a chance to challenge it or provide proof of postage. The customer then received her item for free and I couldn't challenge it as 'case closed' apparently. Also, their customer service is some of the worst I've ever encountered.

Yeah I've had this happen too.

I had one customer claim their parcel hadn't arrived even though the gps tracked at her house and there was a delivery photo with her door open.

I even had pics of her baby wearing the item that she'd put as her profile pic on FB.

Etsy still refunded 🙄

OP posts:

Icecreamsundayz · 15/07/2023 21:18

So glad there is a thread on here! This happened to me just over a month ago and I couldn’t understand it at all. My shop has been going for years, with thousands of sales and 5* reviews. I’ve just had my second child and fortunately still have my main job but had planned to quit it within the next few months as my Etsy shop was going so well.

When the reserve was placed on me randomly last month (for the second time) I contacted them to ask them to remove it and pointed out my sales/reviews/length of time on there etc. They acted oblivious, said they’d look into it and just sent a general statement. I pointed out that I was relying on that money to actually live off of and would need to shut my shop if they were unable to allow me to have the money I had earned. They were so unhelpful and just said it would be removed after 90 days and couldn’t be removed once it was placed 🤔 Im now worrying that something is going on with them and they are maybe going bust or something. It’s also concerning to see that the government has no control over them so they could potentially keep my money and I might not have a leg to stand on to get it back 😬 Baffling that they can just do what they like with people’s money they have worked hard for! I don’t know whether to wait it out until the 90 days is up or start setting something up elsewhere/my own website. Really worried I build up more money on there and they don’t hand it over!

Icecreamsundayz · 15/07/2023 21:24

TheBig4O · 15/07/2023 20:46

I hate Etsy. I had a customer request a refund for an item that had not arrived after 2 days! Etsy immediately issued the refund seconds after she requested it without giving me a chance to challenge it or provide proof of postage. The customer then received her item for free and I couldn't challenge it as 'case closed' apparently. Also, their customer service is some of the worst I've ever encountered.

I’ve found this too! I generally have such lovely customers who send messages of how grateful they are etc when they receive their order but I had one who was just horrible. She was complaining about something that was so petty and clearly stated in my listing. She expected she’d get to keep the personalised item and receive a full refund 🤔 I presumed after a week she had moved on but no, in came the help request to Etsy and they instantly refunded her, making out I had done something wrong when I hadn’t in the slightest and she was just a total chancer 😩 made me sooo angry!

They also claimed they would cover refunds if it was covered by Etsy’s ‘buyer protection’ but when it came to it I was forced to cover refunds out my own pocket for a lot of stuff that didn’t turn up during the Christmas mail strikes, despite it having full tracking 🤦🏼‍♀️ Got nowhere with Royal Mail trying to get a refund and a lot of the stuff then turned up so late so I was left out of pocket, had lost stock and also covered postage myself!

HarridanHarvestingHeldaBeans · 15/07/2023 21:33

TenOhSeven · 15/07/2023 19:48

You're not being forced to sell on Etsy though. It's still a choice you're making. You could easily switch to Folksy/set up your own website/sell at markets.

Etsy has moved the goalposts. Sellers will have significant amounts of money that they can't access for whatever random period of time Etsy has decided. There should have been ample warning that this was going to happen, so that sellers were able to stop selling, if they needed to. Many businesses won't survive suddenly having all their cashflow cut off.

Amazon has always done this, but you know it's the deal when you sign up for a pro seller account (not every account gets a reserve, but you know that it can happen).

I have a largish shop (2k items, 36000 feedback) on eBay and was considering opening an Etsy store. There is no way I will do that now.

fetchacloth · 15/07/2023 21:42

Namechange863625 · 15/07/2023 20:12

Are Etsy going bust? It seems the behaviour of a company that is going under. Get your money out and close your account with them.

My first thought too.
Companies behave like this to build up a cash reserve to make it easier for them to borrow money, or reduce existing debt.
I would be very wary of dealing with a business that does this.🤔

Baldieheid · 15/07/2023 21:49

OddBoots · 15/07/2023 19:46

That's awful, is there an alternative you'd recomend?

Folksy.com

Much smaller as its only UK sellers, but no or very few "factory made stuff" sellers, and they get booted off. A mix of hobbyists and professional crofters and artists.

Justanotherlurker · 15/07/2023 23:00

It has been done to protect the consumer and it's brand, it has been overrun with people just 'upcycling' B&M glassware wrapped in cellophane with a few bags of sweets out of a multipack thrown in disguised as a Teachers present.

They are trying to go back to the ethos of the site and promote individual artists, not a generic selling an already completed cross stich with an added hobby craft bought frame. They have acknowledged consumer feedback is going down hill so have put tighter restrictions onto the sellers, this isn't a bad thing if you are a genuine artists, otherwise there is different avenues you can take to sell your artwork.

Don't see a problem with Etsy trying to re-assert it's ethos and ultimately implementing a customer focused, with the current world wide COL crisis of course sellers are going to have services increased.

