York and racism - are stats being misused?

[cakeorwine]

You might have seen the report about York being a racist city. A group has the aim of making York an anti-racist city and has used ONS stats to make claims about York

News from Inclusive Equal Right UK — Inclusive Equal Rights (ieruk.org.uk)

From the paper:

"The population of York’s Black Asian and Minorised Ethnicity (BAME) population, grew to approximately 14%. That is, one in seven people, are from ethnic minorities (i.e., non-White British). "

According to the ONS data - if you do a really deep dive, you'll find that :

88.3 % are White British
4.6% are other white
0.4% are Roma or White Gypsy or White Irish Traveller
3% are Asian, Asian British or Asian Welsh
0.6% are Black, Black British, Black Welsh, Caribbean or African
2% are mixed or multiple ethnic groups
1% are other ethnic groups

I am not sure where they are getting the 14% from - and this statistic of 1 in 7 is used through the article as part of the evidence.

There is also talk on stop and search and disproportionality. However, there were a very small number of stop and searches which means the law of small numbers can affect results.

Unfortunately, this potential misuse of statistics has led to a distraction from the aims of the survey. York is a very white city and I have no doubt that racism exists here, as elsewhere. I am just not sure that using figures that are potentially misleading helps any cause.

You can read the report here. Census data is available from the ONS

30423+IERUK+Anti-Racism+Strategy+Document+WEB.pdf (squarespace.com)

Create a custom dataset - Office for National Statistics (ons.gov.uk)

[cakeorwine]

The law of small numbers

Law of Small Numbers (SOCIAL PSYCHOLOGY) - iResearchNet

[lokijet]

There have always been tensions in york with some far right groups celebrating the pogroms around castle museum

I was a student there and it was definitely more visible amd prevalent than in nearby leeds (which definetly had its own issues over the years)

[cakeorwine]

@lokijet

There have always been tensions in york with some far right groups celebrating the pogroms around castle museum

I was a student there and it was definitely more visible amd prevalent than in nearby leeds (which definetly had its own issues over the years)

I am just saying that it looks like the stats aren't correct.

88.3% white British
4.6% other white

I am not sure how they have got 14%

[PinkFrogss]

Your post is a bit confusing OP. You’ve given the link of where to get data from ONS but no explanation of exactly how you drilled down to the data, and the site isn’t the easiest to navigate if someone wanted to see for themselves.

[PinkFrogss]

And if you think BAME are an even smaller minority in York than what they have stated, does that not make the disproportionate stop and searches even more disproportionate (and therefore concerning)?

[Sharpkat]

I would be astonished if the 14% is correct. I live in York. It is very white. Never seen any racist behaviour. Do uni students count in the data? That would sway it massively.

[cakeorwine]

@PinkFrogss

Your post is a bit confusing OP. You’ve given the link of where to get data from ONS but no explanation of exactly how you drilled down to the data, and the site isn’t the easiest to navigate if someone wanted to see for themselves.

I took the age ranges and the detailed ethnic breakdown - 20 variables

Then used Power BI

[cakeorwine]

@PinkFrogss

And if you think BAME are an even smaller minority in York than what they have stated, does that not make the disproportionate stop and searches even more disproportionate (and therefore concerning)?

That's the law of small numbers. Drawing conclusions from small numbers.

[Sunsetandsunrise]

@Sharpkat

I would be astonished if the 14% is correct. I live in York. It is very white. Never seen any racist behaviour. Do uni students count in the data? That would sway it massively.

Are you Black or Asian? If You’re White then that’s irrelevant as it’s unlikely for you to have seen racism in a White City.

[PinkFrogss]

@cakeorwine

I took the age ranges and the detailed ethnic breakdown - 20 variables

Then used Power BI

Ahh that does sound rather complex. Perhaps it’s a query better suited to the organisation behind the plan than to MN?

[LadyKenya]

@Sunsetandsunrise

Are you Black or Asian? If You’re White then that’s irrelevant as it’s unlikely for you to have seen racism in a White City.

This. It is like a man saying that he has not seen any sexism.

[StColumbofNavron]

I agree with @Sunsetandsunrise - it was the first thing that occurred to me when I read that comment. The micro-aggressions of racism will pass most white people by. If someone was shouting racist abuse at someone or said ‘I’m not serving you because you are black’ of course you notice. Far less likely to notice, a security guard following you every time you go in a shop, people choosing to mispronounce your name because ‘it’s just too hard’.

[LadyKenya]

Exactly@StColumbofNavron . That is why I do not bother trying to explain things like that when someone is so adamant that they have not seen any racism. They do not experience it that is why!

[cakeorwine]

2 different data views
Depending on the data deep dive
I think they took BAME as anyone who was not White British

[cakeorwine]

@Sunsetandsunrise

Are you Black or Asian? If You’re White then that’s irrelevant as it’s unlikely for you to have seen racism in a White City.

Totally agree with that.

I am just talking about the numbers and the percentages. I have no doubt there is racism in the city.

They looked at proportion of staff etc in the Council, NHS etc - but again, using this statistic