The old adage of if a company can't afford to pay it's employees a decent living wage deserves to fail, also applies to all those wanting a quick side hustle.

JackalOnassis · 15/07/2023 23:09

Justanotherlurker · 15/07/2023 23:00

It has been done to protect the consumer and it's brand, it has been overrun with people just 'upcycling' B&M glassware wrapped in cellophane with a few bags of sweets out of a multipack thrown in disguised as a Teachers present.

They are trying to go back to the ethos of the site and promote individual artists, not a generic selling an already completed cross stich with an added hobby craft bought frame. They have acknowledged consumer feedback is going down hill so have put tighter restrictions onto the sellers, this isn't a bad thing if you are a genuine artists, otherwise there is different avenues you can take to sell your artwork.

Don't see a problem with Etsy trying to re-assert it's ethos and ultimately implementing a customer focused, with the current world wide COL crisis of course sellers are going to have services increased.

The old adage of if a company can't afford to pay it's employees a decent living wage deserves to fail, also applies to all those wanting a quick side hustle.

They've known for years about thousands of products that are just reselling mass-manufactured shite. If they want to "get back to the ethos" then step one is to remove those sales.
Holding legit sellers' cash in reserves doesn't achieve this.

waldpbal · 15/07/2023 23:31

Justanotherlurker · 15/07/2023 23:00

It has been done to protect the consumer and it's brand, it has been overrun with people just 'upcycling' B&M glassware wrapped in cellophane with a few bags of sweets out of a multipack thrown in disguised as a Teachers present.

They are trying to go back to the ethos of the site and promote individual artists, not a generic selling an already completed cross stich with an added hobby craft bought frame. They have acknowledged consumer feedback is going down hill so have put tighter restrictions onto the sellers, this isn't a bad thing if you are a genuine artists, otherwise there is different avenues you can take to sell your artwork.

Don't see a problem with Etsy trying to re-assert it's ethos and ultimately implementing a customer focused, with the current world wide COL crisis of course sellers are going to have services increased.

The old adage of if a company can't afford to pay it's employees a decent living wage deserves to fail, also applies to all those wanting a quick side hustle.

Bollocks

Baldieheid · 15/07/2023 23:59

They've allowed resellers and factory produced items a la Aliexpress for at least a decade. I left when they floated on the stock market, and the rules changed almost overnight. Still have a buying account but now, it's so hard to find the genuine handmade stuff amongst the chaff that I buy from folksy or notonthehighstreet.

wakeuporswim · 16/07/2023 00:26

A friend of mine had been considering setting up an Etsy shop! I'm going to send this thread to her.

Flopsythebunny · 16/07/2023 00:50

Justanotherlurker · 15/07/2023 23:00

It has been done to protect the consumer and it's brand, it has been overrun with people just 'upcycling' B&M glassware wrapped in cellophane with a few bags of sweets out of a multipack thrown in disguised as a Teachers present.

They are trying to go back to the ethos of the site and promote individual artists, not a generic selling an already completed cross stich with an added hobby craft bought frame. They have acknowledged consumer feedback is going down hill so have put tighter restrictions onto the sellers, this isn't a bad thing if you are a genuine artists, otherwise there is different avenues you can take to sell your artwork.

Don't see a problem with Etsy trying to re-assert it's ethos and ultimately implementing a customer focused, with the current world wide COL crisis of course sellers are going to have services increased.

The old adage of if a company can't afford to pay it's employees a decent living wage deserves to fail, also applies to all those wanting a quick side hustle.

No it hasn't. The imported tat and trademarked stuff is still there despite being reported. It's people who make genuine handmade stuff who are being put on reserve for no reason. Etsy has been having financial problems since their bank went under

wakeuporswim · 16/07/2023 00:54

"No it hasn't. The imported tat and trademarked stuff is still there despite being reported. It's people who make genuine handmade stuff who are being put on reserve for no reason. Etsy has been having financial problems since their bank went under"

That article linked in the OP showed a bit of a downturn didn't it.

I bought some of that imported tat by mistake a couple of years ago. It was jewellery photographed really well but the items received did not match. I didn't bother trying to return.

Finlesswonder · 16/07/2023 00:56

Last time I was on etsy looking for a gift I was gutted. There was about one actual maker for every ten identikit drop shippers

llangennith · 16/07/2023 06:22

It's all over the media in the last 24 hours. Tried to post a link from Sky news. There's a FB group called Etsy Reserve Strike you could join.

MaidOfSteel · 16/07/2023 06:51

I love buying handmade items, crafts etc so I love browsing Etsy. However, I'm aware that Etsy probably take a large chunk of every sale from sellers/makers and this really annoys me. Now to hear this has made it worse.

I didn't know about Folksy so will look there in future. Is it also worth asking sellers if they'd like to deal direct with me?

Baldieheid · 16/07/2023 08:02

Dealing direct is possible if you find work you love on Folksy but be aware that you won't have the buyer protections etc that Folksy provide if you go off piste.
If you know and trust a seller, as you've purchased from them before elsewhere, why not though?

Etsy forcing sellers into debt

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